Xiaomi becomes number two smartphone vendor for first time ever in Q2 2021(canalys.com)
canalys.com
Xiaomi becomes number two smartphone vendor for first time ever in Q2 2021
https://www.canalys.com/newsroom/global-smartphone-market-q2-2021
181 comments
Most of the Xiaomi phones are supported by LineageOS. If you have an hour to spare, you can easily unlock the bootloader and install it to get a stock Android experience (even skip out Google Services if you want).
I have the Poco F1, cost me about $230 for SD845 + 8GB RAM + 4000mAh + 256GB storage. It's a pretty good deal after installing LineageOS on it.
I have the Poco F1, cost me about $230 for SD845 + 8GB RAM + 4000mAh + 256GB storage. It's a pretty good deal after installing LineageOS on it.
An hour to spare after waiting a week for Xiaomi to authorize unlocking of the bootloader. I bought a Poco X3 Pro yesterday, the phone is awesome for it's asking price (R$ 1800), but I'll keep using my current one (Redmi Note 4) until next week. Im not sure if I'm going to wipe it and install another ROM or just install root and use Titanium Backup to freeze most of Google and Xiaomi's stuff.
The downside is that you lose DRM-enabled content. For example, it's a hassle to use Netflix at 720p/1080p, and what's more important to my use case for example, is Spotify. It's _possible_ in theory, but it's extremely hacky.
I personally went the Google route w/ a Pixel 4a, so I get a simple, zero non-sense UI, with no forced ads or anything, just a smooth experience, at a slight premium (not that much to be completely fair ...)
I personally went the Google route w/ a Pixel 4a, so I get a simple, zero non-sense UI, with no forced ads or anything, just a smooth experience, at a slight premium (not that much to be completely fair ...)
I was happy with my Pixel 4A until I left it in my jacket pocket during heavy rain. The resulting humidity was enough to definitely kill it. I get that it has no IP rating at all so it's entirely my fault but still it's the first time this has ever happened to me in fifteen years of owning a mobile phone. The 4A is just extremely not waterproof.
After that, I'm never buying another cheap Pixel again.
After that, I'm never buying another cheap Pixel again.
> it has no IP rating at all
Just wtf. I had a $130 phone with Lineage die on me the same way recently. No IP on that machine, but if you pay for a Pixel you should definitely have it.
Just wtf. I had a $130 phone with Lineage die on me the same way recently. No IP on that machine, but if you pay for a Pixel you should definitely have it.
I have LineageOS on my Xiaomi phone and the only hassle is contactless payment. Spotify works fine and I did not try Netflix.
Try it, it works. Parent probably tried a very old version of LineageOS.
That is true. Can you please point me to a guide to get it working ? Thanks in advance !
Well, I installed it in a Samsung S10, but here is a guide for your phone:
https://wiki.lineageos.org/devices/sunfish/
https://wiki.lineageos.org/devices/sunfish/
And camera isn't that great anymore.. You can't use the drm drivers anymore.
Back when I last looked you had to register an account, use a Windows application and wait a few weeks before being allowed to unlock the phone. Has that been changed then?
The waiting is kinda random really. I didn't have to wait at all, as the unlock code was available instantly. Regarding the account, I just used a spare throwaway SIM and a Windows VM for that. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Though most of the brands (except Nokia and Samsung) seem to have pretty reasonable terms for unlocking the bootloader and aren't as ass-backwards as Xiaomi's.
Though most of the brands (except Nokia and Samsung) seem to have pretty reasonable terms for unlocking the bootloader and aren't as ass-backwards as Xiaomi's.
I'm using a Xiaomi Redmi Note 5 ('whyred') from 2019. The first thing I did was get that unlock code (it took ~3 days) and unlock it. For the latter I used MiUnlockTool [1], a Java program which ran OK on Linux - no Windows needed. The tools seems to work on more recent models from what I gather at the related XDA thread [2].
[1] https://xiaomitool.com/MiUnlockTool
[2] https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/tool-win-lin-mac-miunlock...
[1] https://xiaomitool.com/MiUnlockTool
[2] https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/tool-win-lin-mac-miunlock...
That's not required on A series phones, which ship with a mostly stock Android as opposed to the custom MIUI.
Windows application is still required, but loader unlock was granted instantly after creation of a new Xiaomi account last time I tried it (last Friday for Xiaomi Pocophone F1).
[deleted]
Wow, unlocking a Xperia is super easy.
I don't suppose any of them allow setting a custom root of trust though, right?
I haven't managed to find anything other than the Pixels that have it.
I haven't managed to find anything other than the Pixels that have it.
The Xiaomi Mi A2 supports relocking the bootloader with a custom key, but only on older versions of the bootloader (MIUI 9 / Android 8.1, or earlier):
https://gitlab.com/CalyxOS/calyxos/-/issues/88
https://review.calyxos.org/c/CalyxOS/calyxos.org/+/2904/4/pa...
Not sure about other Xiaomi phones.
https://gitlab.com/CalyxOS/calyxos/-/issues/88
https://review.calyxos.org/c/CalyxOS/calyxos.org/+/2904/4/pa...
Not sure about other Xiaomi phones.
Interesting. Thank you, I'll check it out.
Another manufacturer that supports relocking the bootloader with a custom key is OnePlus:
https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/guide-re-locking-the-boot...
None of the operating systems that are designed to be used with a relocked bootloader (e.g. CalyxOS, GrapheneOS, RattlesnakeOS) support OnePlus phones at the moment, so you'll need to build LineageOS, AOSP, or some other Android variant manually to use it on a OnePlus phone with a relocked bootloader.
There might be more device models with this kind of support. Search for "avb_custom_key" with the model name to see whether anyone has commented on this.
https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/guide-re-locking-the-boot...
None of the operating systems that are designed to be used with a relocked bootloader (e.g. CalyxOS, GrapheneOS, RattlesnakeOS) support OnePlus phones at the moment, so you'll need to build LineageOS, AOSP, or some other Android variant manually to use it on a OnePlus phone with a relocked bootloader.
There might be more device models with this kind of support. Search for "avb_custom_key" with the model name to see whether anyone has commented on this.
>The most annoying things are still Google and YouTube ToS accept dialogs I get all the time because I'm effectively using an incognito browser, and I'd get those on any phone.
You may be able to add a list to uBlock which blocks cookie popups.
https://www.i-dont-care-about-cookies.eu/
You may be able to add a list to uBlock which blocks cookie popups.
https://www.i-dont-care-about-cookies.eu/
Thanks! I didn't know about that one.
Sadly Firefox Focus on Android doesn't seem to support extensions or manually loading block lists, but as I do mainly browse from private mode on desktop as well, the extension will help there.
Sadly Firefox Focus on Android doesn't seem to support extensions or manually loading block lists, but as I do mainly browse from private mode on desktop as well, the extension will help there.
try unlocking the bootloader (annoying that you have to wait like other have noted) and use the MIUI EU distro. It's pretty much standard Android (might not even include gapps, I don't remember), plus the core MIUI and their international version of the apps (ones that don't link to Chinese online services). Best of both words.
For example I use their Music app for playing Youtube in the background without ads, I didn't even install the Youtube app.
For example I use their Music app for playing Youtube in the background without ads, I didn't even install the Youtube app.
Just got my hands in the 10T Lite 5G, it's a pretty good phone, must admit.
Toying with the xiaomi.eu rom until it's properly supported by Lineageos. The UI is growing on me, no adware that I can see and I have frozen most of the google apps.
The camera is mediocre, I am hoping for a gcam port.
The camera is mediocre, I am hoping for a gcam port.
Is it possible to easily install LineageOS and still have everything working ?
