Show HN: A storybook designed to teach kids about how computers work(lostlanguageofthemachines.com)
lostlanguageofthemachines.com
Show HN: A storybook designed to teach kids about how computers work
https://www.lostlanguageofthemachines.com
48 comments
IMO its far too technical for an actual child to want to get into. Starting at a higher level of abstraction would be easier for them
how about 5th grader or above?
definitely still way too dry. Ive tutored a kid in math, a very smart one, and even then, its difficult to explain new stuff without resorting to real storytelling and analogies. "Little bob finds an integral and correctly sees that the upper and lower bounds are [2, 3)" is not storytelling.
The text message conversations between the chapters are good.
The chapters themselves are oddly twee, as if written in the 1950s. I think it's the parts where you talk to the reader in the present tense, to directly describe the characters, that give that impression. It's kind of babying for something generally written at a YA level.
In fact you mix present and past tense from the first paragraph, that's not good, choose one and stick to it.
I'm not at all sure about that cat flipping the switch, either. How does it generate more than one 0 or 1 in a row?
Also: when we mix red paint with green paint, it becomes gray-brown paint, not yellow paint. When we mix red light with green light it becomes (perceptually) yellow light, because that's additive mixing, which does not apply to paint. OTOH perhaps this future art studio uses digital paint, which might work how you want it to, but that's not made clear.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Additive_color
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subtractive_color
The chapters themselves are oddly twee, as if written in the 1950s. I think it's the parts where you talk to the reader in the present tense, to directly describe the characters, that give that impression. It's kind of babying for something generally written at a YA level.
In fact you mix present and past tense from the first paragraph, that's not good, choose one and stick to it.
I'm not at all sure about that cat flipping the switch, either. How does it generate more than one 0 or 1 in a row?
Also: when we mix red paint with green paint, it becomes gray-brown paint, not yellow paint. When we mix red light with green light it becomes (perceptually) yellow light, because that's additive mixing, which does not apply to paint. OTOH perhaps this future art studio uses digital paint, which might work how you want it to, but that's not made clear.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Additive_color
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subtractive_color
Thanks for the feedback. I have never done anything like this before so there are tons of mistakes. The flipping thing will generate a time sequence, I find it hard to explain myself.
This is a great start and the feedback you’re getting is given with good intention. Don’t get discouraged! :)
Nice idea but I think it’s going to be pretty tough going for a kid. Have you had any children of your target age group read it? Ultimately our opinions don’t matter, those of your target demographic do so you need to get feedback from them before you do any more writing.
To give you a concrete example of where I think you’ll miss children would be using the phrase Number System. I get what that means but to children that is just Counting.
Also “carbon-titanium” is there to sound futuristic I assume? It doesn’t paint a picture in a kids head (it barely does in my adult brain) instead use colour and adjectives “hard shiny”, “shimmery black”, “echoey iridescent” etc. the aim is to paint a fleeting picture with words, not describe an accurate representation.
To give you a concrete example of where I think you’ll miss children would be using the phrase Number System. I get what that means but to children that is just Counting.
Also “carbon-titanium” is there to sound futuristic I assume? It doesn’t paint a picture in a kids head (it barely does in my adult brain) instead use colour and adjectives “hard shiny”, “shimmery black”, “echoey iridescent” etc. the aim is to paint a fleeting picture with words, not describe an accurate representation.
Thanks, that is good advice. You totally get it that I am trying to paint a future scene, but somehow did not deliver. This is the first time I wrote any long story in my life. I tried on my own kids but that is too small sample size.
How is explaining something with higher mathematics reasonable for childrens? Exponentials arent something you can use. Also shorter sentences are usually easier to understand.
Multiplication is repeated Addition. Exponentiation is repeated Multiplication.
assert 2+3 == 5
assert 2*3 == 6 == 2 + 2 + 2
assert 2**3 == 8 == ((2+2) + (2+2))
assert 2.5*2 == 5 == (2*2) + (0.5*2)
assert 2.5*10 == 25
assert 2.5*100 == 250
assert 2.5*104 == 260 == (2.5*100)+(2.5*4)
# f(x) = x+1
def f(x):
return x+1
assert f(0) == 1
assert f(1) == 2
assert f(999) == 1000
# N-th derivatives of displacement; velocity, acceleration, jerk, jounce
# (time t seconds, meters)
xyvals = [(0,0), (1, 10), (2, 120)]
# velocity:
10-0 / 1-0 = 10m/s
100-10 / 2-1 = 110m/sThat is a good concern. I have to find another way.
This is really neat! But if I can make a suggestion, a good and interesting explanation should use a strong analogy. A story wrapped around the explanation doesn’t do as much to help with understanding
Check out Code by Charles Petzold for what I personally consider the best example! The analogies build on each other in steps that never feel too complex in order.
Check out Code by Charles Petzold for what I personally consider the best example! The analogies build on each other in steps that never feel too complex in order.
Thanks. Will check that book out.
I like the motivation. I do not think the 'story' adds to the goal you seek to achieve.
The characters you have invented would suit a picture book. Yet the math and concepts you offer suit an older teen or adult.
