Dwarf Fortress Steam Updates – Release Roadmap(store.steampowered.com)
store.steampowered.com
Dwarf Fortress Steam Updates – Release Roadmap
https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/975370/view/3099043827445055732
83 comments
I believe Caves of Qud have also been under development for about 15 years: https://www.cavesofqud.com/
And there are of course the timeless classics that inspired these- nethack, angband & dungeon-crawl.
And there are of course the timeless classics that inspired these- nethack, angband & dungeon-crawl.
Never in my life was I expecting to find a Merchants Guild member on HN.
I had to check when Unity was released, apparently 2005. Was Caves of Qud always using Unity or switched to Unity afterwards?
It's a relatively recent switch and as far as i understood it's still running the original in headless mode and communicates with unity, with the unity program basically only being the front end for the game.
Those passion projects exist you just haven't heard about them. Unfortunately , we're past the point where reach is free and organic. You now need to pay if you wanna be heard.
> You now need to pay if you wanna be heard.
Citation needed. Plenty of games get picked up and become popular organically. How much did they spend on Minecraft's marketing? Fortnite? Factorio? KSP?
Citation needed. Plenty of games get picked up and become popular organically. How much did they spend on Minecraft's marketing? Fortnite? Factorio? KSP?
Most of your examples first popped up 10 or so years ago give or take, when organic reach was still possible. The only one that didn't was fortnite (Dec 2017) but it's a far cry from a small indie project, it came from a AAA developer that not only had multiple well known games, was also behind the unreal engine, one of the most popular game engines.
Define organic and payment. We still have successful indie games exploding in success, mostly on its quality. It's just that the threshold for "quality" is higher with more competition around. So not any little crappy project becomes automatically successful, nor does the hundred clone of something gains any attention just because it makes something different.
> it’s a bit sad that we don’t have more passion projects like this
Check out UnReal World, which Tarn cites as a source for his own inspiration (and is itself still under active development and also now available on Steam): https://www.unrealworld.fi/
Check out UnReal World, which Tarn cites as a source for his own inspiration (and is itself still under active development and also now available on Steam): https://www.unrealworld.fi/
Do not forget Unrealworld:
http://www.unrealworld.fi/
oh and Aurora4x...probably no really a game:
https://aurora2.pentarch.org/
http://www.unrealworld.fi/
oh and Aurora4x...probably no really a game:
https://aurora2.pentarch.org/
For 4x-type games, there was a recent v1 global release of Remnants of the Precursors[0], made by a single dev who participates to the related subreddit[1].
The upcoming Falling Frontier[2] is also a one-man dev team iirc.
As a person struggling with day-to-day due to mental health issues, all the people working on such projects truly are an inspiration - and on top of that we get good games :)
[0] https://rayfowler.itch.io/remnants-of-the-precursors
[1] https://old.reddit.com/r/rotp/
[2] https://www.gog.com/game/falling_frontier
As a person struggling with day-to-day due to mental health issues, all the people working on such projects truly are an inspiration - and on top of that we get good games :)
[0] https://rayfowler.itch.io/remnants-of-the-precursors
[1] https://old.reddit.com/r/rotp/
[2] https://www.gog.com/game/falling_frontier
Stardew Valley.
stardew valley is a rip off harvest moon and still took 4 years to develop.
dwarf fortress has alot of fully original concepts, and has been in development for 20 years.
dwarf fortress has alot of fully original concepts, and has been in development for 20 years.
It's definitely a rip off (or, 'inspired by' to put it more kindly), but Stardew managed to make it much more enjoyable and feature-rich than the long Harvest Moon and Story of Seasons lines - and by just the one guy.
But there's a lot of others like that. Hollow Knight is a better Metroid / Castlevania. Shadow of Tsushima is a better Assassin's Creed. Final Fantasy XIV is a better World of Warcraft. Dwarf Fortress is a better Rogue/Nethack. I will go into hiding now.