I'm running LineageOS on Mi 10T Pro and everything works fine, but it wasn't the case until a couple of weeks ago.
Xiaomi sells a few phones with the "Android One" label, meaning it's mostly standard Android and mine let me uninstall basically all the typical useless apps. Only the Play Store and one or two others can't be removed.
Not perfect and LineageOS would still be a bit better, but close enough for me. I don't enjoy using smartphones either way.
Not perfect and LineageOS would still be a bit better, but close enough for me. I don't enjoy using smartphones either way.
AFAIK Android One is barely supported at this point and phones are old. I used to be a supporter of Android One and bought two phones myself, but I wouldn't recommend it now. Google failed this program like it failed numerous programs before. The only reliable way to get standard android without unlocking and tinkering seems to be buying Google Pixel nowadays.
I bought a Nokia 3.4 released late last year. Cheap and Android One. Really great phone for the price point. I absolutely hate any manufacturer version of Android. Pixel is great, but only occasionally is a cheaper model available. I break and lose phones so I buy functional but cheaper (buying second hand is risky). https://www.gsmarena.com/nokia_3_4-10404.php
I previously had a different Android One Nokia Phone which was great and well supported.
I previously had a different Android One Nokia Phone which was great and well supported.
Nokia is close to stock to the Pixel https://dontkillmyapp.com/
AFAIK you won't get proper camera support. For example my Poco F1 has two cameras on the back, but with LineageOS only one is used.
Whether everything works ends up depending a bit on how you use your phone.
Whether everything works ends up depending a bit on how you use your phone.
Their software wasn't always this bad.
I had an Mi3 and I thought the UI was better that what stock Android was offering at that time. But overtime they kept adding more and more crapware.
I had an Mi3 and I thought the UI was better that what stock Android was offering at that time. But overtime they kept adding more and more crapware.
Xiaomi is able to make their phones so cheap by making their software as crappy as possible. They collect a lot of data (yes, their calculator app has a privacy policy) and sometimes show ads. You need a Xiaomi account to enable debugging (adb).
Though they're still immensely popular here in Russia.
Though they're still immensely popular here in Russia.
> You need a Xiaomi account to enable debugging (adb).
Just unlock and root the thing as soon as you get it and Xiaomi will not get any data - either put LineageOS on it or de-fang MIUI by removing the nasty bits. Don't use the phone with a logged-in Mi account, the only valid reason for using the Mi account is to get the unlock code. Once unlocked and rooted you can remove nearly all the Mi-account-related parts from the phone as well as the ad-related APKs. If you happen to disable debugging over USB (adb) you can re-enable it without using a Mi account (in a terminal, use root):
...or just install LineageOS and be done with it, you'll probably end up doing this anyway so why wait?
Just unlock and root the thing as soon as you get it and Xiaomi will not get any data - either put LineageOS on it or de-fang MIUI by removing the nasty bits. Don't use the phone with a logged-in Mi account, the only valid reason for using the Mi account is to get the unlock code. Once unlocked and rooted you can remove nearly all the Mi-account-related parts from the phone as well as the ad-related APKs. If you happen to disable debugging over USB (adb) you can re-enable it without using a Mi account (in a terminal, use root):
setprop persist.security.adbinput 1
setprop persist.security.adbinstall 1
...or just install LineageOS and be done with it, you'll probably end up doing this anyway so why wait?
It doesn't help if you're an app developer. All you can do is to keep hacking around Xiaomi's bugs because the users sure won't install LineageOS. The part about preventing adb is just icing on the cake. The nice part is that unlike with Samsung, the users know that they're buying crap and often don't really expect apps to work.
In my experience they do expect them to work and complain the loudest. And then there's Meizu. No idea what it's like now, but ~5 years ago they meddled with the system framework enough to make my app crash. We had to buy one of those phones and I then decompiled their POS ROM to work around this madness. I had to ask myself "how on earth did this pass Google's CTS" multiple times, and the answer apparently was "it never did".
I hadn't even heard about Meizu before. Just the ad copy "Better Android Experience" sounds like it's going to be non-standard in everything it does.
If you have root, you could as well remount /system read-write and delete that "security center" crap altogether.
All their apps are privacy nightmares. I have a MI Note 4 and MIUI is still buttery smooth after all these years. Before this I used to have Samsung's flagship phones. The UI got laggy and slow after a few years. Compared to that MIUI is nice.
Even with Android One phones?
Their sourcing and labor practices possibly save a dollar or two
https://knowthechain.org/wp-content/uploads/2020_KTC_ICT_Sco...
https://knowthechain.org/wp-content/uploads/2020_KTC_ICT_Sco...
That seems to be an empty report.
"engaged with knowthechain: No"
So, basically they got no data, and had to assume the worst.
I'm sympathetic with Knowthechain: they don't have an easy job, they have to be able to reach out to any company in the world and get an answer...
But I also think that this doesn't mean much.
"engaged with knowthechain: No"
So, basically they got no data, and had to assume the worst.
I'm sympathetic with Knowthechain: they don't have an easy job, they have to be able to reach out to any company in the world and get an answer...
But I also think that this doesn't mean much.
I'm honestly confused why you linked a data sheet that practically has no data.
This is a list of brand market shares, incorrectly labeled as vendor market shares.
The largest smartphone vendor is BBK Electronics. They manufacture multiple brands like Oppo, Vivo, OnePlus, Realme, iQOO. Their brands have over 40% market share in China, India, over 50% in Southeast Asia, and are generally the largest vendor all over the developing world.
The real list is
The largest smartphone vendor is BBK Electronics. They manufacture multiple brands like Oppo, Vivo, OnePlus, Realme, iQOO. Their brands have over 40% market share in China, India, over 50% in Southeast Asia, and are generally the largest vendor all over the developing world.
The real list is
1. 24% BBK Electronics
(10% Oppo, 10% Vivo, 4% Realme)
2. 19% Samsung
3. 17% Xiaomi
4. 14% Apple
5. 4% Huawei
I read mobile industry mania's blogpost written in Japanese, it argues that OPPO was delivered from BBK but there are no capital relationship between BBK Communication Technology and OPPO(Guangdong Oujia Holdings). It also refers Nikkei's article confirmed that. http://blogofmobile.com/article/121143
I searched and it seems true. https://www.qichamao.com/orgcompany/searchitemdtl/e6f25044f9... https://www.aitouyan.com/news/7877.html
(read via translate!)
I searched and it seems true. https://www.qichamao.com/orgcompany/searchitemdtl/e6f25044f9... https://www.aitouyan.com/news/7877.html
(read via translate!)
It's really confusing because so many Wikipedia and Media Articles write that Oppo is a Subsidiary of BBK...
I wish English writer investigate about this topic
They are not, in the straight sense of Subsidiary.
>A subsidiary, subsidiary company or daughter company is a company owned or controlled by another company,
Hence that is why using BBK as one would have been wrong. BBK does not own majority of shares, nor de jure voting power. But in a complex power relationship BBK do have much higher leverage or with other investor de facto voting power. Think if Foxconn decided to invest into 5 different Phone making companies, ( Like the current Nokia Smartphone ) and Foxconn is a shareholder and provide technical and manufacturing consultancy, you would not list them all under Foxconn right?
I wont blame the English main stream media most of them are so late to anything from Japan and China it is borderline comical.
I mean when I first mentioned BBK in 2015 no one had a clue what I was talking about. My earliest comment on BBK on HN was from Jan 2018 [1]. Barely anyone knew BBK then. As a matter of fact even right now not that many have heard of BBK.