Think again about your audience, and either offer a very simple and well explained text for upper teens, or a really dumbed down picture book for primary school.
Keep with it, go iteratively to seek regular feedback. Put it on Tik-Tok or some place you can reach out to the target audience.
The characters you have invented would suit a picture book. Yet the math and concepts you offer suit an older teen or adult.
Think again about your audience, and either offer a very simple and well explained text for upper teens, or a really dumbed down picture book for primary school.
Keep with it, go iteratively to seek regular feedback. Put it on Tik-Tok or some place you can reach out to the target audience.
At very beginning I want to do it in comic style, kinda like “beast academy” style. But my art skill sucks, and ai image generator is not as good as I hoped. So I settled with chapter book, at least something I can produce. May be I should go game style "book" to be able to reach younger readers.
Great stuff, reminds me a bit of https://archive.org/details/Gortek_and_the_Microchips_1984_C...
I think your language might be a little too sophisticated for your audience. Try to use shorter sentences and more common words.
Good luck!
I think your language might be a little too sophisticated for your audience. Try to use shorter sentences and more common words.
Good luck!
This is awesome. However, this is more for us generally technical people to go deeply technical and not likely to kids of today (perhaps in 100+ years as you said).
I have not written down but have bits and pieces of a long-ish story that I have been narrating to my 7-year old. And follows a similar cyberpunk post-human-collapse dystopian kinda scene -- a young brave 7-year old girl and her droid companion. This is to blend in and cross-over with her own story that she had been making up since a year or so - a mini-world of her own where every living thing is a clone of her -- a cat - yes, cloned from her; dinosaurs - yes, her clone.
Edit/Suggestion: I've an idea. Just don't specify this as for kids but for a generally smart young-adult.
I have not written down but have bits and pieces of a long-ish story that I have been narrating to my 7-year old. And follows a similar cyberpunk post-human-collapse dystopian kinda scene -- a young brave 7-year old girl and her droid companion. This is to blend in and cross-over with her own story that she had been making up since a year or so - a mini-world of her own where every living thing is a clone of her -- a cat - yes, cloned from her; dinosaurs - yes, her clone.
Edit/Suggestion: I've an idea. Just don't specify this as for kids but for a generally smart young-adult.
Interesting that it starts with the representation of data.
Too many introductions to computing and programming leave this fundamental part out and concentrate mostly on the imperative part, i.e. instructing the computer to perform actions in an already existing world.
Too many introductions to computing and programming leave this fundamental part out and concentrate mostly on the imperative part, i.e. instructing the computer to perform actions in an already existing world.
Learning about programming through storytelling?
Well I'm not in the target audience, but I like the style and I feel it's a lot less intimidating (and more interesting) than a typical book on programming computers. Pretty neat!
Well I'm not in the target audience, but I like the style and I feel it's a lot less intimidating (and more interesting) than a typical book on programming computers. Pretty neat!
Seems like a rough place to start.
Best start with like UX basics of a computer or a phone.
This is how you turn on a desktop, this is how you turn on a laptop and this is how you turn on a phone.
On phone you touch the screen or use buttons. On laptop and desktop there is a keyboard. On a laptop it is attached to the rest of the computer.
Desktops have monitors and everything is connected by cables.
Stuff like that.
Best start with like UX basics of a computer or a phone.
This is how you turn on a desktop, this is how you turn on a laptop and this is how you turn on a phone.
On phone you touch the screen or use buttons. On laptop and desktop there is a keyboard. On a laptop it is attached to the rest of the computer.
Desktops have monitors and everything is connected by cables.
Stuff like that.
In regards to criticism that the information is too esoteric for kids and how to make it more appealing, I strongly suggest watching this episode about computers from The Magic School Bus: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8WHahEKL1v0
It's obviously very dated today, but I really appreciated it as a kid when I saw it on TV.
It's obviously very dated today, but I really appreciated it as a kid when I saw it on TV.
Key question on children’s books: Who’s the illustrator?
Look at those pictures. Pretty obvious that they came from DALL-E.
Just like most of the text came from ChatGPT.
Blown away by how many people here are complimenting this awful project as if any real thought or effort went into it. It's just AI blogspam.
Just like most of the text came from ChatGPT.
Blown away by how many people here are complimenting this awful project as if any real thought or effort went into it. It's just AI blogspam.
I really like it. And, please, don't be discouraged by any HN commenters. Creation is the important act, not commenting.
Side note: I get a very Usborne vibe from your story. If you are not familiar, Usborne published a series of introductory computer books for young readers in the late 1980s that were well loved by a lot of us here on HN. You can probably find threads and links to copies of the material here.
Side note: I get a very Usborne vibe from your story. If you are not familiar, Usborne published a series of introductory computer books for young readers in the late 1980s that were well loved by a lot of us here on HN. You can probably find threads and links to copies of the material here.
Thanks. I will check it out.
> Cat pictures are ageless for little girls like her.
Is that a common stereotype? Felt unnecessary to me, especially for a narrative that bills itself as modern.
