Intel Compute Stick(intel.com)
intel.com
Intel Compute Stick
http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/compute-stick/intel-compute-stick.html
340 comments
I find that Intel makes quite a few great products and initiatives. They just don't market it as loudly as others.
The Intel NUC (http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/nuc/overview.html) is quite a versatile machine - smaller, better performance and value for money than mac minis, and more hacker friendly. It even has a cute unboxing experience (The box plays the intel jingle when you open it)
Then there are initiatives like the Intel Realsense cam (like Kinect), Edison, Moblin( which morphed into Meego and later Sailfish). Intel often doesn't get the credit it deserves - Contributing to open source and open standards, having intervened in the markets when someone (usually Apple or Microsoft) got too dominant or comfortable(That was what Meego, Ultrabooks, NUC was about). They certainly make the market more interesting.
I guess this one is aimed at Android TV, and meant to level the field for Microsoft and Linux-based systems.
Then there are initiatives like the Intel Realsense cam (like Kinect), Edison, Moblin( which morphed into Meego and later Sailfish). Intel often doesn't get the credit it deserves - Contributing to open source and open standards, having intervened in the markets when someone (usually Apple or Microsoft) got too dominant or comfortable(That was what Meego, Ultrabooks, NUC was about). They certainly make the market more interesting.
I guess this one is aimed at Android TV, and meant to level the field for Microsoft and Linux-based systems.
I got my Dad a NUC for Christmas...He hasn't really been using it yet. I think this might have been a more interesting and simple gift, wish it came out in time. I did get to play with the NUC because I wanted to have it all configured and ready to use. It was interesting to see how they got all of the components packed in and I was impressed by the performance. Main issue I had was graphics support, because I wanted to put Elementary OS on it to see if he'd be interested in trying out Linux. Ended up going with the latest Ubuntu instead (Elementary OS Luna is built on Ubuntu 12.04) which worked fine.
My Dad had gone through a couple of those Shuttle "Mini" computers (the motherboards were Flex-ATX, slightly bigger than Mini-ITX and obviously needed to be smaller than micro-ATX), so I thought the NUC (between Nano-ITX and Pico-ITX [1]) might appeal to him. They both died and he's currently using a standard desktop. I believe one or both of his Shuttle's died due to a PSU failure, so it's nice to have the external power brick on the NUC.
He and my Mom had previously been using a Windows Media Center desktop with a tuner card and Comcast cable, but they're using DirecTV boxes on all the TVs now so not much need for a HTPC. He said he was thinking about trying to use the NUC with Windows 8 and a touch screen somehow...Not really sure how he can accomplish that. Besides introducing him to Linux, I was thinking he could use it on his TV as just an alternate computer and wanted to show him how to use Synergy to control it with his desktop keyboard/mouse. He's currently switching his TV between the DirecTV box and his desktop as a second display.
At the very least it's a backup, and he could potentially take it on trips as a more powerful alternative to a laptop. There's just so many different options for computing these days. It's like information overload, but with hardware.
[1] http://www.anandtech.com/show/5800/slimming-desktops-down-in... (existence of Nano-ITX and Pico-ITX pointed out in the comments)
My Dad had gone through a couple of those Shuttle "Mini" computers (the motherboards were Flex-ATX, slightly bigger than Mini-ITX and obviously needed to be smaller than micro-ATX), so I thought the NUC (between Nano-ITX and Pico-ITX [1]) might appeal to him. They both died and he's currently using a standard desktop. I believe one or both of his Shuttle's died due to a PSU failure, so it's nice to have the external power brick on the NUC.
He and my Mom had previously been using a Windows Media Center desktop with a tuner card and Comcast cable, but they're using DirecTV boxes on all the TVs now so not much need for a HTPC. He said he was thinking about trying to use the NUC with Windows 8 and a touch screen somehow...Not really sure how he can accomplish that. Besides introducing him to Linux, I was thinking he could use it on his TV as just an alternate computer and wanted to show him how to use Synergy to control it with his desktop keyboard/mouse. He's currently switching his TV between the DirecTV box and his desktop as a second display.
At the very least it's a backup, and he could potentially take it on trips as a more powerful alternative to a laptop. There's just so many different options for computing these days. It's like information overload, but with hardware.
[1] http://www.anandtech.com/show/5800/slimming-desktops-down-in... (existence of Nano-ITX and Pico-ITX pointed out in the comments)
> There's just so many different options for computing these days. It's like information overload, but with hardware.
Yeah. I have two Dreamplugs lying there unused at the moment, plus a CuBox used as NAS/TimeMachine, and a MicroPython waiting for some free time... so many options, so little time.
They are also getting so powerful, I'm seriously considering a few "enterprise" scenarios. Remember when IT meant mainframes, so individual departments would just bypass them and buy their own PCs? I think we're ready for a new wave of that decentralized approach: between mobile and these little bad boys, there's plenty of power around to run a number of applications that would have required a rack server 5 or 10 years ago. Now John Accountant could just buy a little silent box and put it on his desk, without having to go through hellish rounds of IT approvals.
Yeah. I have two Dreamplugs lying there unused at the moment, plus a CuBox used as NAS/TimeMachine, and a MicroPython waiting for some free time... so many options, so little time.
They are also getting so powerful, I'm seriously considering a few "enterprise" scenarios. Remember when IT meant mainframes, so individual departments would just bypass them and buy their own PCs? I think we're ready for a new wave of that decentralized approach: between mobile and these little bad boys, there's plenty of power around to run a number of applications that would have required a rack server 5 or 10 years ago. Now John Accountant could just buy a little silent box and put it on his desk, without having to go through hellish rounds of IT approvals.