[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16265008
>A subsidiary, subsidiary company or daughter company is a company owned or controlled by another company,
Hence that is why using BBK as one would have been wrong. BBK does not own majority of shares, nor de jure voting power. But in a complex power relationship BBK do have much higher leverage or with other investor de facto voting power. Think if Foxconn decided to invest into 5 different Phone making companies, ( Like the current Nokia Smartphone ) and Foxconn is a shareholder and provide technical and manufacturing consultancy, you would not list them all under Foxconn right?
I wont blame the English main stream media most of them are so late to anything from Japan and China it is borderline comical.
I mean when I first mentioned BBK in 2015 no one had a clue what I was talking about. My earliest comment on BBK on HN was from Jan 2018 [1]. Barely anyone knew BBK then. As a matter of fact even right now not that many have heard of BBK.
[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16265008
That seems unlikely considering the hardware similarities between OPPO, Vivo and OnePlus phones.
There are no doubt about similarity of OPPO, OnePlus, and realme since they are under OPPO. Just curious how vivo similar?
But BBK Electronics is a private company while Xiaomi is a public traded company - so this news article is in favor of speculators / shareholders of Xiaomi.
You can always try to display the statistics in your favor...
It should also be noted that Canalys lists Xiaomi as one of their clients - so, one could argue that Canalys has a conflict of interest.
You can always try to display the statistics in your favor...
It should also be noted that Canalys lists Xiaomi as one of their clients - so, one could argue that Canalys has a conflict of interest.
Surprise, Xiaomi even contracted engineering, and manufacturing to BBK at some point.
In addition to their brand (of which few more are not counted above,) BBK still manufactures unbranded white box OEM goods
In addition to their brand (of which few more are not counted above,) BBK still manufactures unbranded white box OEM goods
It does not matter. Shareholders must take into account private competitors.
This article was labeled wrong and missed the biggest company.
This article was labeled wrong and missed the biggest company.
I just wanted to describe that Canalys might know that BBK Electronics is bigger but wanted to display another picture to the world because of their own interest.
Xiaomi pays the bills of their employees, BBK doesn't.
Xiaomi pays the bills of their employees, BBK doesn't.
Shouldn't Apple be under Foxconn by that logic?
They're flooding the market with good, very very cheap smartphones - it's no surprise.
Especially for older people that don't need $500+ flagships, a $150 Xiaomi is more than sufficient. I see them a lot nowadays.
Makes me wonder if it's sustainable.
Especially for older people that don't need $500+ flagships, a $150 Xiaomi is more than sufficient. I see them a lot nowadays.
Makes me wonder if it's sustainable.
>Makes me wonder if it's sustainable.
While there are some suspicious of doggy accounting practice and also political investment, Xiaomi is actually a company listed in HKSE 1810.HK [1] with positive cash flow and operating income. Currently valued at around ~$90B USD.
Their phone are at a very low gross margin but their other products, or they call it the Xiaomi ecosystem is quite profitable. ( Comparatively Speaking ). And of course they earn most of their profits from selling Data and Ads. Which to be fair is similar to Google. ( Cough on the surface because we dont know how those Data are used Cough )
So to answer your question, it is sustainable. And they benefited most from the Huawei incident.
[1] https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/1810.HK?p=1810.HK&.tsrc=fin-...
While there are some suspicious of doggy accounting practice and also political investment, Xiaomi is actually a company listed in HKSE 1810.HK [1] with positive cash flow and operating income. Currently valued at around ~$90B USD.
Their phone are at a very low gross margin but their other products, or they call it the Xiaomi ecosystem is quite profitable. ( Comparatively Speaking ). And of course they earn most of their profits from selling Data and Ads. Which to be fair is similar to Google. ( Cough on the surface because we dont know how those Data are used Cough )
So to answer your question, it is sustainable. And they benefited most from the Huawei incident.
[1] https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/1810.HK?p=1810.HK&.tsrc=fin-...
Considering their data collection capabilities, I d say they are sustainable...
I'm running Netguard (app) as a firewall on them, set to block all traffic and then allow traffic only for solid apps where I need/want traffic to happen. Works like a charm, can even log in pcap format to analyze traffic.
Wouldn't the hardware vendor of the device be able to bypass that?
From a quick look, yes they would and the NetGuard FAQ on GitHub explicitly acknowledges that: https://github.com/M66B/NetGuard/blob/master/FAQ.md#user-con...
That doesn't mean this is a worthless thing to run. Unless you are being specifically targeted, security measures that simply put you outside the main herd can still be effective.
That doesn't mean this is a worthless thing to run. Unless you are being specifically targeted, security measures that simply put you outside the main herd can still be effective.
Both the hardware vendor and the vendor of the mobile phone's "black box" talking to your telecom could, of course. Potentially some chips inside could do nasty things, even if you'd install LineageOS for example.
Exactly. Considering how Samsung is coming out with cheaper phones these days due to competition, I don't think it's worth completely yeeting one's privacy out the window, even if the Xiaomi models have better specs. I know Android phones are still big Google spying devices, but given the state of the tech world, I'd prefer to have Google spy on me than a shadowy Chinese company.
Does it really matter if it has 4x the cameras of a cheap Samsung if it sends all the photos to some server in China on the sneak?
Does it really matter if it has 4x the cameras of a cheap Samsung if it sends all the photos to some server in China on the sneak?
It's interesting, because coming from a country that's been targeted by US interventionism in the past, I'm pretty ok with Xiaomi spying on me, not so much when it comes to Google.
I'm not too happy about anyone spying on me, and I'm also unhappy about corporations vetoing software I want to install.
Besides, one person's "targeted by interventionism" is another person's "liberated by democratic forces".
Besides, one person's "targeted by interventionism" is another person's "liberated by democratic forces".
Sure we were liberated by having a military junta take power for 21 years. Civil liberties vanished and people were secretly disappeared. Great democratic liberation!
I certainly don't claim that every intervention is liberation. My point is precisely that it's not that simple. It can be either or both at the same time for different people in different conflicts.
My point is that there's no such a thing as "liberation", since interventions are known to be used as a pretext to project power. Calling it "liberation" is an euphemism for what it really is. No nation should meddle in other's internal affairs.
I strongly disagree with that. In my opinion, the sovereignty of nation states does not have priority over all other concerns under all circumstances. But this is certainly a very complex issue.
And that's why countries have armies. Sovereignty is not a right that is granted by the UN Security council it's taken and held by military force.
> Besides, one person's "targeted by interventionism" is another person's "liberated by democratic forces".
Does newspeaking it make it better?
And if one would look at the examples of "liberation by democratic forces" over the last decades I feel that it is somewhat difficult to find an instance that wasn't a prime example of securing natural ressources or ensuring of keeping the global power structure intact.
I might be naive (or even contrarian to the US policy) bbut wwere aare tthe purely humanistic examples of Uncle Sam mingling in foreign affairs?
Imho the US should keep their fingers out of others' proverbial cookie jars.
Does newspeaking it make it better?
And if one would look at the examples of "liberation by democratic forces" over the last decades I feel that it is somewhat difficult to find an instance that wasn't a prime example of securing natural ressources or ensuring of keeping the global power structure intact.
I might be naive (or even contrarian to the US policy) bbut wwere aare tthe purely humanistic examples of Uncle Sam mingling in foreign affairs?
Imho the US should keep their fingers out of others' proverbial cookie jars.
>Does newspeaking it make it better?
The difference in language is often just political rhetoric. The difference in substance became very clear to me talking to my grandfather who was liberated by democratic forces and would have been insulted by having that called "targeted by US interventionism".
There are good reasons for both sentiments based on actual, sometimes painful, experience. We should respect that.
It's a very complex and off-topic subject. That's why I'm not going into the details of the various conflicts in recent decades.
