== You are parroting talking points you see on social media without exploring the topics any further. Funny thing is I bet we follow a lot of the same left leaning people on twitter but the things they say have driven me to the right while you agree with them. I think most of the right wing social and traditional media personalities are idiots. My shift to the right has almost entirely been driven by the content of liberal twitter accounts and DEI classes I have had to take.==
I’m not on Twitter or any social media (besides HN). Must be nice to know everything about everyone without even having to bother with asking.
You gave me a whole profile of myself based on your mistaken beliefs. Then try to claim I am the one who judges people. Maybe time to take a break from social media.
== Right. I've been there in the business practices but I've never been a type-A black man trying to succeed against all odds in a racist nation. ==
This is exhausting. In your mind, one 75-year-old black man can speak for all of DEI, but actual Credit Union experts have no idea how to run Credit Unions. Meanwhile, the head of the CUs is a black man and also an expert in CUs. He succeeded against all odds in a racist nation, but you have completely de-valued his thoughts/experience because you dug in so deep.
== Right, and they also don't have anything to do with race quotas.==
Who mentioned quotas? This is the tactic you've shown over-and-over again in this discussion, continually throwing stuff at the wall to see what sticks. You move the conversation away from the actual topic to go down some rabbit hole.
2 Canadian cases that have nothing to do with American laws.
== If you're using something as a lead-in to a forbidden topic for your class's age range, it would be forbidden.==
I don't think displaying a picture of your family is "a lead-in to a forbidden topic". Feels like quite a stretch. I remember everyone of my teachers growing up had picture on their desk or on the wall. My son's teacher has them today.
== the teachers have a job to do. ==
We should let them do the job for which they studied and were hired. They are the experts in teaching, we should let them teach. How do you feel when people who know nothing about your industry tell you how to do your job?
But they didn’t only give loans to business who were shut down. That’s the point.
You claimed businesses got loans because the government forced them to close. I am saying that plenty of business that didn’t close (and saw record demand) sought and received loans. Nobody made them take out PPP loans. Once you acknowledge that, it looks a lot like student loans.
Re-read your quote, those weren’t Justice Thomas’s words. They are the words of a New Yorker writer. It’s not his quote. Also, DEI is not only about black people. Affirmative Action is not the same as DEI.
== By that rule everything such as encouraging eating more vegetables should be in there.==
Credit Unions, the ones who wrote the principles, don’t have anything to do with eating vegetables. They believe DEI to be topical for their business. Have you run a Credit Union?
I like how you dismiss their opinion on their business practices, while embracing one person’s view of affirmative action as the definitive statement on DEI. It’s quite a stretch.
No examples from Florida, the state being discussed. The two "articles" you did provide are sourced from the same author at the same publication "The National Desk" (owned by Sinclair Broadcasting). One the sources they use is The Epoch Times, which is not a reputable publication. Interesting source material for a self-proclaimed "Democratic party voter".
==What I have no interest in is anyone presenting either as an acceptable option to my kids.==
The alternatives are (1) pretending it doesn't exist or (2) presenting is as an unacceptable option. Do you prefer to pretend it doesn't exist?
==I would never want my coworkers to have to take classes on anti semitism because it assumes they are potential anti semites. ==
I don't follow. Everyone is a potential anti-Semite. If you aren't then the class shouldn't bother you. It's the same as the "shame" exercise. If you have no shame about your actions, why would it bother you?
==You seem to want to police people's minds and demand that every one adhere to your world view or they are terrible people.==
By banning books and outlawing what teachers can teach?
==This is not Iran, we don't need a morality police.==
And yet, we have Ron DeSantis, your guy, saving us from things that weren't being taught to kids in the first place. I couldn't think of a better example of morality police.
==Essentially the people that cry racism the most are generally the racists feeling like they have to white knight for the poor oppressed minorities. The worst part is that they just cant see it, most openly racist people can at least acknowledge it. Black people can do just fine on their own they are not helpless children looking for a hero.==
You are the only one who has made a claim about anyone being "helpless", but it's good to know that is immediately where your mind went. For someone who totally isn't racist, you seem to know exactly how racist people think.
