Ask HN: Can we get rid of plastic?
3 comments
A definite YES.
Day-to-day tasks that, today, involve usage of plastic were possible even before its discovery and wide-spread use. Maybe, yes, plastics have made many things easier, but, if we can all come to the conclusion that plastics are more bad than good, then we can all get rid of it.
It is also likely that an alternative to plastic will come up one day(maybe it already exists). It is also likely that people figure out a way to effectively reuse used plastic(maybe it already exists). But, what about the harm that has already been done? For that, not only do we have to go out and collect thrown away plastic scrap but also figure out what to do with it. We also want people to properly segregate plastic wastes at their sources as well.
Day-to-day tasks that, today, involve usage of plastic were possible even before its discovery and wide-spread use. Maybe, yes, plastics have made many things easier, but, if we can all come to the conclusion that plastics are more bad than good, then we can all get rid of it.
It is also likely that an alternative to plastic will come up one day(maybe it already exists). It is also likely that people figure out a way to effectively reuse used plastic(maybe it already exists). But, what about the harm that has already been done? For that, not only do we have to go out and collect thrown away plastic scrap but also figure out what to do with it. We also want people to properly segregate plastic wastes at their sources as well.
What is your concern about plastics?
The one plastic that is an outright poison is PVC. Widespread use of PVC is why they stopped burning trash in most places: when it burns the HCl produced eats the incinerator from the inside out.
I live in a place has zero sort-recycling which is great environmentally for aluminum cans and the biaxial PETE soda bottle in the 1-liter, 2-liter, and other form compared to alternatives such as new materials, or recycled glass or paper. (Glass involves high temperatures but is not fast, paper fibers break down permanently from reuse.)
Our recyclables are a quality product that is usually in demand, but as a commodity there is always the problem that prices go up and down.
Even with electric cars, there will be demand for hydrocarbon fuels for air travel and other use. The chemistry of that is depressing for many reasons, largely that the reactions that break large chains down to methane or that build up huge chains (such as polyethylene plastic molecules) proceed very quickly under many conditions so to get medium-size chains you have to get conditions just so and that means low reaction rates and a very big machine to make a relatively small amount of fuel. It has trouble competing with $100/barrel oil even with the best coal, reprocessing plastic into hydrocarbons cannot win.
Disposing large quantities of plastic into megastructure landfills is a possible strategy for carbon storage if we were to remove it from the atmosphere. The main concept today is to capture CO2 and inject it into a saline aquifer which is probably safe but concerning enough and not available everywhere. There is a "CarbFix" process that involves injecting 10 parts water for every part CO2 that turns the CO2 to rock but that is a lot of water.
The one plastic that is an outright poison is PVC. Widespread use of PVC is why they stopped burning trash in most places: when it burns the HCl produced eats the incinerator from the inside out.
I live in a place has zero sort-recycling which is great environmentally for aluminum cans and the biaxial PETE soda bottle in the 1-liter, 2-liter, and other form compared to alternatives such as new materials, or recycled glass or paper. (Glass involves high temperatures but is not fast, paper fibers break down permanently from reuse.)
Our recyclables are a quality product that is usually in demand, but as a commodity there is always the problem that prices go up and down.
Even with electric cars, there will be demand for hydrocarbon fuels for air travel and other use. The chemistry of that is depressing for many reasons, largely that the reactions that break large chains down to methane or that build up huge chains (such as polyethylene plastic molecules) proceed very quickly under many conditions so to get medium-size chains you have to get conditions just so and that means low reaction rates and a very big machine to make a relatively small amount of fuel. It has trouble competing with $100/barrel oil even with the best coal, reprocessing plastic into hydrocarbons cannot win.
Disposing large quantities of plastic into megastructure landfills is a possible strategy for carbon storage if we were to remove it from the atmosphere. The main concept today is to capture CO2 and inject it into a saline aquifer which is probably safe but concerning enough and not available everywhere. There is a "CarbFix" process that involves injecting 10 parts water for every part CO2 that turns the CO2 to rock but that is a lot of water.
There are millions of applications with their own upsides and downsides. Focus on some of the ones with big downsides and easier replacements. Shopping bags, for example, would be easy. Car tires are hard. One thing that might help is to take money from the benefits and use it to offset the costs. Subsidize canvas bags. Tax car tires and use the money to research microplastic recovery tech like https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25246857
Where are we in recycling plastic? If somebody wants to do something to get rid of plastic from earth,what should they do?