The difference in language is often just political rhetoric. The difference in substance became very clear to me talking to my grandfather who was liberated by democratic forces and would have been insulted by having that called "targeted by US interventionism".
There are good reasons for both sentiments based on actual, sometimes painful, experience. We should respect that.
It's a very complex and off-topic subject. That's why I'm not going into the details of the various conflicts in recent decades.
I am not denying that there are examples of democratic liberation. Especially from history. Take the Yugoslavia conflict. Intervention by an international force there was at the time probably the lesser evil. It stopped genocide (a great plus in my book) while at the same time generating hatred that created terrorism (a big minus).
There are no easy answers.
But most current interventions as well as many historic ones were not motivated by ulterior motives but by economic ones and questions of power.
Coming from Germany and having studied history I must ask myself when did liberation turn to intervention because of political or economical gains? While keeping the rhetoric more or less the same.
There is imho a difference between WW II or Yugoslavia and Kuwait. Or Irak. Or even Afghanistan. Or Serbia. Or different South American states were intervention is often less militaristic.
I feel we need to have a way to differentiate and look closer to be able to discuss without falling back to ideology or "party lines".
There are no easy answers.
But most current interventions as well as many historic ones were not motivated by ulterior motives but by economic ones and questions of power.
Coming from Germany and having studied history I must ask myself when did liberation turn to intervention because of political or economical gains? While keeping the rhetoric more or less the same.
There is imho a difference between WW II or Yugoslavia and Kuwait. Or Irak. Or even Afghanistan. Or Serbia. Or different South American states were intervention is often less militaristic.
I feel we need to have a way to differentiate and look closer to be able to discuss without falling back to ideology or "party lines".
I agree completely. My intention wasn't to toe any party line. On the contrary, I think the history of many conflicts is so ugly and complex that people can legitimately feel very differently about the same event.
I can't even begin to imagine how various groups of people (ethnic groups, women, young men, ...) or individuals in Afghanistan may feel about the various interventions during the past half century.
I can't even begin to imagine how various groups of people (ethnic groups, women, young men, ...) or individuals in Afghanistan may feel about the various interventions during the past half century.
Just slap Blokada on it. Personally I don't give a shit about privacy since I never see any advertising.
What use is it if a company knows everything about me when they can't use that information to sell me things?
What use is it if a company knows everything about me when they can't use that information to sell me things?
Just install LineageOS on it and have nobody spy on you: https://wiki.lineageos.org/devices/#xiaomi
How does LineageOS stop the "little black box" which handles GSM/UTMS/etc traffic from spying on you? Or your telecom provider from tracking you?
Don't get me wrong, I like these free OS versions, but while I could teach my wife, my mother in law etc to manage Netguard, I couldn't teach them to handle Lineage, f-Droid all by themselves.
Don't get me wrong, I like these free OS versions, but while I could teach my wife, my mother in law etc to manage Netguard, I couldn't teach them to handle Lineage, f-Droid all by themselves.
Just install ANOM
or Telegram
Or Signal
And have nobody spy on you
"Trust me, I'm Italian."
or Telegram
Or Signal
And have nobody spy on you
"Trust me, I'm Italian."
>Makes me wonder if it's sustainable.
The pricing is now norm in Asia for last several years. In fact Xiaomi is not #1 in terms of quality or value for money. It's Oppo/Realme/OnePlus (all are same hardware). They do not have ads like Xiaomi and pretty much retail for the same price and ship millions of hardware. The quality is definitely higher with Oppo/Realme (budget options) having same quality as Oneplus (premium).
The pricing is now norm in Asia for last several years. In fact Xiaomi is not #1 in terms of quality or value for money. It's Oppo/Realme/OnePlus (all are same hardware). They do not have ads like Xiaomi and pretty much retail for the same price and ship millions of hardware. The quality is definitely higher with Oppo/Realme (budget options) having same quality as Oneplus (premium).
Doesn't Oneplus have better software? Oppo is not popular in EU.
OxygenOS (OnePlus) and ColorOS (Oppo) will soon share the same codebase.
https://9to5google.com/2021/07/02/oneplus-android-update-sch...
https://9to5google.com/2021/07/02/oneplus-android-update-sch...
I see, Realme/Oppo is not popular yet but is miles ahead of Xiaomi. Its almost as good as Samsung in terms of durability and much better in terms of quality of underlying components (vs value). Its pretty much a budget OnePlus.
> Especially for older people that don't need $500+ flagships, a $150 Xiaomi is more than sufficient
Let me rephrase that for you: Especially for people who realise they don't need $500+ flagships, a $150 Xiaomi is more than sufficient.
It has nothing whatsoever to do with age, my 16yo daughter is more than satisfied with her Redmi Note 5 - she wanted one when she saw mine. Good battery life, good screen, more than fast enough and plenty of memory, 3.5mm jack, can take an SD card. Show me the "flagship" phone which offers this combination.
Phones have been fast enough for years now, screens, memory and storage have been big enough. Add LineageOS and you have a device which can easily last for 6 years, longer when you change the battery. I'm using a Samsung SIIIneo from 2014 with LineageOS 17.1 (Android 10) as a second device, it receives weekly OTA updates (which I generally do not install, but still - they're there). With a new battery it lasts for 2-3 days between charges when used for audio streaming through bluetooth or the speaker.
Let me rephrase that for you: Especially for people who realise they don't need $500+ flagships, a $150 Xiaomi is more than sufficient.
It has nothing whatsoever to do with age, my 16yo daughter is more than satisfied with her Redmi Note 5 - she wanted one when she saw mine. Good battery life, good screen, more than fast enough and plenty of memory, 3.5mm jack, can take an SD card. Show me the "flagship" phone which offers this combination.
Phones have been fast enough for years now, screens, memory and storage have been big enough. Add LineageOS and you have a device which can easily last for 6 years, longer when you change the battery. I'm using a Samsung SIIIneo from 2014 with LineageOS 17.1 (Android 10) as a second device, it receives weekly OTA updates (which I generally do not install, but still - they're there). With a new battery it lasts for 2-3 days between charges when used for audio streaming through bluetooth or the speaker.
I like that my Xiaomi Max 2 from 2017 has a 3.5mm jack, can take an SD card, AND has an infrared port (and so works as a remote for my TV and DVD player).
Xiaomi, if you're listening, please continue to make at least one line of phone that has these features.
Xiaomi, if you're listening, please continue to make at least one line of phone that has these features.
Why shouldn't it be sustainable?
The market for cheap phones is much bigger than for the expensive ones and as you see from the Apple numbers: the expensive market is pretty much covered. Also covered in an separate environment form where those users are reluctant to switch because it's hard to learn again.
imho I think that fighting for the low budget Android market makes much more sense than for the high price Apple audience as "Apple" has become the "I can afford it"-message of prestige this group is looking for and therefore won't be replaced by anything else. Even if you buy the most expensive Samsung, you'd have to explain how expensive it was first to your audience. There is no need with Apple. Everybody knows you've spend a lot of money on it.
The market for cheap phones is much bigger than for the expensive ones and as you see from the Apple numbers: the expensive market is pretty much covered. Also covered in an separate environment form where those users are reluctant to switch because it's hard to learn again.
imho I think that fighting for the low budget Android market makes much more sense than for the high price Apple audience as "Apple" has become the "I can afford it"-message of prestige this group is looking for and therefore won't be replaced by anything else. Even if you buy the most expensive Samsung, you'd have to explain how expensive it was first to your audience. There is no need with Apple. Everybody knows you've spend a lot of money on it.
Jio is doing the same gameplan in India, and that’s already proven successful as far as I can tell.