No I did not. I echoed OP's comments and tried to follow their reasoning.
=="For [Justice Thomas], white benevolence denies black people the pride of achievement.....=
How is this related to DEI?
"As CUNA board chair, Smith had appointed a Diversity and Inclusion Ad Hoc Working Group and tasked its members with looking at the issue. In February, he wrote that their findings and his 40 years in the credit union movement told him the time had come to “officially recognize diversity and inclusion as part of the credit union philosophy.”
==Right, but why? The other principles are things that define credit unions.==
It's not a secret. Credit Unions (and co-ops) also employ people, so it makes sens from that angle, as well.
“Credit unions were established to serve specific – typically underserved – communities, making a place for those who had none. And today, our mission continues to be to provide opportunity and access for all."
And the future community is one that will include more minorities. Almost all growth in the U.S. population is coming from Hispanics, blacks, Asians and other minorities. The Census Bureau forecasts that non-Hispanic whites will be a minority of those ages 18 to 28 by 2028, and a minority of the total U.S. population by 2045.
“If we want to be more relevant to the communities we’re trying to serve, then focusing on becoming more diverse in our workforces really does matter,” Hansing said.” [1]
==Democrats nicknamed it the "don't say gay" bill but that isn't its name, its goal, or its outcome.==
The actual bill language sure makes it seems like the goal, as it was written with ambiguous phrases like "age-appropriate" and "developmentally appropriate":
"Classroom instruction by school personnel or third parties on sexual orientation or gender identity may not occur in kindergarten through grade 3 or in a manner that is not age-appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students in accordance with state standards." [1]
==It's about the age appropriateness of the introduction to the topic.==
Is it? I'm pretty sure it is grandstanding:
"one of the key reasons critics cited in saying the law was unnecessary was that teachers do not cover such subjects in early grades anyway." [2]
Lawyers disagree with you that it is only about "age appropriateness of the introduction to the topic":
"Workshops about the law that her school district’s legal team held over the summer caused confusion. Some staff said they were told teachers in kindergarten through third grade could not display pride flags or photos of their same-sex spouses." [2]
Are you sure your news didn't "rename and reframe" it?
==Florida republicans protected women's sex-based rights by making male-bodied people play sports on men's teams and the news called it "denying transgirls their human rights to play sports".==
Protecting one group's rights by denying another group's rights, similar to women and fetuses.
==rather has the school hook the child up with hormones and body modification without the parent's knowledge.==
I would love to hear more about all these cases. Can you share?
==WonderWonder is thinking of their children, and how they'll be told they're racist - and to sit in their shame - just because of their race.==
No, they were mentioning their own experience in a DEI class.
==I didn't have the feeling that it wanted me to "sit in my shame", it legitimately said it on a slide.==
Did you feel shame? If I was told that, and didn't feel shame, not sure I would have dwelled on it so much.
You do you. We make a very high income as well, and my politics have gone in the exact opposite direction as yours over 20 years. Over those 20 years, higher-educated and higher-earning Americans have become far more likely to vote Dem. You are actually swimming against the tide. I watched the affluent area I grew up in (DuPage County) move from bedrock Regan Republican to Democrat over my lifetime.
When Republicans failed to create a replacement for ACA after campaigning on it for ~8 years and 4 elections (2010, 2012, 2014, 2016); I realized they weren't actually interested in governing. DiSantis is the embodiment of that "bluster-over-policy" approach.
== In regards to the current upcoming state elections I am going to be selfish and focus only on what is best for my family for the next 4 years.==
I hope it works out for your family and also the many other families in Florida.
==covering employment costs due to lower demand, and to cover costs due to being shut down.==
Except that there wasn't lower demand across the whole economy, only very specific industries. Most businesses were not shut down. Lots of businesses continued running, and had increased demand. They still got forgivable loans.
