Ask HN: Are you interested in Stoicism?
9 comments
I'm not an expert on Stoicism, having read just a little bit about it. I do find it provides a helpful framework for developing and maintaining a bit of perspective, and in reducing anxiety, both of which I've always struggled with.
For example, in the context of HN: although I often find the content here inspiring, it can also be intimidating and discouraging. When I read about software engineers making $200k+, five times what I make, it makes me feel as though I've failed, or that I'm not cut out for the profession. Similarly, when I see the amazing projects, startups, and other technical achievements here, I often feel discouraged because I don't feel like I'll ever achieve that.
Stoicism focuses on what you have, not what you want. Negative visualization teaches us to appreciate the present: What if I lost the job I have? What if I lost my wife, my family? What if I'm badly injured and can't work at all? In that context, I can appreciate my job, even if it's not as good a job as I want. After all, I get paid enough to cover my bills, to sit in a squishy chair and think and solve puzzles. This helps relieve the anxiety I generate by foolishly measuring my self-worth by the yardstick of others' achievements. Ironically, this doesn't rob me of my ambition to improve my lot. Instead, I find that when I am calm and content, I have the energy and focus to do the studying and practice that I believe are necessary to do so. And most importantly: in the meantime, I've given myself permission to be happy today, not on the day in the future when I reach the ever-moving goalposts. Just as you would "bus-proof" a software development effort, you'll benefit from bus-proofing your happiness by appreciating what you have today.
For example, in the context of HN: although I often find the content here inspiring, it can also be intimidating and discouraging. When I read about software engineers making $200k+, five times what I make, it makes me feel as though I've failed, or that I'm not cut out for the profession. Similarly, when I see the amazing projects, startups, and other technical achievements here, I often feel discouraged because I don't feel like I'll ever achieve that.
Stoicism focuses on what you have, not what you want. Negative visualization teaches us to appreciate the present: What if I lost the job I have? What if I lost my wife, my family? What if I'm badly injured and can't work at all? In that context, I can appreciate my job, even if it's not as good a job as I want. After all, I get paid enough to cover my bills, to sit in a squishy chair and think and solve puzzles. This helps relieve the anxiety I generate by foolishly measuring my self-worth by the yardstick of others' achievements. Ironically, this doesn't rob me of my ambition to improve my lot. Instead, I find that when I am calm and content, I have the energy and focus to do the studying and practice that I believe are necessary to do so. And most importantly: in the meantime, I've given myself permission to be happy today, not on the day in the future when I reach the ever-moving goalposts. Just as you would "bus-proof" a software development effort, you'll benefit from bus-proofing your happiness by appreciating what you have today.
sounds a lot like "Go with the flow" and "Be thankful for what you got" -- conventional wisdoms that well rounded people manage to do without thinking.
I can relate to how HN can make you feel -- i just find it interesting how some people can deal with such feelings with ease without having to resort to reading books on life philosophy. I envy those people :)
I can relate to how HN can make you feel -- i just find it interesting how some people can deal with such feelings with ease without having to resort to reading books on life philosophy. I envy those people :)
I'm not an expert in philosophy, but stoicism is something I definitely look forward practicing to. I just finished reading http://www.amazon.com/Guide-Good-Life-Ancient-Stoic-ebook/dp... and Aurelius' Meditations.
The thing most resonates with me in stoicism is the fatalistic outlook. Everything that happens, has already happened and will continue to happen. Eases my anxiety.
The negative visualization described in the book is also a powerful technique. It puts one's petty problems into perspective and actually makes you grateful for things you have.
Overall, I think the central idea of it is the ability to feel joy - something that can be derived from the state of tranquility rather than pleasure of the senses. And of course, to treat other people to the best of your abilities and at the same time acknowledging how flawed beings we are.
The thing most resonates with me in stoicism is the fatalistic outlook. Everything that happens, has already happened and will continue to happen. Eases my anxiety.
The negative visualization described in the book is also a powerful technique. It puts one's petty problems into perspective and actually makes you grateful for things you have.
Overall, I think the central idea of it is the ability to feel joy - something that can be derived from the state of tranquility rather than pleasure of the senses. And of course, to treat other people to the best of your abilities and at the same time acknowledging how flawed beings we are.
Here is Book Three, paragraph 12 of The Meditations:
“If you do the task before you always adhering to strict reason with zeal and energy and yet with humanity, disregarding all lesser ends and keeping the divinity within you pure and upright, as though you were even now faced with its recall - if you hold steadily to this, staying for nothing and shrinking from nothing, only seeking in each passing action a conformity with nature and in each word and utterance a fearless truthfulness, then the good life shall be yours. And from this course no man has the power to hold you back.”
