Racist plant names will change after historic vote by botanists(nature.com)
nature.com
Racist plant names will change after historic vote by botanists
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-024-02365-x
50 comments
A few years ago, I stumbled across a technical term in old patent filings that I'm pretty sure has been replaced by now: https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/62/28/01/cdb0d1c...
The mechanism in a steam-driven sawmill that holds the log in place and is adjusted when the angle or thickness of the cut needs to be changed.
https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/542122/origin-of...
https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/542122/origin-of...
Im not sure that one is unrelated to the offensive term.
We don't seem to care about soundalikes in other contexts like "chink in your armor" or "spick and span", so why go after obscure plant names that sound vaguely like obscure slurs in obscure languages if you squint your ears real hard? Maybe someone had a paucity of productive work to do so they came up with this project others couldn't criticize out loud without getting canceled?
But neither “chink” nor “spick” is even remotely as offensive as the N word. The fact that I won’t even use the word but I will use the other 2 is proof. I don’t think you would use the word either. If we assume that we’re dealing with a word of that caliber for South Africans, it’s understandable why they want it changed.
We could have an argument about whether we should even have words that have this kind of “Voldemort” power in our vocabulary, but at present we ascribe a lot of power to these words.
We could have an argument about whether we should even have words that have this kind of “Voldemort” power in our vocabulary, but at present we ascribe a lot of power to these words.
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For values of "we" denoting "normal, non-woke people"; yes.
Ordinary words in one language can sound like foul words or slurs in another language.
People who can't accept this are not yet adults emotionally.
Funny story: decades ago, I was riding a bus with a friend; we were conversing in a language in which the word fact sounds a lot like fucked, with an unvoiced d. Some old lady was giving us dirty looks. Yes, silly hag, we did not suffer a pointless vowel shift in our language; all the Latin-derived stuff (that also forms the basis of a lot of English) sounds close to the original!
Ordinary words in one language can sound like foul words or slurs in another language.
People who can't accept this are not yet adults emotionally.
Funny story: decades ago, I was riding a bus with a friend; we were conversing in a language in which the word fact sounds a lot like fucked, with an unvoiced d. Some old lady was giving us dirty looks. Yes, silly hag, we did not suffer a pointless vowel shift in our language; all the Latin-derived stuff (that also forms the basis of a lot of English) sounds close to the original!
Kefir is pretty close to kaffir, LOL.
I vote to rename kefir to "that sour drink formerly offensive to muslims".
I vote to rename kefir to "that sour drink formerly offensive to muslims".
Plant names are changing constantly anyway so this is not a big deal, just a nice thing to do.
We could also rename Harry Potter to Harry Clerk, to avoid the nasty racism of the producers of China Pottery.
Without asking J.K. what thinks about it of course. The opinion of the scientists that choose Erythrina caffra instead the much more acceptable "Soylent bland", does not matter anymore.
Without asking J.K. what thinks about it of course. The opinion of the scientists that choose Erythrina caffra instead the much more acceptable "Soylent bland", does not matter anymore.
I’m curious which direction the etymology goes. Often what starts out as an innocuous descriptive word gets negatively charged over time, for example “retard”.
Were the plants really named after a word for nonbelievers? Or is there a common root for both. For example if it started as a regional term it could have evolved into a slur.
I’m not opposed to the change, I just find it interesting/amusing from a cultural perspective if the euphemism treadmill is now extending to plants.
Were the plants really named after a word for nonbelievers? Or is there a common root for both. For example if it started as a regional term it could have evolved into a slur.
I’m not opposed to the change, I just find it interesting/amusing from a cultural perspective if the euphemism treadmill is now extending to plants.
South Park nailed it. Once you open this door all is an endless road of somebody, somewhere, feeling outraged by something, and demanding to be changed.
In the end the goal seems to destroy one of the few things that we still agreed to do collectively as human species. Using an universal way to name the creatures that live in the planet.
The same species will have different Scientific names for suiting the preferences of Chinese, USA, Brazilians or Russians. After all, it isn't "racist" not being able to use the Chinese alphabet on scientific names?
Scientists will be automatically tagged as belonging to ideology or political party by the names that they will choose to enforce.
Countries with republics will try to wipe names honoring the kings of monarchies that patronage the scientific expeditions.
They don't even understand, or even worse don't care, about the precedent that they are setting.