I think it’s sustainable considering the vast majority of the world can’t afford an iPhone or even a Samsung, so there’s a large market. Also, once someone has a phone that can run a web browser, have a camera, and use messaging apps, then that’s basically set for this target market.
I think it’s sustainable considering the vast majority of the world can’t afford an iPhone or even a Samsung, so there’s a large market. Also, once someone has a phone that can run a web browser, have a camera, and use messaging apps, then that’s basically set for this target market.
If you want a sub $200 Apple product you can go down the refurb route. I’m having an outstanding experience with a refurb iPhone 8.
Seconded. I did this first with a first gen iPhone SE that I got for $100 on ebay from a seller with good reputation as a trial.
Been happy enough, so I bought a like new second gen iPhone SE for $250.
Been happy enough, so I bought a like new second gen iPhone SE for $250.
Where to get it somewhere with good reputation?
Amazon has a one-year guarantee reseller program, at least here in Europe. It consists of third-party sellers and you can further drill down to check their reputation. I’ve been lucky thus far and would’ve probably persevered even if I had gotten a lemon - I would’ve simply returned it for a new one, maybe from a different seller.
I've had good experience with: (they're a French unicorn)
https://www.backmarket.com/
There are others:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2019/04/12/not-all...
https://www.backmarket.com/
There are others:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2019/04/12/not-all...
> Especially for older people that don't need $500+ flagships
I am not so old, and I also have enough with a cheap smartphone. I just use mail, instant messaging, maps and government and bank apps. None of these need advanced graphics or fast CPUs. Interestingly I need access to Google Play as many official apps from the government are not available in alternative stores.
Said that, I got a Xiaomi cheap tablet and I had a bad experience as it was full of ad-ware and I was not able to install Google Play. The lack of official apps in the Xiaomi app store is not really their fault, but all the ad-ware is, I suspect, why the tablet was so extremely cheap. So, good enough hardware specifications, but somewhat disappointed at the software part.
I am not so old, and I also have enough with a cheap smartphone. I just use mail, instant messaging, maps and government and bank apps. None of these need advanced graphics or fast CPUs. Interestingly I need access to Google Play as many official apps from the government are not available in alternative stores.
Said that, I got a Xiaomi cheap tablet and I had a bad experience as it was full of ad-ware and I was not able to install Google Play. The lack of official apps in the Xiaomi app store is not really their fault, but all the ad-ware is, I suspect, why the tablet was so extremely cheap. So, good enough hardware specifications, but somewhat disappointed at the software part.
I believe they won't sell device without Google outside China. Don't buy devices for Chinese market unless you're going to modify it!
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Never mind "older people", some Xiaomi devices have the same performance as flagships costing twice as much.
I have a Xiaomi Mi 9 SE (had it almost 2 years now), and it's the best phone I've ever owned. Previously I'd owned flagship Samsungs and an iPhone 6.
It's powerful, the display is excellent, the battery lasts 2 days even with plenty use (unusual these days!), the cameras are excellent, and the device itself looks great. Oh, and it cost £340 at a time when flagship equivalents were around twice that - amazing value for money.
Service is great too - the phone stopped charging at some point, but it was fixed within a few days of initial contact, with no quibbling.
My only gripe is the lack of a 3.5mm headphone jack, but that's hardly a unique issue.
I have a Xiaomi Mi 9 SE (had it almost 2 years now), and it's the best phone I've ever owned. Previously I'd owned flagship Samsungs and an iPhone 6.
It's powerful, the display is excellent, the battery lasts 2 days even with plenty use (unusual these days!), the cameras are excellent, and the device itself looks great. Oh, and it cost £340 at a time when flagship equivalents were around twice that - amazing value for money.
Service is great too - the phone stopped charging at some point, but it was fixed within a few days of initial contact, with no quibbling.
My only gripe is the lack of a 3.5mm headphone jack, but that's hardly a unique issue.
How can it really be that much better than a flagship iPhone?
This kind of reads like your a person who hates the price of iPhones? Either that or I read like an Apple fan boy; However, I'm a pretty keen Linux / PC user and I don't think I'm that bias?
This kind of reads like your a person who hates the price of iPhones? Either that or I read like an Apple fan boy; However, I'm a pretty keen Linux / PC user and I don't think I'm that bias?
It is sort of like, Yes and No it depends.
There are reasons why things are little bit more expensive to make. And those add up quickly. The flexible OLED panel is more than double the BOM cost of rigid OLED even at the scale of Apple. For Apple that is ~$150+ of RSP increase form a single component. It is not only just being rigid, but they are also a higher quality panel. People often only look at "spec" on the surface without actually going it into details. Add up the cost of iOS ( $10 on accounting basis or $30 for RSP ), Face ID etc you are looking at $200 RSP extra already without going into any many other differences. Of course the main thing being Apple has a gross product margin of 60% compared to Xiaomi at ~10%. ( I think they raised this to 15%+ due to operating cost being higher outside China )
It is also worth remembering. Hardware is insanely cheap. Comparatively speaking. We talk about moore's law ending because of higher cost of making chips, at the same time we keep making dozen of billions from stupid social network and ads. The number by comparison are often comical. The cost of a product are now mostly driven by software when Apple are still giving iOS update to a phone first released 6 years ago.
It might also be worth noting, the entry level iPhone, iPhone SE, has faster single thread performance ( Very important due to Amdahl's law ) than the best flagship Android Phone on the market. You have to price this in somewhere.
There are reasons why things are little bit more expensive to make. And those add up quickly. The flexible OLED panel is more than double the BOM cost of rigid OLED even at the scale of Apple. For Apple that is ~$150+ of RSP increase form a single component. It is not only just being rigid, but they are also a higher quality panel. People often only look at "spec" on the surface without actually going it into details. Add up the cost of iOS ( $10 on accounting basis or $30 for RSP ), Face ID etc you are looking at $200 RSP extra already without going into any many other differences. Of course the main thing being Apple has a gross product margin of 60% compared to Xiaomi at ~10%. ( I think they raised this to 15%+ due to operating cost being higher outside China )
It is also worth remembering. Hardware is insanely cheap. Comparatively speaking. We talk about moore's law ending because of higher cost of making chips, at the same time we keep making dozen of billions from stupid social network and ads. The number by comparison are often comical. The cost of a product are now mostly driven by software when Apple are still giving iOS update to a phone first released 6 years ago.
It might also be worth noting, the entry level iPhone, iPhone SE, has faster single thread performance ( Very important due to Amdahl's law ) than the best flagship Android Phone on the market. You have to price this in somewhere.
Apple’s overall margins are around 35%. Where do you see that iPhone has 60% margins?
Apple over the years has an extremely consistent 60% margin on iPhone from BOM cost to RSP, that is excluding NRE, patents, Services, iOS, distribution and many other things. This distorted a bit once they introduce iPhone X in 2017 / 2018 along with their Services Revenue accounting changes.
I think perhaps you're reading something into my comment that I just don't believe is there.
It's simply an anecdote from a random HN user who has a Xiaomi device, in a thread about Xiaomi; I figured they'd be relatively rare among HN users, and someone might appreciate a comment from an owner.
I don't hate iPhones, or the Samsung I've owned. They all have different attributes and values: the iPhone 6 was beautiful to look at, and the physical size was great; the last Galaxy I had was a great all-rounder; the Xiaomi I have now is a little larger than I'd like (though that's the way everyone has gone now), but otherwise it's very good in almost any regard. Is it better than an iPhone or the latest Galaxy? I'm not saying that - what I'm saying is that it does everything I need and more, and was half the price of flagships at the time. Way I see it, that's incredible value for an extremely capable device.
