Ask HN: Software engineer for 20 years what should I do next?
25 comments
Teaching was mentioned and is always great.
Or: You could build an app which does something useful for small businesses who can't afford and need full ERP systems.
Small businesses don't have a good process automation and stuff like "Scanning an document into a directory which triggers a python script which sends an email to someone" is a quick win.
There was a HN post about someone who built a simple invoicing app that she hosted on her own server, in the cloud or "on premise" on a raspberry pi. IIRC it was all open source and she made good money off of it.
To answer your question about creative content, the creative business is tough. It's kind of a winner-takes-all market. I am fairly creative myself and play a music instrument on semi pro level, but the competition is massive and some people have just godlike talent + years of skill honing and outshine everyone else. No one is going to buy your art if they can buy the art of someone who is doing the same thing as you but with better skills. And there's all the stuff about being dependent feom platforms such as youtube or steam who can cancel you or change revenue models... I wish you success, but I won't bet on it. It's about finding a niche and an audience and that takes years of eating the sh*t sandwich.
Or: You could build an app which does something useful for small businesses who can't afford and need full ERP systems.
Small businesses don't have a good process automation and stuff like "Scanning an document into a directory which triggers a python script which sends an email to someone" is a quick win.
There was a HN post about someone who built a simple invoicing app that she hosted on her own server, in the cloud or "on premise" on a raspberry pi. IIRC it was all open source and she made good money off of it.
To answer your question about creative content, the creative business is tough. It's kind of a winner-takes-all market. I am fairly creative myself and play a music instrument on semi pro level, but the competition is massive and some people have just godlike talent + years of skill honing and outshine everyone else. No one is going to buy your art if they can buy the art of someone who is doing the same thing as you but with better skills. And there's all the stuff about being dependent feom platforms such as youtube or steam who can cancel you or change revenue models... I wish you success, but I won't bet on it. It's about finding a niche and an audience and that takes years of eating the sh*t sandwich.
The problem is that small businesses that are ready to invest in any custom IT are very few and far between. People will literally spend hours every day doing menaial data processing instead of paying 50 dollars for an app that does the same work in minutes. You really need to focus on the sales aspect of the business and establish a very efficient lead pipeline, preferably one where you get recurring income from subscribers.
You won't be welcomed everywhere with open arms, sure.
Though I do know a few independent contractors who cater to small businesses and are doing fine, that's why I suggested the idea.
Though I do know a few independent contractors who cater to small businesses and are doing fine, that's why I suggested the idea.
Here is a list of things I have been doing from the time I left programming 2 years ago, roughly having worked for around 24 years. I was left with lots of time and didn't want to work only in one thing like programming before. So I got into small projects that meant something for me. Might be of help.
-- Learning music for last 4 years, mainly to get into a hobby. I put in about 1-2 hours of practice per day. Thinking of building a course for people with absolutely no prior knowledge of music, but I have not started yet. Have got a mindmap going here - https://www.viewpedia.org/musicCourse-map.png
-- Mentoring, at NYAS ((www.nyas.org) and invidiually. Perfect as it does not take too much time, but connects to lot of young minds. Hope to increase and maybe we should create a network of mentors as someone suggested being mentor in the comments. I have not found a mentor network yet.
-- Lokopakar (www.lokopakar.com) - for mentoring and another unique program called Strength Together, that is a peer-to-peer network to help adolescent girls in developing countries overcome their feeling of "I am not Enough"
-- Tinker Lab (www.tinker-lab.org) - I found a group of guys who were into breaking things apart and seeing what was inside and trying to put it back (never really making it). We are now working to make a lab for public schools in Nepal where young, eager, self learning students to do the same. The first lab is coming up within the month.
-- Farming, fruits for fun, vegetables commercially. Now thinking of adding bee keeping and a farm stay program. I spend only the weekends on it as others handle everyday work better than I.
