Ask HN: My sister asked me to help her move into IT. Help
22 comments
3K for HTML course is nonsense. Let me rephrase. 3K for an HTML course when you have never done anything with HTML is nonsense. 3K could be a steal depending on where you are at. Your sister hasn't done anything yet so just taking a 3K HTML course is almost the same as burning 3K cash.
The issue with most people wanting to get into "IT" is that they think that taking a course or even a bootcamp will help them get a six figure job. It can happen for some but the reality is that you need to start on your own on the side, learn the basics, do a project and go from there.
If she truly wants to get into IT, my first question would be "What are you willing to sacrifice and do about it" ? We can point to many free resources to get a start including freecodecamp or even w3schools but she has to be willing to put the work in first.
If she truly is tenacious and has a great WHY for getting into IT, then tell her to go to https://freecodecamp.org and get started on her own for free and learn to do a project. If she likes it enough, ask for more help and it all gets easy every day from there on.
Just wanted to give it straight to you and I hope it helps.
The issue with most people wanting to get into "IT" is that they think that taking a course or even a bootcamp will help them get a six figure job. It can happen for some but the reality is that you need to start on your own on the side, learn the basics, do a project and go from there.
If she truly wants to get into IT, my first question would be "What are you willing to sacrifice and do about it" ? We can point to many free resources to get a start including freecodecamp or even w3schools but she has to be willing to put the work in first.
If she truly is tenacious and has a great WHY for getting into IT, then tell her to go to https://freecodecamp.org and get started on her own for free and learn to do a project. If she likes it enough, ask for more help and it all gets easy every day from there on.
Just wanted to give it straight to you and I hope it helps.
It does. I will try to convince her to try freecodecamp route. Thank you.
I was effectively thinking the same thing. And while my sister did not explicitly state it, I worry that she may be blinded by dollar signs without consideration of the work it actually takes to get to that point.
Lets see what comes of it.
I was effectively thinking the same thing. And while my sister did not explicitly state it, I worry that she may be blinded by dollar signs without consideration of the work it actually takes to get to that point.
Lets see what comes of it.
Hey bro, after reading the comments at the time of posting this( my) comment, I suggest you give her some books or forward some YT videos of what entails IT as a bouquet of specializations. Drop that idea of paying 3K for HTML. I hope that business shuts down for looting customers.
I taught someone I knew in a local language by repeatedly pausing an English playlist and translating them and solving their doubts as and when they asked. I explained them questions from problem sets of Java from both "Liang Java 12th ed." and "Cay Horstmann". That guy was able to explain the algorithm immediately. So I taught him enough English for him to speak and write. That is it. He is working in Magazine Company as a Database Admin. He is teaching himself for his career growth.
Second, Reddit is the best place for local language based course learning. Romanian, French, Portugese, German, Italian, Spanish, Chinese, and Vietnamese courses are the only ones I can remember based on popularity. Coursera and EdX usually have CC in about 40 languages, one of which might be your sister's. Moreover, plenty of chrome extensions can now auto-translate video lectures at almost every popular site.
Third, HTML CSS JavaScript is more of a breadth course. Reading, rather than watching should be suggested. Jon Duckett books are top in popularity. The Odin-Project is a track with huge commitment. A video course can be picked from this crowdsourced list - https://reddsera.com/
If she wishes to go Web Dev, Let her dip into Java/Python because theory books and practicing problem sets in her language and jobs in her country are easy to find when it comes to Java.
Most entry level positions which are abundant, are limited to Web Dev, Scrum Master, SysAdmin, QA, etc.
Am I tailoring it right? If not, let me know. Also let me know which country is she be learning in, what languages does she know,
A neatly arranged course can be found in any masters degree course, further free in EU, with similar language constraints.
I taught someone I knew in a local language by repeatedly pausing an English playlist and translating them and solving their doubts as and when they asked. I explained them questions from problem sets of Java from both "Liang Java 12th ed." and "Cay Horstmann". That guy was able to explain the algorithm immediately. So I taught him enough English for him to speak and write. That is it. He is working in Magazine Company as a Database Admin. He is teaching himself for his career growth.
Second, Reddit is the best place for local language based course learning. Romanian, French, Portugese, German, Italian, Spanish, Chinese, and Vietnamese courses are the only ones I can remember based on popularity. Coursera and EdX usually have CC in about 40 languages, one of which might be your sister's. Moreover, plenty of chrome extensions can now auto-translate video lectures at almost every popular site.
Third, HTML CSS JavaScript is more of a breadth course. Reading, rather than watching should be suggested. Jon Duckett books are top in popularity. The Odin-Project is a track with huge commitment. A video course can be picked from this crowdsourced list - https://reddsera.com/
If she wishes to go Web Dev, Let her dip into Java/Python because theory books and practicing problem sets in her language and jobs in her country are easy to find when it comes to Java.
Most entry level positions which are abundant, are limited to Web Dev, Scrum Master, SysAdmin, QA, etc.