It's simply an anecdote from a random HN user who has a Xiaomi device, in a thread about Xiaomi; I figured they'd be relatively rare among HN users, and someone might appreciate a comment from an owner.
I don't hate iPhones, or the Samsung I've owned. They all have different attributes and values: the iPhone 6 was beautiful to look at, and the physical size was great; the last Galaxy I had was a great all-rounder; the Xiaomi I have now is a little larger than I'd like (though that's the way everyone has gone now), but otherwise it's very good in almost any regard. Is it better than an iPhone or the latest Galaxy? I'm not saying that - what I'm saying is that it does everything I need and more, and was half the price of flagships at the time. Way I see it, that's incredible value for an extremely capable device.
A big reason why people buy iPhones is the Apple ecosystem and status signalling. A $300 Xiaomi phone also isn't as good as a flagship iPhone, but it's ~90% as good for 1/3 the price. For people who spend several hours per day on their phone, it isn't irrational to buy an iPhone. Americans spend on average 5.4 hours per day on their phone. Over two years, the savings from a Xiaomi phone come out to less than 20 cents per hour use. For these people it may well be worth the 20 cents for an hour of better phone experience. I think Samsung should be way more worried than Apple.
Xiaomi has in past shown extremely innovative solutions. Just look at the battery life they achieved with mi band (3 months vs competitors 18 hours, are you kidding me??).
So while their software is basically adware and like all Chinese companies they are probably controlled by CCP, we must acknowledge that they also have some really bright engineers.
So while their software is basically adware and like all Chinese companies they are probably controlled by CCP, we must acknowledge that they also have some really bright engineers.
Note he compared it to an iPhone 6.
For me the greatest value is 2+ days battery and the fact that I'm not afraid to loose/break €200 phone vs €600, while Xiaomi is better in many aspects. Went to it 5 years ago after using flagship Samsung models also for c.5 years, could not stand for abysmal battery and their UI.
Ad bloat could be disabled in settings, I did not see too many suspicious logs in Netguard (calls to Facebook APIs were much more frequent, even from apps that have nothing to do with FB). But that's is an EU country, I've read that Xiomi at least tries not to annoy regulators too much there with privacy issues, going for market share.
Also most bloatware (even their browser) could be uninstalled in 10 minutes, just google "Xiaomi debloat", or go directly to https://github.com/Szaki/XiaomiADBFastbootTools
Ad bloat could be disabled in settings, I did not see too many suspicious logs in Netguard (calls to Facebook APIs were much more frequent, even from apps that have nothing to do with FB). But that's is an EU country, I've read that Xiomi at least tries not to annoy regulators too much there with privacy issues, going for market share.
Also most bloatware (even their browser) could be uninstalled in 10 minutes, just google "Xiaomi debloat", or go directly to https://github.com/Szaki/XiaomiADBFastbootTools
I would like this to be true (who doesn't want to pay less for the same experience) but it's very much not the case. Eg. two years ago I broke my one plus 6, I went to a local mall - they have a Xiaomi store there and a Samsung shop, I spent like 20 mins playing with the phones in each store and you could immediately see which was the premium brand between the two. I still pass by regularly to check things out and get the same impression.
When it comes to high end hardware the only phones that I've seen come close also cost in the same ballpark. Frankly you get what you pay for, diminishing returns are a thing but you can still see a clear difference between 200€ and 600€ phone. Even the iPhone 12max my wife has can justify the price with the insane photo/video quality for a phone.
When it comes to high end hardware the only phones that I've seen come close also cost in the same ballpark. Frankly you get what you pay for, diminishing returns are a thing but you can still see a clear difference between 200€ and 600€ phone. Even the iPhone 12max my wife has can justify the price with the insane photo/video quality for a phone.
Well, I said "better in many aspects", not overall better. For me, the camera is not that much important. It's good enough on Xiaomi, but obviously it's better on iPhone.
It's personal preferences, for me the aspects of long battery life and turning the device into disposable cattle, not a pet, are much more important. The display on Xiaomi is decent, and that plus fast responsive apps the display shows is all I need from a phone.
It's personal preferences, for me the aspects of long battery life and turning the device into disposable cattle, not a pet, are much more important. The display on Xiaomi is decent, and that plus fast responsive apps the display shows is all I need from a phone.
I loved my Mi A1 A2 and A3. All fantastic phones with stock Android and fabulous value for money. Sadly however they have stopped shipping stock Android. The MiUI is a terrible terrible experience in developing countries like India. See this review by GeekyRanjit. https://youtu.be/jbnxMuBUw0E
I opened the video, hoping to see examples of this AdWare/NagWare problem, but GeekyRanjit does not show any phone UI during the video :/
Still rocking a Mi A1.
Not the best performance or camera, but for what I paid it's an amazing product. Battery still lasts a couple of days.
It's a real shame Xiaomi got out of Android One. I'm probably going to get a Nokia when the A1 dies.
Not the best performance or camera, but for what I paid it's an amazing product. Battery still lasts a couple of days.
It's a real shame Xiaomi got out of Android One. I'm probably going to get a Nokia when the A1 dies.
Out of curiosity: Is it possible that the US Government will do the same for Xiaomi that they did to Huawei? If so, how long will it take?
Xiaomi already was on a blacklist in the past: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-05-12/xiaomi-u-...
Huawei is perceived as a problem because they are big in infrastructure.
Xiaomi does smartphones that run on Qualcomm chips and Android. Of course there are always games and tit-for-tat but on the face of it Xiaomi is rather innocuous and benefits US companies (and that's probably why it was removed from the US blacklist).
Xiaomi does smartphones that run on Qualcomm chips and Android. Of course there are always games and tit-for-tat but on the face of it Xiaomi is rather innocuous and benefits US companies (and that's probably why it was removed from the US blacklist).
Huawei designing their own chipsets seems to be the big thing.
We will see what happens if Xiaomi starts using main chipsets from Unisoc or another Chinese designer.
We will see what happens if Xiaomi starts using main chipsets from Unisoc or another Chinese designer.
Not likely, though Xiaomi is a bit bigger now, it is not really posing noticeable technical superiority that Huawei was regarded.
Xiaomi doesn't provide the kind of network infrastructure that Huawei does. So they don't have access to the kind of data that concerned us policymakers.
If everyone start using their phones, they kind of will. I would guess it's easier to spy on people when you own the hardware and OS. Maybe the infrastructure would allow broader spying but owning a big part of the smartphone market allows for more in-depth spying for those with Xiaomi phones.
[deleted]
The first thought that leaps to my mind, on reviewing this, is that Apple is currently facing a court case in Australia accusing it of being a monopolist. And is facing various hostile inquires, in conjunction with Google [0] as people worry about the power of US tech giants.
It is interesting to me to try and square the software with the obviously (1) competitive and (2) East Asian reality of the hardware. The hardware makers must be in a great position to pull another Apple if they think the market is actually uncompetitive.
[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26920869
It is interesting to me to try and square the software with the obviously (1) competitive and (2) East Asian reality of the hardware. The hardware makers must be in a great position to pull another Apple if they think the market is actually uncompetitive.
[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26920869
I have a hard time squaring that optimism with the ban of Huawei and the ban requests made by the US administration for Xiaomi as well.
Good for them!
I've been using Redmi (a sub-brand of Xiaomi, using same MIUI Android variant) Note 2,4,6,8, now 10, and I will buy 12 when it arrives too. I also use their power banks, fitness trackers, and even toothbrushes from Mijia sub-brand.
Their prices are very difficult to beat. Their software is not as polished as say, Pixel devices or Apple devices, but for a third of the cost, that's an acceptable compromise for me.