-- Viewpedia (www.viewpedia.org) Still left with time as I gave up social media and most of TV. So learning about my own culture and building a website to provide collection of youtube videos of mostly unwritten Nepali culture. Currently focused on music and dance.
-- Learning music for last 4 years, mainly to get into a hobby. I put in about 1-2 hours of practice per day. Thinking of building a course for people with absolutely no prior knowledge of music, but I have not started yet. Have got a mindmap going here - https://www.viewpedia.org/musicCourse-map.png
-- Mentoring, at NYAS ((www.nyas.org) and invidiually. Perfect as it does not take too much time, but connects to lot of young minds. Hope to increase and maybe we should create a network of mentors as someone suggested being mentor in the comments. I have not found a mentor network yet.
-- Lokopakar (www.lokopakar.com) - for mentoring and another unique program called Strength Together, that is a peer-to-peer network to help adolescent girls in developing countries overcome their feeling of "I am not Enough"
-- Tinker Lab (www.tinker-lab.org) - I found a group of guys who were into breaking things apart and seeing what was inside and trying to put it back (never really making it). We are now working to make a lab for public schools in Nepal where young, eager, self learning students to do the same. The first lab is coming up within the month.
-- Farming, fruits for fun, vegetables commercially. Now thinking of adding bee keeping and a farm stay program. I spend only the weekends on it as others handle everyday work better than I.
-- Viewpedia (www.viewpedia.org) Still left with time as I gave up social media and most of TV. So learning about my own culture and building a website to provide collection of youtube videos of mostly unwritten Nepali culture. Currently focused on music and dance.
I am 32 and i feel like i will be in your position in a few years if not few months.
Because of this i started to develop some small mobile apps that is targeted to general public. These apps started to make some money. I Will develop a few more apps until i reach to a level that i can pay the bills. I also have some savings.
After that i plan to go on a sabbatical for at least a year. I plan to move to country side and only write code for the small updates i will make to these mobile apps.
I believe during this sabbatical i will find a lot of great business ideas.
Because of this i started to develop some small mobile apps that is targeted to general public. These apps started to make some money. I Will develop a few more apps until i reach to a level that i can pay the bills. I also have some savings.
After that i plan to go on a sabbatical for at least a year. I plan to move to country side and only write code for the small updates i will make to these mobile apps.
I believe during this sabbatical i will find a lot of great business ideas.
Are these apps you're releasing serving a niche audience, or a pretty general audience that is still finding enough downloads (like the common todo productivity apps).
I've come up with a few app ideas, but while I find them useful I'm not sure if they would appeal to enough people to be worth pursuing.
I've come up with a few app ideas, but while I find them useful I'm not sure if they would appeal to enough people to be worth pursuing.
I don't really have an answer but I am 40 and I feel the same. I am just senior dev in major tech giant, but work is boring and and unmotivating. I really enjoy programming and learning but I realized 10 years ago that working for someone else is not my thing. Here are few things I have tried but mostly failed at them or got bored:
1. Portrait Photography - lots of fun, you meet great people. Cons are that as an introvert, selling myself and then helping client pose during photoshoot was very draining. Then it was selling time for dollars, maybe one day you can charge $5000 per shoot but most likely you will not create decent wealth for your kids.
2. Real Estate Agent - again lots of fun exploring new places, and meeting great people. But unlikely photoshoots, buying home is very stressful, you will absorb client's stress, and of course so much paperwork and deadlines. I never got started properly. But helped a few friends and it was very stressful experience. Again introvert issues with selling myself to strangers.
Then I have had some ideas and tried/half-assed these:
1. Writing fiction - seems like a great idea but it is really hard to write.
2. Fitness blog/spam - I started with a blog sharing fitness tips and workout and motivational videos. Eventually, there was very little original content, it was just embedded YouTube/Instagram videos. It was generating lunch money with affiliate links and ads, but I felt sleazy, especially, when most of the content on the blog was girls in bikinis or yoga pants. (Men's videos were not that popular). As I got old, I didn't want to do this.