Perhaps the perception it has more to do with who signed the legislation (a Republican President and Senate) than whether it was actually "socialist" (it was)?
We weren't talking about California, the topic was Florida. That said, California's Governor is trying to solve those issues through policy, Florida's Governor is focused on being "anti-woke". Meanwhile, California has a Maternal Mortality Rate of 4/100k, Florida's is 22/100k [1]. One out of every 4,500 Florida women forced to carry a baby to term will die.
Interestingly, the 7 best states for K-12 education are all pretty "woke" [2]. Florida is ranked 33rd in math scores and 22nd in reading, maybe we should be looking to them for best practices rather than focusing one something completely unrelated to actually educating youth.
Edit to add: My state Illinois has much higher standard for students than Florida, which basically grades proficiency on a curve. Lowering the standards rather than the hard work of actually improving education.
"In Illinois, a student needs to earn a level of 4 or 5 to be considered proficient. In comparison, the rigor of Florida’s standards ranks 39th and 42nd, respectively, and a student only needs to earn a level 3 on the state assessment to be considered proficient." [3]
==treated as a racist in training by taking a million anti discrimination classes or be insulted by a class telling me to "sit in my shame".==
I've never had that feeling in a DEI class. I wonder why that is your reaction. It may be worth exploring why discussing equity makes you feel like you are losing something. Maybe you had a bad instructor?
==If the child is gay or transgender on their own, so be it. School should not be the realm to promote it or suggest it.==
This is the sex-ed argument all over again. If we don't mention underage sex, it doesn't exist. Talking about gay people doesn't turn someone gay. Banning books and regulating what teachers can teach/say doesn't seem like a solution to the problem you mentioned. It seems the same as mandating abstinence.
I think DeSantis is the one engaging in social engineering, you just happen to agree with his policies. He is simply leaning into the culture wars which leads us to continued division without any actual solutions for the very real problems in our states/country.
I haven’t seen any evidence that being “anti-woke” improves K-9 test scores, lowers infant fatality rates, reduces mass shootings, improves quality of life, increases earnings, or any other actual benefit to citizens. It’s a distraction meant to prey on your emotions and hide the lack of actual policies.
My kids are also Jewish, from my wife’s side. It is interesting to hear the comments of people when they have no idea.
Voting for split representation is a perfectly reasonable approach. I personally think DeSantis is pro-power, not pro-freedom. His stunt with asylum-seeking migrants is a great example. Also the fact that Florida doesn’t have things like legal weed, legal sports betting, legal abortion, and more.
You asked why there was an eighth principle and that is because it was adopted by credit unions [1]. It doesn’t only apply to black people.
So you haven’t actually asked a black person if they are offended by it. It is in fact you who are offended by it. Makes much more sense.
What exactly is DeSantis’s “stance on this”? I know he championed a bunch of laws on what teachers can do/say, and which books are acceptable to read (i.e. regulations). I’m a father to two white boys. The world seems to be treating them just fine. They don’t seem like victims, to me.
==I have to think its tiresome from their point of view to constantly be reminded that white people see them as other.==
It’s interesting how you read DEI and immediately think it only applies to black people. Have you actually asked a black person what they think about it? If so, what did they say? If not, maybe you should.
What are the DEI policies that you support from the Republican candidate? I’ve never heard of that type of one-issue voter.
== You are parroting talking points you see on social media without exploring the topics any further. Funny thing is I bet we follow a lot of the same left leaning people on twitter but the things they say have driven me to the right while you agree with them. I think most of the right wing social and traditional media personalities are idiots. My shift to the right has almost entirely been driven by the content of liberal twitter accounts and DEI classes I have had to take.==
I’m not on Twitter or any social media (besides HN). Must be nice to know everything about everyone without even having to bother with asking.
You gave me a whole profile of myself based on your mistaken beliefs. Then try to claim I am the one who judges people. Maybe time to take a break from social media.