Am I tailoring it right? If not, let me know. Also let me know which country is she be learning in, what languages does she know,
A neatly arranged course can be found in any masters degree course, further free in EU, with similar language constraints.
Ty for the list including the reddit part. It honestly did not occur to me since I don't use it anymore. But I admit I think I have enough now to throw at her and see how she reacts.
<< Am I tailoring it right?
You did. Thank you. FWIW, she is in Poland now and she can parse basic English, which is why I will probably need to shepherd her a little anyway.
<< Am I tailoring it right?
You did. Thank you. FWIW, she is in Poland now and she can parse basic English, which is why I will probably need to shepherd her a little anyway.
Why IT? I can't help but wonder what she is trying to accomplish. If she wants career security, might I be impertinent and make a recommendation? From my experience, I think people severely need and are lacking child care resources. Does she have business acumen, or can she develop it, to the point that she can start a well-run daycare? I am not sure about the practicalities of starting a business like this, so I am mainly speaking from a "missing jobs/work needed" perspective.
Edit: the caveat being that she really should do the research in her area and make sure she has some competitive edge.
Edit: the caveat being that she really should do the research in her area and make sure she has some competitive edge.
Eh, I have an opinion about that effort, but I do not want to put her down, because it is honestly her first idea that is not as big of a pie in the sky. And she does seem serious about it.. more serious than her pet selling business in UK (long story). In other words, by comparison, this idea seems tethered to reality.
As to why IT.. I think she was told and convinced ( I honestly don't know real data ) that old country has a lot of jobs in that field.
Her reason was 'I want to try something new and not cry in ten years shoulda woulda coulda'. I can respect that.
<< If she wants career security, might I be impertinent and make a recommendation?
Impression I got from her is that she wants to change ( she has a boring government job now ).
<< From my experience, I think people severely need and are lacking child care resources.
Ain't that the truth. The prices near me are bananas. I would take anyone halfway decently priced.
<< Does she have business acumen
That remains an unknown, which is why I carefully tried to tell her that freelancer's life isn't for everyone.
As to why IT.. I think she was told and convinced ( I honestly don't know real data ) that old country has a lot of jobs in that field.
Her reason was 'I want to try something new and not cry in ten years shoulda woulda coulda'. I can respect that.
<< If she wants career security, might I be impertinent and make a recommendation?
Impression I got from her is that she wants to change ( she has a boring government job now ).
<< From my experience, I think people severely need and are lacking child care resources.
Ain't that the truth. The prices near me are bananas. I would take anyone halfway decently priced.
<< Does she have business acumen
That remains an unknown, which is why I carefully tried to tell her that freelancer's life isn't for everyone.
Much IT work ends up as exciting as a government job.
Why did you recommend she start a daycare business?
> Why IT? I can't help but wonder what she is trying to accomplish
Uhh, make decent money at a decent job. Not everybody feels the Call of Being a Programmer. It’s just work and you can be OK at it and make good money without it being your entire personality.
> Why IT? I can't help but wonder what she is trying to accomplish
Uhh, make decent money at a decent job. Not everybody feels the Call of Being a Programmer. It’s just work and you can be OK at it and make good money without it being your entire personality.
HTML? Webdev? Then try https://www.freecodecamp.org/
It’s often hard for people to believe that there’s not special training that will prepare you or certify you for a role in IT, which as op knows is a very broad term that covers everything from website building to data analytics.
Does she have a particular aptitude or interest in any sub-field? Persistence and interest are the best precondition to success.
Does she have a particular aptitude or interest in any sub-field? Persistence and interest are the best precondition to success.
<< Does she have a particular aptitude or interest in any sub-field?
It is going to sound awful, but I don't really know. She has never really thrown herself at anything in particular that would give me a good idea of what she could do and from what I do know she seems to have more of a penchant for social interactions.
<< Persistence and interest are the best precondition to success.
She can push herself; that much I know. I am just not sure if she would push herself here.
It is going to sound awful, but I don't really know. She has never really thrown herself at anything in particular that would give me a good idea of what she could do and from what I do know she seems to have more of a penchant for social interactions.
<< Persistence and interest are the best precondition to success.
She can push herself; that much I know. I am just not sure if she would push herself here.
One entry point, if straight-up dev work is too much, mainframe is too antiquated, and data center IT needs certs, is QA.
As functional/manual QA, you have a lot of responsibility while also learning the ins and outs of software lifecycle.
While she does it, she can learn QA automation. That is programming too.
From there, she may have better context to determine the trajectory of her career.
As functional/manual QA, you have a lot of responsibility while also learning the ins and outs of software lifecycle.
While she does it, she can learn QA automation. That is programming too.
From there, she may have better context to determine the trajectory of her career.
Study. Practice. Just like everyone else. No one "moved into" IT or any other high-skill career without putting in the effort. You can perhaps mentor your sister, which will help.
Paying for courses to learn web development or almost anything in the field seems like a waste of money given the vast amount of free material online.