3. Tutoring for devs - Still working on this, started informally where I help my friends with the dev problems they are stuck at work. Working on getting paid clients. It is kind of hard because some people just want you to do their work and I don't want to do that. Then there is issue of security. I don't want to get in any trouble but looking at private code of some company.
4. Related to tutoring, I try to blog about every topic I help someone with. Not getting any traffic. Not sure how to compete with SO.
I am not really sure what my next steps should be, I have tried so many things, people don't really take me seriously anymore. I am really looking for something that I can do online without selling to friends and family. Makes me feel like the bad guy from the Founder.
1. Portrait Photography - lots of fun, you meet great people. Cons are that as an introvert, selling myself and then helping client pose during photoshoot was very draining. Then it was selling time for dollars, maybe one day you can charge $5000 per shoot but most likely you will not create decent wealth for your kids.
2. Real Estate Agent - again lots of fun exploring new places, and meeting great people. But unlikely photoshoots, buying home is very stressful, you will absorb client's stress, and of course so much paperwork and deadlines. I never got started properly. But helped a few friends and it was very stressful experience. Again introvert issues with selling myself to strangers.
Then I have had some ideas and tried/half-assed these:
1. Writing fiction - seems like a great idea but it is really hard to write.
2. Fitness blog/spam - I started with a blog sharing fitness tips and workout and motivational videos. Eventually, there was very little original content, it was just embedded YouTube/Instagram videos. It was generating lunch money with affiliate links and ads, but I felt sleazy, especially, when most of the content on the blog was girls in bikinis or yoga pants. (Men's videos were not that popular). As I got old, I didn't want to do this.
3. Tutoring for devs - Still working on this, started informally where I help my friends with the dev problems they are stuck at work. Working on getting paid clients. It is kind of hard because some people just want you to do their work and I don't want to do that. Then there is issue of security. I don't want to get in any trouble but looking at private code of some company.
4. Related to tutoring, I try to blog about every topic I help someone with. Not getting any traffic. Not sure how to compete with SO.
I am not really sure what my next steps should be, I have tried so many things, people don't really take me seriously anymore. I am really looking for something that I can do online without selling to friends and family. Makes me feel like the bad guy from the Founder.
It isn’t clear from this thread or your comment history on why you feel burnt out. All I can gather is:
* you don’t like your job
* you don’t want to be an employee
* you are a web developer technologist and open to continue working with those skills
Perhaps you could consider inventing a new technology/service for an existing business problem. This is the interest I am pursuing but I lack the business acumen to jump from software creation to market penetration.
* you don’t like your job
* you don’t want to be an employee
* you are a web developer technologist and open to continue working with those skills
Perhaps you could consider inventing a new technology/service for an existing business problem. This is the interest I am pursuing but I lack the business acumen to jump from software creation to market penetration.
Hmm perhaps it isn't in my comments... thought I had talked about it with this account. I was doing 60 to 80 hour work weeks until the last few months which turned into 100 hour work weeks (3am start time, phased sleep, working weekends).
This was all for a covid19 start up.
Perhaps you should use your experience to shift focus from writing/managing code to something completely different that leverages that experience: product management, marketing, sales and user engagement, or even something like CEO or COO.
If you don’t want to be an employee then you need to build a team.
If you don’t want to be an employee then you need to build a team.
Why don't you look for a job that is less stressful, perhaps at a more established company? You probably would have to work at a B-level company with a lower salary, but it might worth it for your sanity.
I don’t have any suggestions on revenue streams, but reading your post, I can already feel how burnt out you are. You need a serious break away from your computer to clear your mind. I recently picked up biking and it has done wonders to my mental health. Try and recover first before pursuing anything else. I have been there before as well.
I have the same reaction to the post. I do not feel he can determine a path until he resolves the burn out.