There is nothing fatalistic about that. Marcus Aurelius didn't sit on his hands and wait for the world to go by, he went out and fought for what he believed in.
Stoicism is acceptance of difficulty, not acceptance of fate; acceptance of what you cannot change but demanding of effort where you can make a difference.
Stoicism is a call to action in the here and now, not a cosy belief in reward in the afterlife:
"In death, Alexander of Macedon’s end differed no whit from his stable-boy’s. Either both were received into the same generative principle of the universe, or both alike were dispersed into atoms." (Book Six, 24)
See also a blog from my alma mater: http://blogs.exeter.ac.uk/stoicismtoday/what-is-stoicism/.
“If you do the task before you always adhering to strict reason with zeal and energy and yet with humanity, disregarding all lesser ends and keeping the divinity within you pure and upright, as though you were even now faced with its recall - if you hold steadily to this, staying for nothing and shrinking from nothing, only seeking in each passing action a conformity with nature and in each word and utterance a fearless truthfulness, then the good life shall be yours. And from this course no man has the power to hold you back.”
There is nothing fatalistic about that. Marcus Aurelius didn't sit on his hands and wait for the world to go by, he went out and fought for what he believed in.
Stoicism is acceptance of difficulty, not acceptance of fate; acceptance of what you cannot change but demanding of effort where you can make a difference.
Stoicism is a call to action in the here and now, not a cosy belief in reward in the afterlife:
"In death, Alexander of Macedon’s end differed no whit from his stable-boy’s. Either both were received into the same generative principle of the universe, or both alike were dispersed into atoms." (Book Six, 24)
See also a blog from my alma mater: http://blogs.exeter.ac.uk/stoicismtoday/what-is-stoicism/.
Mr Money Mustache has a good primer on the subject, he also recommends the same book. The rest of his blog is well worth reading too.
http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2011/10/02/what-is-stoicism-a...
http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2011/10/02/what-is-stoicism-a...
I don't know the name of this, but I summarized the teachings of masters I respect and came up with my own practice that deals mainly with constant elimination of guilt.
The way it works is that when you notice feelings of guilt (or any other negative emotion for that matter) you immediately redefine the situation to clearly explain to yourself why you did something (that you feel guilty about) and why it was the right thing for you to do.
The end result of it is higher self-esteem, ability to see things as they are and apparently more compassion toward others.
If you don't have a reasons to feel guilty you don't need to make others feel guilty to cover your own crap.
Another side of my practice is instead of "getting rid of negativity" you make it irrelevant by acting as if you already as positive and as happy as you want to be.
The way it works is that when you notice feelings of guilt (or any other negative emotion for that matter) you immediately redefine the situation to clearly explain to yourself why you did something (that you feel guilty about) and why it was the right thing for you to do.
The end result of it is higher self-esteem, ability to see things as they are and apparently more compassion toward others.
If you don't have a reasons to feel guilty you don't need to make others feel guilty to cover your own crap.
Another side of my practice is instead of "getting rid of negativity" you make it irrelevant by acting as if you already as positive and as happy as you want to be.
I've been interested since reading this 1999 article in the New York Times: http://www.nytimes.com/1999/01/02/books/think-tank-the-stoic...
That article led me to Epictetus' The Enchiridion, which was an easy way to start learning more. There's a free version at Gutenberg.org: http://www.gutenberg.org/files/45109/45109-h/45109-h.htm
That article led me to Epictetus' The Enchiridion, which was an easy way to start learning more. There's a free version at Gutenberg.org: http://www.gutenberg.org/files/45109/45109-h/45109-h.htm
I've been reading Bertrand Russell's A History of Western Philosophy, and I just finished the chapters of Hellenistic philosophies. Of those discussed, Stoicism seemed the least appealing. I frankly don't see the value in optimizing for some ill-defined "virtue". It seemed like a heuristic for finding utility rendered into a goal unto itself.
That could of course just be Russell's positivist bias speaking through, of course. I really ought to read some of the actual sources sometime.
That could of course just be Russell's positivist bias speaking through, of course. I really ought to read some of the actual sources sometime.
Stoicism is great, and is one of the things I am very passionate about. OP do you know any good communities online that focus on talking about stoicism?
Are you also interested in other school of philosophy? Which ones?(e.g. epicureanism, etc..)