But there's a lot of others like that. Hollow Knight is a better Metroid / Castlevania. Shadow of Tsushima is a better Assassin's Creed. Final Fantasy XIV is a better World of Warcraft. Dwarf Fortress is a better Rogue/Nethack. I will go into hiding now.
I think he saw the potential for a HM-like to be far more feature-rich, and correctly predicted that it would be well received. The HM series was basically stagnant, but they were the only game in town.
Strongly disagree about Hollow Knight, but it's greater than the sum of its parts.
Strongly disagree about Hollow Knight, but it's greater than the sum of its parts.
Is it a rip off? I'm sure multiple people can have the same ideas.
Vampire Survival released a few months ago, while Magic Survival was released a few years ago. They're extremely similar games.
I guess at the end it depends on what's your definition of rip off.
Is Torchlight a rip off of Diablo or do they just use similar mechanics and ideas?
Vampire Survival released a few months ago, while Magic Survival was released a few years ago. They're extremely similar games.
I guess at the end it depends on what's your definition of rip off.
Is Torchlight a rip off of Diablo or do they just use similar mechanics and ideas?
Stardew Valley is unashamedly a Harvest Moon rip off. This isn’t a bad thing though, Concerned Ape took a formula that the original creators had been phoning in for years and created the best version of that formula ever made.
Diablo invented a genre, Torchlight, Grim Dawn, Path of Exile carry the torch (ha) further. I don't believe they ever denied Diablo's influence and inspiration on them.
Is League of Legends a DotA ripoff (the mod), or is DotA (the full game) a League of Legends ripoff?
Is League of Legends a DotA ripoff (the mod), or is DotA (the full game) a League of Legends ripoff?
Not your point, but League of Legends, DOTA2 (DOTA is a the trademarked, Valve name, DotA for the mod) and Heroes of NewEarth all had had people who worked on at least a version of the original DotA All Stars mod so technically they're all equally sequels or continuations. It's Heroes of the Storm and SMITE that are the rip-offs :).
Or at the very least, League, DOTA2, and HoN (may it soon RIP) are all equally rip-offs of the original mods.
Or at the very least, League, DOTA2, and HoN (may it soon RIP) are all equally rip-offs of the original mods.
> Is Torchlight a rip off of Diablo or do they just use similar mechanics and ideas?
Well, Torchlight had designers from Diablo 1 & 2 on the team as well as Diablo's composer/sound designer, so it's a bit of a special case.
Well, Torchlight had designers from Diablo 1 & 2 on the team as well as Diablo's composer/sound designer, so it's a bit of a special case.
Torchlight is made by 2 of the Diablo/Diablo 2 developers.
It's definitely strongly influenced by Stardew Valley and reuse some of its mechanics and gameplay loops but it does add a lot to them.It's as much a ripoff of it than Rayman is a ripoff of Mario and Half Life a ripoff of Doom. It's very much a sprawling game. It's not surprising it took a long time to develop.
no matter your opinion about the game itself, it's valid mentioning it as a passion project though
Are all FPS games DOOM ripoffs?
Technically, the Touhou games should also qualify as such. Though they're basically iterations of each other (sometimes with different mechanics), they're created by a single guy for over 20 years now.
Imagine a game like Dwarf Fortress... but passed on from father to son for centuries, each generation making the game bigger, richer, more complex. I suppose at a certain point you'd have a game impossible to play in one lifetime.
Other than the father to son it sounds like nethack! First public release was 34 years ago and it has been under more or less active development since (with a few years-long periods of inactivity in the middle).
[deleted]
Developing or playing in 1 world?
In school I remember finding project files students in the past had left on the servers. Mostly like digital art files. Sometimes papers or a miscopy from a flash drive or a small game. I thought that was cool, like uncovering artifacts from the past.
Social media groups of the recent graduate classes were just starting at the time. A couple of times, I remember uncovering a couple years old discussion from my school after I went down the same path and wound up in that online space. They were just old enough to be seniors or still be friends of current students.