They are very aggressive at rolling out new phones, though. There is a Redmi Note device every 6-8 months, and a comparable Mi Lite device released a month or two later too. They are pretty similar with Poco specs as well.
Their strategy is to release more and more phones and make the users think their device hit the sweet-spot. For example, my Redmi Note 10 has an IR blaster and a 3.5mm headphone jack. Another line of devices might reuse the same SoC and physical aspects, but not include an IR blaster and a 3.5mm jack. Redmi Note series also has a bunch of variants, some with NFC, some without, and some with 5G.
Their prices are very difficult to beat. Their software is not as polished as say, Pixel devices or Apple devices, but for a third of the cost, that's an acceptable compromise for me.
They are very aggressive at rolling out new phones, though. There is a Redmi Note device every 6-8 months, and a comparable Mi Lite device released a month or two later too. They are pretty similar with Poco specs as well.
Their strategy is to release more and more phones and make the users think their device hit the sweet-spot. For example, my Redmi Note 10 has an IR blaster and a 3.5mm headphone jack. Another line of devices might reuse the same SoC and physical aspects, but not include an IR blaster and a 3.5mm jack. Redmi Note series also has a bunch of variants, some with NFC, some without, and some with 5G.
I have always thought many android based phones are fantastic.
I have a dirt cheap Nokia(don't even know the model)and apart from initial startup time and availability of integrated, so to say native apps, it blows the iphone 11 out of the water in camera, speed, responsiveness.
Also had a xiaomi phone as business phone, and it was performing better than the currently available iphone.
I think iphones have stopped looking nice a while ago anyway.
I like the design and finish of Mac laptops, but even there, you can get better from brands with windows os, but that will cost a ridiculous amount of money.
May I ask, apart from look, why do so many people in the US chose to use an iphone? Genuine curiosity.
Also had a xiaomi phone as business phone, and it was performing better than the currently available iphone.
I think iphones have stopped looking nice a while ago anyway.
I like the design and finish of Mac laptops, but even there, you can get better from brands with windows os, but that will cost a ridiculous amount of money.
May I ask, apart from look, why do so many people in the US chose to use an iphone? Genuine curiosity.
My experience with android has been the opposite. I’ve never had an android phone that lasted more than 2 years without becoming frustratingly slow whereas my iPhone 8 still runs as well as the day I got it. All anecdotal but I stick with what works for me
All my androids have lasted quite a while actually, but I had to replace various parts of them. headphone jack, display assembly, sdcard slot. I have an Xperia XZ2 that has/had a really annoying touchscreen issue where the cursor will jump around(soon after I bought it). Apparently it's just an issue with the phone. I bought a second hand iPhone 8 a year later and have been using it since.
I guess I don't care as much about how the phone looks and more about the fact that the iPhone 8 is still on latest iOS whereas XZ2 and basically all sony phones will hardly get any updates and you get to choose between keeping your camera or updating your phone and keeping it fast with a custom rom(yes, you keep your phones camera active nowadays even after unlocking, but there is no updated camera HAL on the latest custom rom, you'll always have a subpar camera experience). Sony even announced that the Xperia 1 III will only receive one major update recently. Although everyone is still hoping that that was a mistake but the europeans.
I would say Xiaomi deserves it though. They're cheap devices with good performance(and inofficial GCAM), and usually some (not great) open source drivers that allow for fast custom rom development(although that too has taken a turn for worse recently).
I guess I don't care as much about how the phone looks and more about the fact that the iPhone 8 is still on latest iOS whereas XZ2 and basically all sony phones will hardly get any updates and you get to choose between keeping your camera or updating your phone and keeping it fast with a custom rom(yes, you keep your phones camera active nowadays even after unlocking, but there is no updated camera HAL on the latest custom rom, you'll always have a subpar camera experience). Sony even announced that the Xperia 1 III will only receive one major update recently. Although everyone is still hoping that that was a mistake but the europeans.
I would say Xiaomi deserves it though. They're cheap devices with good performance(and inofficial GCAM), and usually some (not great) open source drivers that allow for fast custom rom development(although that too has taken a turn for worse recently).
As someone who has both a mid-range nokia released this year and an A13 iPhone I would love to see a side by side comparison video between your two devices showing camera and speed tests. From my experience it's the opposite, the nokia stutters and lags during normal usage while the iPhone loads apps almost instantly and doesn't drop frames.
> May I ask, apart from look, why do so many people in the US chose to use an iphone? Genuine curiosity.
iOS
iOS
I got an iPhone 8 after rocking an iPhone 4s for about 8 years. And this point, all the phones are pretty damn fast and smart be it an android or iPhone ecosystem. I would be happy with either. What finalized my purchase was the fact that Costco was offering 300$ store credit plus a couple other things on a Black Friday sale. Seemed like a good deal at the time.
> it blows the iphone 11 out of the water in camera, speed, responsiveness
I have not seen iphone being outclassed by another phone.
I have not seen iphone being outclassed by another phone.
Then you haven't been looking very far. Doesn't anyone on HN understand the concept of observer bias? -_-
> Then you haven't been looking very far.
And you didn't name any phones that outclass the iPhone.
That's because there are none. I say that as not a particular fan of Apple products or their ecosystem. I only buy Android phones as I prefer that ecosystem and interface. Every generation - for the past ~13 years - I research all the phones on the market, those worth bothering with, and it's still exceptionally clear Apple is making the best smartphones. Ecosystem, performance, audio, video, photos, gaming, all aspects remain at elite levels among smartphones. They're the only smartphone maker that has consistently stayed at or close to the top for so long, generation after generation.
And you didn't name any phones that outclass the iPhone.
That's because there are none. I say that as not a particular fan of Apple products or their ecosystem. I only buy Android phones as I prefer that ecosystem and interface. Every generation - for the past ~13 years - I research all the phones on the market, those worth bothering with, and it's still exceptionally clear Apple is making the best smartphones. Ecosystem, performance, audio, video, photos, gaming, all aspects remain at elite levels among smartphones. They're the only smartphone maker that has consistently stayed at or close to the top for so long, generation after generation.
Maybe you’re the one with the bias? Or can observer bias apply only to people who disagree with you?
Apple makes small phones that have flagship power. I can’t imagine buying a 6.7 inch smartphone.
I have Mi 10T Lite, it's wonderful and liberating after an iPhone, and costs half of iPhone 11 price, and (!) comes with a case and a glass film.
But the camera is just awful. It takes 5 seconds to start, video recording is jittery, sometimes as if it was recording at 10 FPS. I just don't have good pictures of my kids anymore.
But the camera is just awful. It takes 5 seconds to start, video recording is jittery, sometimes as if it was recording at 10 FPS. I just don't have good pictures of my kids anymore.
I have a POCO X3, I had my dad buying for me cause I could not leave the house and my old phone died. It was a surprise. Good phone all around, great camera. After some hours I've noted there's ADs everywhere. Uninstallable apps. Now, after a year is passed, the camera freezes in the middle of the recording of a long video. I honestly did not have time to root the phone and fix the ads and apps issue and I'm just now learning about this GitHub repo with the debloat tools. I was a Samsung Galaxy user and now I'm a Xiaomi user, but after this phone I'll look somewhere else. I've been trying to put my hands on a Linux phone, which I'll probably do in the next few months.
"did not have time to root the phone and fix the ads.."
...proceeds to buy linux phone.
Introspection might help here - I recommend Apple if you want something that lasts and just works.
...proceeds to buy linux phone.
Introspection might help here - I recommend Apple if you want something that lasts and just works.
Do you remember Samsung Galaxy 2? It was the perfect phone. It all went down hill for Samsung after that. I had a Xiaomi mia1 that was great also. Those companies are capable of launching great products, and after they get the user they try to shove any kind of crap down their throats. When that happens I just leave. It does not mean that I could not give other companies a try.