In the end the goal seems to destroy one of the few things that we still agreed to do collectively as human species. Using an universal way to name the creatures that live in the planet.
The same species will have different Scientific names for suiting the preferences of Chinese, USA, Brazilians or Russians. After all, it isn't "racist" not being able to use the Chinese alphabet on scientific names?
Scientists will be automatically tagged as belonging to ideology or political party by the names that they will choose to enforce.
Countries with republics will try to wipe names honoring the kings of monarchies that patronage the scientific expeditions.
They don't even understand, or even worse don't care, about the precedent that they are setting.
> The same species will have different Scientific names for suiting the preferences of Chinese, USA, Brazilians or Russians
Generally the sensitivities of Americans take precedence. I can think of many examples in many fields (e.g. the word "master" because of its strongest association in the US is with slavery, which is not true everywhere).
Generally the sensitivities of Americans take precedence. I can think of many examples in many fields (e.g. the word "master" because of its strongest association in the US is with slavery, which is not true everywhere).
I don’t disagree, but a counter point is that no one has ever agreed on everything - and colloquial names for species already exist — and that language drifts to and fro like a fog. Statis in connotation or denotation sounds somehow totalitarian to me. Even outside of colloquial speech and in the world of science, everything should be in flux, shouldn’t it?
The idea that the whole world would use the same language sounds much worse than the opposite: that different people would act differently.
The idea that the whole world would use the same language sounds much worse than the opposite: that different people would act differently.
> no one has ever agreed on everything
Every biologist since 1700 agreed to use the Taxonomic rules (or tried, and failed, to improve the system). This collective project is one of our main success as species. Or maybe we should say "it was", that building has eroded a lot in the last 100 years.
That congress is basically the mess what happens where all scientists had been replaced by politicians.
Every biologist since 1700 agreed to use the Taxonomic rules (or tried, and failed, to improve the system). This collective project is one of our main success as species. Or maybe we should say "it was", that building has eroded a lot in the last 100 years.
That congress is basically the mess what happens where all scientists had been replaced by politicians.
Languages force us to be aware of certain concepts. English forces us to always be aware of tense (past, present, future) and the gender of people. Some languages require you to be aware of the gender of inanimate objects. A language actually could evolve to force people to be aware of political affiliation, and it wouldn't even be that weird, although it would be divisive.
Scientific language is not like Portuguese or English. Is a language in the same way as math or music are languages. Is a method universal to name things unequivocally with a fixed set of rules --and-- to honor the people that sweated blood and tears to discover this organisms for everyone of us to enjoy them.
Introducing politics in scientific language, is as obnoxious as claiming that is unacceptable that a score contains more white notes than black notes.
Introducing politics in scientific language, is as obnoxious as claiming that is unacceptable that a score contains more white notes than black notes.
Do you realize this isn't a precedent being set now though? Species names change all the time, for a variety of reasons only some of them strictly scientific or out of actual taxonomic necessity. The hypotheticals you're alarmed at have already happened, in some cases over a century ago.
Species names change all the time for --Scientific-- reasons. That reflects that our knowledge about the species has improved. This move is totally unrelated with science, is bipartisan (not all scientists agree that the local toponym caffra is a racist word) and just adds a lot of confusion without improving our knowledge about the species.
Lol. Of all the stupid internet hills to die on, why did you decide to pick "racist plant names?"
Is the Kaffir lime [1] affected? It's a homonym.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaffir_lime
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaffir_lime
I was a working cook back then and we switched to makrut lime in like 2006. Line cooks not known particularly for delicate language or sensitivity fwiw.
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In my foodie circles I hear makrut lime more often.
Thank you! After reading the article that was my next question!
pvaldes(3)
If you've never heard of "caffra", you're not woke enough for this; just snooze your alarm and go back to sleep.
Can you explain how this comment? Many people avoid racism as a matter of course, and this seems rather niche at that. Are you suggesting not knowing a slur is itself racist?
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I'm saying you're not properly woke if you don't study and memorize the entire catalog of racist slurs in all the world's languages, and point out anything that is remotely similar.
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But is the plant name racist in the sense that when they named it, they were picking the slur purposefully? Or does the word simply _sound_ like the slur?
Even the latter can be enough if you consider what it would be like if name had the "N" word - or even something that had the same sound. You would literally be unable to use the plant name out loud. But it would be important for publications covering this to not call it a "racist plant name" as that really depends on how the name was given.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaffir_(racial_term)?useskin=v...