There was also the flash games everyone played in computer classes. Everyone must’ve gone to the same few sites and played the same games. Just about everybody could probably relate to stories of playing flash games in the computer lab although there’s no real record to share of the sites are even still around.
Anyway, I thought it’d be cool if there was a digital world designed around leaving notes and things like this.
In Mario Maker, you can see where everyone died in the world. In dark souls, you can leave messages behind. I always thought it’d be interesting to see everyone who was in your position in a world like that somehow.
Imagine the history of stats/deaths/playtime. The story of John Smith and the orange goblin skin with 14 deaths over 53 minutes, 14 seconds he played of jump hero 6 years ago. The English teacher still talks about that guy!
There’s an educational Minecraft version now. If that was more than a trend and became a standard lesson for a week, it would be interesting to see a persistent world students from the past left behind with their trolling to each other, inside jokes, and houses temporary classmate friends built together. The teacher could show off their house from when they played as a student.
In the last 20 years though, I wonder if this would have the same interest. There might just be too much online presence social media for anyone to care about the past worlds.
It also might lose appeal if everything is from long-since graduates that feel distant to relate to instead of current seniors and recent college goers. It may also just get too crowded in the game world to make new things or have them actually stand out. I also wonder if trolls would just destroy the creations of the past— I think modifications are cool but just destroying everything would ruin the purpose.
In school I remember finding project files students in the past had left on the servers. Mostly like digital art files. Sometimes papers or a miscopy from a flash drive or a small game. I thought that was cool, like uncovering artifacts from the past.
Social media groups of the recent graduate classes were just starting at the time. A couple of times, I remember uncovering a couple years old discussion from my school after I went down the same path and wound up in that online space. They were just old enough to be seniors or still be friends of current students.
There was also the flash games everyone played in computer classes. Everyone must’ve gone to the same few sites and played the same games. Just about everybody could probably relate to stories of playing flash games in the computer lab although there’s no real record to share of the sites are even still around.
Anyway, I thought it’d be cool if there was a digital world designed around leaving notes and things like this.
In Mario Maker, you can see where everyone died in the world. In dark souls, you can leave messages behind. I always thought it’d be interesting to see everyone who was in your position in a world like that somehow.
Imagine the history of stats/deaths/playtime. The story of John Smith and the orange goblin skin with 14 deaths over 53 minutes, 14 seconds he played of jump hero 6 years ago. The English teacher still talks about that guy!
There’s an educational Minecraft version now. If that was more than a trend and became a standard lesson for a week, it would be interesting to see a persistent world students from the past left behind with their trolling to each other, inside jokes, and houses temporary classmate friends built together. The teacher could show off their house from when they played as a student.
In the last 20 years though, I wonder if this would have the same interest. There might just be too much online presence social media for anyone to care about the past worlds.
It also might lose appeal if everything is from long-since graduates that feel distant to relate to instead of current seniors and recent college goers. It may also just get too crowded in the game world to make new things or have them actually stand out. I also wonder if trolls would just destroy the creations of the past— I think modifications are cool but just destroying everything would ruin the purpose.
There is a digital world you might be interested in.
https://www.yourworldoftext.com/
I’m now tempted to read The Glass Bead Game again, it’s been a while. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Glass_Bead_Game
I'm tempted to read Vernon Vinges's The Cookie Monster again
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Cookie_Monster_%28novella%...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Cookie_Monster_%28novella%...
This was my immediate thought as well. I think it's been 20 years since I read it, too long.
Then maybe the save files will be passed down in families as well.
Each heir to the code would have to receive a PhD in mathematics, like their parents before.
...why? Just for the giggles?
That sounds like a mix of DF and Crusader Kings.
I tried to get into DF a few years ago but found it... overwhelming. Even after buying a book.