I do.
Galaxy S2 it was called. I had one that was passed onto me. It had a thin plastic removable back panel so you could swap out the battery.
I loved the form factor and the feel.
My point was more around the fact that you stated you want a phone to just work, then proceed to talk about how a linux phone might be good for you. Apple is good at making consumer friendly devices. Linux phones are for hardcore tinkerers that like to hack things together and learn about stuff (compromise on the 'just work' bit).
Galaxy S2 it was called. I had one that was passed onto me. It had a thin plastic removable back panel so you could swap out the battery.
I loved the form factor and the feel.
My point was more around the fact that you stated you want a phone to just work, then proceed to talk about how a linux phone might be good for you. Apple is good at making consumer friendly devices. Linux phones are for hardcore tinkerers that like to hack things together and learn about stuff (compromise on the 'just work' bit).
Cant really beat Xiaomi on a price/value standpoint. Personally, Id never use MIUI though. So much bloatware. I replaced it with LineageOS and it's a delight.
Unfortunate that we must assume that the devices are manufactured under awful working conditions though.
Unfortunate that we must assume that the devices are manufactured under awful working conditions though.
I think that shitty camera and audio justify price difference (I have Xiaomi)
Will probably take over Samsung for the no. 1 spot in next quarter or the quarter thereafter.
Xiaomi makes a whole gamut of electronic products from robot vacuums to smart rice cookers, and perhaps offers some sort of integration between all their product lines. May be it is one of the reason for their popularity.
They also make pretty good phones for the price. Software is supported by ads, an indicator of how successful ad-supported businesses really are.
The big surprise for me is how Samsung maintains its market share with selling prices 40% higher than the Android competition. Is it just brand or promotional spend or is there something else?
Brand
My mom got a budget Xiaomi (Redmi 9A), but she's having problems with connectivity during calls in places where other phones work fine, like her apartment. Also, currently she's abroad and call connectivity is horrible for first 15-30 seconds, then the call drops and after redialing it works fine. Really weird. Probably should exchange it for a new one.
might be tempting to get one but hear me out: you can't imagine the amount of bloat and adware on miui. it depends on your region because they don't legally get away with the same intrusion everywhere. I configured it in a GDPR country (which disables some features) and when I checked the DNS requests, it made a tracking/ad request several times per minute.
Also the pre installed apps like file manager and browser have ads. The browser, which additionally has a bunch of bloaty games integrated for whatever reason, can't be uninstalled. Not going to get one again, my mate's pixel seems like a delight in comparison
Also the pre installed apps like file manager and browser have ads. The browser, which additionally has a bunch of bloaty games integrated for whatever reason, can't be uninstalled. Not going to get one again, my mate's pixel seems like a delight in comparison
If you are to downvote a comment which addresses privacy issues and puts the devices in a negative light, please also downvote all the ones that are saying they are great.
I'd rather have a 5 year old iPhone with suspect parts in it than deal with that sort of shit.
Compared to my previous Samsung device the bloat on my new Redmi is bearable.
Please compare the network traffic between the 2 devices.
After using RealMe phones, I am finding them superior to Xiaomi at similar price points. I don't know why they aren't more popular.
I just bought 69€ Xiaomi Redmi 9A and accidentally discovered it has full-fledged USB-OTG. This was not mentioned in specs and cheapest OTG-phone seems to be around 300€.
What is going on, maybe NFC and other expensive goodies are just disabled by software? And maybe this OTG just stops working at next update?
What is going on, maybe NFC and other expensive goodies are just disabled by software? And maybe this OTG just stops working at next update?
OTG isn't rare in low end hardware these days it's just really low on the list of things most low end phones think the users will care about. I wouldn't be surprised if it was simply forgotten about and not listed more often than the hardware+software weren't set up to do it.
E.g. the Pi Zero is $5 and comes with an OTG port, it's really not a matter of cost rather focus.
E.g. the Pi Zero is $5 and comes with an OTG port, it's really not a matter of cost rather focus.
Not really, if you count a vendor, and not a brand, the whole of BBK group has long been the №1
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Many people here say that software not being polished is kind of a problem but that is irrelevant - you can always install alternative app and you should. I would be most happy if all those default garbage "apps" are left out on ANY phone (i.e. minimal install) - just give me OS and let me be, I can install stuff I use on my own. You should never use apps tied to vendor as portability of your tools is most important.
Not only Xiaomi phones are cheaper, but technology is IMO way better then that of Samsung and friends:
- Face recognition NEVER FAILS. It fails on MS Surface (and in kinda embarrassing way really), Samsung, Huwei etc. but never on Xiaomi - it can rain, snow, you can change haircuts... its irrelevant, it only scan eyes.
- MAUI is way less bloated IMO then alternatives
- Glass is awesome on my Redmi - I recently dropped it on asphalt (which is very sharp) from 1.5 meter height and then I hit it with my foot while walking so it slide on asphalt on the glass side, traveling around 5 meters. I thought it will go to trash can after that, but I picked it up and there was just a small scratch ! Amazing
I am not judging only using phone xperience - all other gadgets I got from the company are great and 3 times cheaper then alternative - air cleaner, roborock etc.
Good job Xiaomi.
Not only Xiaomi phones are cheaper, but technology is IMO way better then that of Samsung and friends:
- Face recognition NEVER FAILS. It fails on MS Surface (and in kinda embarrassing way really), Samsung, Huwei etc. but never on Xiaomi - it can rain, snow, you can change haircuts... its irrelevant, it only scan eyes.
- MAUI is way less bloated IMO then alternatives
- Glass is awesome on my Redmi - I recently dropped it on asphalt (which is very sharp) from 1.5 meter height and then I hit it with my foot while walking so it slide on asphalt on the glass side, traveling around 5 meters. I thought it will go to trash can after that, but I picked it up and there was just a small scratch ! Amazing
I am not judging only using phone xperience - all other gadgets I got from the company are great and 3 times cheaper then alternative - air cleaner, roborock etc.
Good job Xiaomi.
> - Face recognition NEVER FAILS. It fails on MS Surface (and in kinda embarrassing way really), Samsung, Huwei etc. but never on Xiaomi - it can rain, snow, you can change haircuts... its irrelevant, it only scan eyes.
What about false positive rate? It's there for security after all, not for convenience. Actually that's what makes me worry about biometrics. I was able to find out Apple claims about security characteristics of their fingerprint recognition and face recognition features. But I was not able to find this information for Android vendors, it's like nobody cares.
What about false positive rate? It's there for security after all, not for convenience. Actually that's what makes me worry about biometrics. I was able to find out Apple claims about security characteristics of their fingerprint recognition and face recognition features. But I was not able to find this information for Android vendors, it's like nobody cares.
I did not witness it. I tried on 10+ people, and it didn't unlock the phone. I would certainly love to know more, sounds to me too good to be true, but then I remembered that iris is like fingerprint so it makes sense.
> Face recognition NEVER FAILS
Are we talking about the false negative or the false positive rate here?
Are we talking about the false negative or the false positive rate here?
Hardware is great. Software (MIUI) is adware crap, which I knew when I was buying. I tweaked privacy settings as much was possible, and I use almost none of the builtin apps. Instead I use Firefox Focus+Mobile for browsing, Amaze for file management, Dropbox for file storage and PDF view, etc.
Overall the entire experience is comparable (for me) to a Samsung or Apple phone at 3x the price. The most annoying things are still Google and YouTube ToS accept dialogs I get all the time because I'm effectively using an incognito browser, and I'd get those on any phone.