I rant into the same many years ago, pre family. My solution like yours was bicycle centric. I did a 2 month bike trip up the east coast US. Once hitting Maine I would take a bus for a while, and then ride a while. Really cleared my head and I was ready to get back into development. I would say I thought I was ready after hitting Maine, but the reality was I needed the 2, well more like 3 months break.
I rant into the same many years ago, pre family. My solution like yours was bicycle centric. I did a 2 month bike trip up the east coast US. Once hitting Maine I would take a bus for a while, and then ride a while. Really cleared my head and I was ready to get back into development. I would say I thought I was ready after hitting Maine, but the reality was I needed the 2, well more like 3 months break.
Thanks I think this is good advice. To clarify: I'm leaning towards indie game dev and contracting on the side for a while so I can find my balance again. I am very burned out. 100 hours per week and being involved directly with covid 19 testing took its toll.
Definitely get some rest and therapy before moving to a new venture.
For the next step it might be worth doing contract web dev as well as turning some of your comics into a product which can be sold on places like gumroad.
You could also start a youtube channel focused on your experience and tackle different niches in web development.
For the next step it might be worth doing contract web dev as well as turning some of your comics into a product which can be sold on places like gumroad.
You could also start a youtube channel focused on your experience and tackle different niches in web development.
Consider what I am considering: selling stuff on eBay / Amazon / shopify. If I am successful it’s bye bye to sprints, estimation and head scratching through legacy code and also needing to live in a city with the associated expense when there are cheap places to live with beaches!
This is an interesting idea. I don't want to just scrape by though, I'd like to use the skills I've acquired over the years to do something that doesn't involve being a full time employee for a company.
Yes it depends heavily on your preferences. I’m attracted to this idea as Im feeling fatigued with programming, it can scale well without even inventing or coding anything, and perhaps narcistically I believe if you throw a excoder/math person at the analysis of markets and profitability you’d get a massive advantage over a typical seller.
Content creation is hard and most ppl who try it because they feel like they enjoy it burn out really fast.
Make sure you really like what you are doing. Also it will take time before you make any money from it.
Make sure you really like what you are doing. Also it will take time before you make any money from it.
> burned out
Therapy first, and not from amateurs on the intertubes.
Therapy first, and not from amateurs on the intertubes.
Teach others everything you know. Mentor people.
I'd second teaching, potentially very rewarding and could make money if you do it right.
take a vacation, it may help you find a purpose
Woodwork
it's rough out there still for contractors. I quit my cush job at age 43, worked a few high paying short-term gigs. It was nice because I could make in 3 months what I normally would make in 6, but then the pandemic hit and it absolutely dried up. After a year of no offers, I finally got a fulltime offer for decent pay. I'm in the same boat. We're too old and too expensive now for web development.
I'm tired of being interviewed by kids who think React is how websites should be built and are half my age.
You were in leadership so I guess that took its toll on you. I'm a principal engineer now and so far I've just been improving the framework (vue) and optimizing performance.
I suspect that they will dump some huge feature on me soon and I'll be back to being a grunt.
I'm actually thinking of going back to school part time to become a financial advisor.
I'm tired of being interviewed by kids who think React is how websites should be built and are half my age.
You were in leadership so I guess that took its toll on you. I'm a principal engineer now and so far I've just been improving the framework (vue) and optimizing performance.
I suspect that they will dump some huge feature on me soon and I'll be back to being a grunt.
I'm actually thinking of going back to school part time to become a financial advisor.
I'm debt free, turning 40, and unsure what to do next. I want to avoid traditional work and concentrate on my own pursuits. I have put many years of effort into learning to build 2d and 3d games during my free time. I also enjoy drawing comics. I'm considering moving into content creation teamed up with my wife... maybe doing contract web dev work to avoid draining my savings.
I'd like to hear thoughts and suggestions for non traditional revenue streams / ways to live differently to make a more creation centric life for myself and my family. I really don't want to work for companies anymore if I can avoid it.