I certainly welcome efforts to make DF more accessible in this way. One thing I'm unsure of with the Steam roadmap is this: will this still require third party software to realistically play?
I forget the name of it but there was software you'd run that would directly peek and poke into DF memory to set the tasks and preferences of your dwarves and it was the only way to manage a lot of dwarves. Will this still be the case?
I certainly welcome efforts to make DF more accessible in this way. One thing I'm unsure of with the Steam roadmap is this: will this still require third party software to realistically play?
I forget the name of it but there was software you'd run that would directly peek and poke into DF memory to set the tasks and preferences of your dwarves and it was the only way to manage a lot of dwarves. Will this still be the case?
There were several of those, but DwarfTherapist is probably what you’re thinking of. It’s basically required to run a fortress at scale.
You can do it quite easily without Therapist by typing "enable autolabor" into your dfhack console window. All job assignments basically get turned on for every dwarf.
I never really tried DF, only read some tutorials about it. I have high expectations for this port, but at the same time, I'm worried that the learning curve will still make this game unpleasant to play because it takes too much time.
Factorio is also an excellent game, but I don't play the mods for the same reason I would not play DF. Too much things, and often the game design is a bit hairy for no good reason that would make some sense.
Factorio is also an excellent game, but I don't play the mods for the same reason I would not play DF. Too much things, and often the game design is a bit hairy for no good reason that would make some sense.
There are a lot of stuff to do on DF but you don't have to do them all. You need food, you need booze and learning how to make those two is necessary but rest is optional really. You can pick a safe starting location or wall yourself in and even ignore military (at least up to a point I think)
If you're looking for a less overwhelming yet still complete colony management sim, Rimworld has gained a lot of (frankly well-deserved) traction recently. You won't be doing as much micromanagement as you would in DF, but the gameplay is slimmed down such that you can realistically learn it over the course of a playthrough while still having fun.
I still prefer the denser sim titles like SS13 and DF, but I'll almost always reach for Rimworld if I want some no-fuss fun. Just be careful around the modding rabbit hole...
I still prefer the denser sim titles like SS13 and DF, but I'll almost always reach for Rimworld if I want some no-fuss fun. Just be careful around the modding rabbit hole...
I have hundreds of hours in Rimworld. I love the game description on its own website because it’s exactly what they say it is.
However I’m sad that there are so many cool things to manage in your colony except… water. There is no notion of hygiene or thirst and this always break the immersion at some point for me.
But I love that the game is designed to make you feel like each colonists are unique people that you can’t afford to let die, because it will be hard to recover and it will anyway change your colony forever.
However I’m sad that there are so many cool things to manage in your colony except… water. There is no notion of hygiene or thirst and this always break the immersion at some point for me.
But I love that the game is designed to make you feel like each colonists are unique people that you can’t afford to let die, because it will be hard to recover and it will anyway change your colony forever.
> There is no notion of hygiene or thirst and this always break the immersion at some point for me.
Then Dubs Hygiene mod is for you :)
Then Dubs Hygiene mod is for you :)
Oh nice, thank you ! Looks like someone is going to loose another hundred of hours.
If haven't already, you'll lose yourself in so many mods for RimWorld :)
Was modding support built in to rimworld or something people tacked on afterwards like minecraft?
There was basic support from the beginning, but what really caused the community to flourish were modding frameworks. Hugslib (and then later Harmony) kicked off a truly insane modding arms-race, with everything from combat overhauls, expanded vanilla features, new races, new AI storytellers, new factions, new menus... there's simply too much to describe in one sitting.
It was built from the start and people tacked on even more :)
There's anything from quality of life improvements to complete game overhauls (like full magic systems, factorio-style factories etc.) to new content to new scenarios to... :)
There's anything from quality of life improvements to complete game overhauls (like full magic systems, factorio-style factories etc.) to new content to new scenarios to... :)
It is a true tragedy that SS13 will never have the enormous following it deserves. I often struggle to convey how engaging an experience it is, even with an absurdly obtuse interface. Dwarf Fortress is a lot of fun too, but nothing can surpass the emergent, anarchic glory of SS13.