Paying for courses to learn web development or almost anything in the field seems like a waste of money given the vast amount of free material online.
if someone asked me, i'd help them pick a job that we were going to target, then find/get that job, and training and learning and connections and whatever to achieve that job, or related.
reason is because there are innumerable skills/technologies that are useless to innumerable job listings and companies, so, imo, you need to pick one or three or ten or whatever skills/techs that will 'get you into IT' -- that is, that will land you a specific role.
i feel like security is a good place for newbies, esp if they are not programming/math-inclined. and i'd find 3 or 4 job roles and start applying to them - after using gpt to fix up my resume, obv, then start training, first informally, then maybe formally studying for the various certs.
that's just one path -- security. there are many. i would probably stay far away from anything web dev-related for many reasons - like it's just super-low margin, it's probably going away and already has to a large extent, programming may be going away, etc. etc.
but outside of that, most 'tech jobs' are not actually tech jobs, so there is that option, too. like marketing, sales, finance, training, etc. for tech companies.
nothing is completely safe from ai so i wouldn't really worry about that either. the rules of financial security are not changing.
i'd probably also keep asking if she has thought thru her other field options.
i don't like the "oh, don't do IT, it's _so_ bad now!" option -- one, i don't actually think that (yet?), but i'm sure there are plenty that do. it reminds me of myriad doctors i've heard over the years say, "Don't become a doctor anymore, it's _so_ bad now!" -- what they mean is they can no longer afford a second vacation home. but i don't think IT is the sure-fire thing it was 20 years ago.
English is probably super-important. if a non-native English speaker was asking me for advice on how to get into IT, I'd say start practicing your English every day -- you really need to get as close as possible to native as is practicable. listening, written, spoken, slang, etc. i would say this is a prerequisite unless you just never want to appeal to an English-speaking company. maybe that's obvious, but maybe not.
reason is because there are innumerable skills/technologies that are useless to innumerable job listings and companies, so, imo, you need to pick one or three or ten or whatever skills/techs that will 'get you into IT' -- that is, that will land you a specific role.
i feel like security is a good place for newbies, esp if they are not programming/math-inclined. and i'd find 3 or 4 job roles and start applying to them - after using gpt to fix up my resume, obv, then start training, first informally, then maybe formally studying for the various certs.
that's just one path -- security. there are many. i would probably stay far away from anything web dev-related for many reasons - like it's just super-low margin, it's probably going away and already has to a large extent, programming may be going away, etc. etc.
but outside of that, most 'tech jobs' are not actually tech jobs, so there is that option, too. like marketing, sales, finance, training, etc. for tech companies.
nothing is completely safe from ai so i wouldn't really worry about that either. the rules of financial security are not changing.
i'd probably also keep asking if she has thought thru her other field options.
i don't like the "oh, don't do IT, it's _so_ bad now!" option -- one, i don't actually think that (yet?), but i'm sure there are plenty that do. it reminds me of myriad doctors i've heard over the years say, "Don't become a doctor anymore, it's _so_ bad now!" -- what they mean is they can no longer afford a second vacation home. but i don't think IT is the sure-fire thing it was 20 years ago.
English is probably super-important. if a non-native English speaker was asking me for advice on how to get into IT, I'd say start practicing your English every day -- you really need to get as close as possible to native as is practicable. listening, written, spoken, slang, etc. i would say this is a prerequisite unless you just never want to appeal to an English-speaking company. maybe that's obvious, but maybe not.
have you asked why?
money is not a good reason to choose this career.
there are many other careers and opportunities paying equally well or more.
the press loves stories about how rich IT people are. but this field is like acting. most make some money. few make significant or life changing money.
For starters, spell "help" correctly.
I was going for cute, but your point is well taken. Might as well treat it seriously. Thank you.
FYI, I wasn't trying to be snarky. Just mentioning that people are more willing to help if they see you've done your homework.
No worries. You did have a point, which is why I updated the title.
Offtopic, but I agree. There were the times when I jumped to help anyone, but nowadays I can't hold the hand for everyone.
I was always into computers. I did not really intend it as my career ( and really still isn't; I am in analytics ). I learned basic SQL, because I wanted to run FF11 server. I learned basic VBA, because I didn't want to do some manual tasks at work. I basically kinda learned new things, because I want to solve some issue.
The other day, my sister contacted me saying she wants to 'learn IT' and linked goIT[1] video. There was really nothing wrong with the material, but the cost stunned me ( basic HTML course was 3k USD when converted from local currency ).
I kinda want to help her, but I am wondering if anyone had similar request from a family member and how you approached it. I am almost debating treating it as a personal project ( teaching is a skill ) since she has two headwinds facing her:
1. basic English, which kinda limits her ability to pick things free resources I take for granted 2. chatgpt is likely to remove entry level positions for the stuff they teach in those courses
Anyway. Any thoughts?
She can be tenacious, when she has a goal in mind. She is not mathematically inclined, but she can logic through a problem.
Thank you,
[1]https://goit.global/us/