Is that a common stereotype? Felt unnecessary to me, especially for a narrative that bills itself as modern.
Thanks for the feedback. I changed the sentence to something else.
Thank you all for the feedbacks, and extra thanks for those who read all three chapters. The consensus is the content is too hard for younger readers and I agree. I do have some ideas to improve, and will work on them in the coming weeks.
And I will probably ask for feedback again soon.
And I will probably ask for feedback again soon.
"Binary" is a weird place to start. Even adults dont start there.
Yeah, it doesn't appear until page 26 of The Beginner's computer handbook
https://archive.org/details/beginnerscompute0000unse/page/26...
Or page 10 of Inside the Chip, illustrated with Tron cycles
https://archive.org/details/insidechip00hele/page/10/mode/2u...
It's on the cover of Machine code for beginners, but nobody read that one first. (It's available in full though, BTW.)
https://archive.org/details/machine-code-for-beginners
https://archive.org/details/beginnerscompute0000unse/page/26...
Or page 10 of Inside the Chip, illustrated with Tron cycles
https://archive.org/details/insidechip00hele/page/10/mode/2u...
It's on the cover of Machine code for beginners, but nobody read that one first. (It's available in full though, BTW.)
https://archive.org/details/machine-code-for-beginners
I have a computer science degree. The point is: binary is a boring thing and some what irrelevant to the computer CONCEPT, it only becomes relevant when you delve into logical gates and and stuff.
It's weird that someone would approach a book for kids the same way they do for adults. Instead of painting a top-down, inspiring picture, they start with some boring building block that's arguably not even on the critical path.
It's weird that someone would approach a book for kids the same way they do for adults. Instead of painting a top-down, inspiring picture, they start with some boring building block that's arguably not even on the critical path.
I think it is fine to start with binary. But what I need is REALLY simple examples of constructing with binary.
This is the first time I saw book in the form of a webpage. I really like it. Problem is that my children are don't speak English yet. I wonder if those storybooks also exist in other languages.
Hi, nice idea but it seems a bit complete for children, perhaps dedicated to teenagers? from what age?
What I'm more curious about is, how do you make children interested in this knowledge?
Neat! Thanks for sharing.
In chapter 1, change reminder to remainder.
In chapter 1, change reminder to remainder.
This is for geeky parents who think their kid will absolutely totally get it.
Starting with binary (wonderfully pointless), exponentials and walls of text just show how this is not actually for kids.
Starting with binary (wonderfully pointless), exponentials and walls of text just show how this is not actually for kids.
Yeah, I was hoping for more pictures and about two lines of text per page. This will work when he’s 15 or so.
You can hand a teen a college textbook and they’ll flourish if they have interest. There’s no audience here, sadly.
Kids are smarter than you think. A 7 year old could certainly follow anything, given the right instruction. If I can teach a 7 year old long division, I can teach them how a JK flip flop works.
Kids are smarter than you think. A 7 year old could certainly follow anything, given the right instruction. If I can teach a 7 year old long division, I can teach them how a JK flip flop works.
The main question would then be: why would anyone want to learn about flip flops. I dabble in Embedded Systems, prototype boards and the likes and still never really needed to know electronics as deeply as I had to study it at school. The need started and stopped at intellectually pleasing my teacher enough to get the grades I wanted.
Same with knowing how to use binary, I'd say outside of the education system, probably less than 1% of people ever need that type of knowledge. But most need problem solving skills and that's still not as readily taught unfortunately.
/edu-rant
Same with knowing how to use binary, I'd say outside of the education system, probably less than 1% of people ever need that type of knowledge. But most need problem solving skills and that's still not as readily taught unfortunately.
/edu-rant
It’s probably be interesting to teach binary in conjuction with decimal just for the knowledge that there’s nothing special about base 10? All your math still works fine when you have fewer symbols.
Yeah but I wonder if that is that an interesting realisation for a kid or perhaps it's better to wait and, if interested in mathy thing, blow their mind later on?
> A 7 year old could certainly follow anything, given the right instruction.
Sure, given enough interest. If I ask my 5 year old to figure out which Beyblade is strongest I’m sure he’ll keep at it for hours.
If I read him a story about something sciency it’s about 2 lines per page.
If I try to teach him the alphabet it’s a struggle to get even a single letter down.
Part of teaching effectively is knowing what you can get away with.
Sure, given enough interest. If I ask my 5 year old to figure out which Beyblade is strongest I’m sure he’ll keep at it for hours.
If I read him a story about something sciency it’s about 2 lines per page.
If I try to teach him the alphabet it’s a struggle to get even a single letter down.
Part of teaching effectively is knowing what you can get away with.
I second that, a few lines per page is all I (um, I mean my kids?) can handle!
[deleted]
Set 500 years in the future, the story follows two kids – one a robot, the other a human – as they explore the workings of what to them is ancient technology: our present-day computers. I’ve aimed to keep each story short and engaging, sprinkling in humor and illustrations to captivate young readers.
As an open-source project, you’re also welcome to check out the source here: https://github.com/yong/lostlanguageofthemachines