If I can sway you in this comment, please. Treat yourself to two full playthroughs with the wiki open in another tab. You may just be hooked.
If I can sway you in this comment, please. Treat yourself to two full playthroughs with the wiki open in another tab. You may just be hooked.
SS13 is hampered by the awful BYOND software it was made for. It lags bad on high population servers. Unfortunately numerous from-scratch rewrite attempts have stalled out so we're stuck with it
That's not true. There is a new open source rewrite in very active development. https://spacestation14.io/ It's still missing quite a bit from SS13, however, it is fully playable right now, and the US test server is fairly full most night of the week.
BYOND? is that a specific tool or some weird "bring your own ??? ????" acronym?
It's a specific game engine tool: Build Your Own Net Dream[0]
0:http://www.byond.com/?
0:http://www.byond.com/?
It's sort of a joint game engine/launcher? It's like something dug up in an archeological dig, but struggling through is worth it.
This video is what got me into SS13! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZ__73b7FUE
I wonder what the Steam achievements will look like. Maybe this?
Boatmurdered - A dwarf died to a carp
Boatmurdered - A dwarf died to a carp
Wish I could take a peek at any part of the df source. I just want to see the style and organization.
Based on the podcasts interviews I’ve heard in the past from Tarn… no you don’t :)
I like that on the steam page for Dwarf Fortress it states:
Release Date: time is subjectiveI think Fall 2023 is way more likely than Fall 2022. The game would need to be in a close-to-release beta right now for a shipment 6-7 months from now IMO.
Just throwing this out there but Music could probably wait until after an early access release, right? Who's with me?
I mean people who play DF are so particular that I can't imagine many of them starting up DF and getting lost in the immersive soundtrack.
You get lost in the management of details, while listening to your own music perhaps.
Just trying to justify a quicker release date because I'm itching to try the new menus. :)
I mean people who play DF are so particular that I can't imagine many of them starting up DF and getting lost in the immersive soundtrack.
You get lost in the management of details, while listening to your own music perhaps.
Just trying to justify a quicker release date because I'm itching to try the new menus. :)
The music probably isn't dictating the release date, but able to be completed alongside the critical path. I doubt that getting the music done will take much time from the devs who are focusing on the important things (I know its mostly just Tarn, but I beleive that there is actually a team working on the steam release, but may be wrong about that).
Speak for yourself.
>as it turns out there was an awful lot of stuff to do ha ha
oh god do I know that feel
oh god do I know that feel
Linux build, nice! getting ready for Steam Deck!
Hope to see some version of Dwarf Therapist via Steam Workshop, the hacks needed to get it working on Linux are pretty annoying (even if I have the kinks worked out of my scripts at this point)
Lazynewbpack
Might be difficult to play without a keyboard.
You can attach a keyboard to the Deck
Yes you can, but at that point a laptop might be a more convenient solution.
Steam Deck supports onscreen virtual keyboard, the screen is a touch screen!
Fun fact: you can customize its look: https://twitter.com/OnDeck/status/1496663324246695937
Fun fact: you can customize its look: https://twitter.com/OnDeck/status/1496663324246695937
It would be really nice if the user interface was designed to be more human friendly.
I do wonder how long it would take to stimulate history on a Steam Deck!
I do wonder how long it would take to stimulate history on a Steam Deck!
I have no interest whatsoever in playing this game, but I'm delighted it exists. Gotta love passion projects like this, CoQ, TOME, UnReal World, Tennis Elbow, My Summer Car, etc
They could even launch it on steam without a playing version people will buy it straight away...
Tarn dedication is doubtless.
so looking forward to this. Will be paying for the pre-release on day 1
Tarn deserves praise for his work - and it’s a bit sad that we don’t have more passion projects like this.