> between mobile and these little bad boys, there's plenty of power around to run a number of applications that would have required a rack server 5 or 10 years ago. Now John Accountant could just buy a little silent box and put it on his desk, without having to go through hellish rounds of IT approvals.
Which would be nice, if we had the hardware of today with the IT practices of a time when enterprises might exert centralized control of departmental server purchases but not exert the same control over individual desktop system purchases and even the software installation on those desktops.
Which would be nice, if we had the hardware of today with the IT practices of a time when enterprises might exert centralized control of departmental server purchases but not exert the same control over individual desktop system purchases and even the software installation on those desktops.
Today, I was working at the HQ of a major UK telco. I connected my personal MBP to a random ethernet cable and lo, I could RDP on servers and do everything I wanted, without any prior authorisation. If you think all enterprise networks are as locked down as the ones found in banks, you're sorely mistaken. BYOD is a reality.
Since the silent box can run multiple VMs, it can be the equivalent of a small rack from yesteryear.
I suggest you put OpenELEC on it: dead simple distro for Kodi (XBMC) that just works! I used it to replace my WDTV Live that died recently and I couldn't be happier.
"I got my Dad a NUC for Christmas...He hasn't really been using it yet."
I never understood why he did that.
It was a good NUC and he needed a good NUC. If he had used it or even honed it, or took it out of his pocket and looked at it -- that's all he had to do.
I never understood why he did that.
It was a good NUC and he needed a good NUC. If he had used it or even honed it, or took it out of his pocket and looked at it -- that's all he had to do.
Pretty sure this comment flew East of most readers' heads. ;)
This. e.g., not many people know that Intel created OpenCV and open sourced it.
When I was in the market for a small low-power home server, I actually found the NUC's to be overpriced and under-performing.
There's no i7 option, and they will run you about the same base price as an Gigabyte Brix which does offer i7 and/or i5's with more powerful graphics (and AMD APU options for very nice graphics if required).
My home server did not require much graphics of course, but the i7 quad core is very much so a nice-to-have.
Even a Zotac Zbox with an i5 will get you more bang-for-the-buck since they are about $50-$100 cheaper, and come with more peripherals (like dual Gigabit ethernet ports).
There's no i7 option, and they will run you about the same base price as an Gigabyte Brix which does offer i7 and/or i5's with more powerful graphics (and AMD APU options for very nice graphics if required).
My home server did not require much graphics of course, but the i7 quad core is very much so a nice-to-have.
Even a Zotac Zbox with an i5 will get you more bang-for-the-buck since they are about $50-$100 cheaper, and come with more peripherals (like dual Gigabit ethernet ports).
I don't think Intel necessarily wants to dominate or even lead the market with these offerings, they want to spur the market to fill the niche now that they've shown the demand and the ability(and the parts for sale). Intel didn't want to sell ultrabooks itself, but it very much wanted a vibrant marketplace so it could sell more high-end parts, and keep Apple from leveraging their market position for better pricing from Intel.
I agree. I think they want to more or less be the apple of more open hardware. They aren't planning to make money off NUC, they're planning to make money off their chips. This is ultimately a strategy for getting more people to want more of their chip. Right now all the slickest devices are arm powered... so many shiny glassy sleek looking cell phones and tables and hardly an x86 in sight... They're not selling $/performance here, that's just a barrior to entry, they're selling a vision and a brand... intel inside
NUCs are the modern incarnation of Intel whitebox reference motherboards. If they were too cheap or tailored to specific use cases, OEMs would be out of business.
http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/nuc/products-overview... has i7 "coming Q2 2015. Prodict details coming soon" Number of cores? That page doesn't say.
> It even has a cute unboxing experience (The box plays the intel jingle when you open it)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjdyudYdIPc
That's very cute, however if it's the box that actually plays the sound isn't it terribly wasteful, ecologically?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjdyudYdIPc
That's very cute, however if it's the box that actually plays the sound isn't it terribly wasteful, ecologically?
The thing to do is to convert it into something like 'equivalent driven miles' and then calibrate your outrage to that number.
It's not the box, but a small plastic enclosure with some very cheap electronics (I believe they even used a led as a light sensor) and the battery lasts very very long. I wouldn't know on the impact of that on the ecology though. When it comes to recycling I remember from long long ago that PCB's have a pretty large ecological footprint, but than again, it's not part of the packaging, so it can be easily taken out and used for other purposes!
I was a little sad when I took mine apart to find that the chip was epoxied. I was hoping it would be something easily reprogrammable that I could give to my girlfriend to use at school (she teaches 3,4,5 year olds, so having a box that makes a noise when you open it is something that gets their attention).
After having received one from a vendor (Vidyo), I was looking into creating auto-playing video cards for my own company. It seems http://www.bigdawgspromo.com/ is one of the leading vendors, but their per-piece pricing is pretty hefty. Pretty neat stuff, and they are re-programmable.
Thanks for that link. For a long time I've toyed with the idea of a dedicated video card (as in business/greeting style); brings video to the self-containment of a book: immutable physical instance of content, including the reader/viewer. Still a bit aways from what I had in mind (think: little larger than a credit card, cheap) but well on its way.
That would have been too good to be true, haven't even thought about that!
I remember way back I was trying to make a cheap wifi-powered box with a display that could play short video's and stuff. The base idea came from https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ywr0A2aC_Jk, and I'd use a very cheap 3g-wifi router running openwrt as base. But in the end the firmware changed and made it impossible.
But nowadays with an arduino mini pro, i2c, cheap small displays or audio modules you can get a long way! It does however require you to purchase a lot of stuff like resistors, opamps, breadboards.. etc. And in theory, with the ESP8266-module you could make any device internet-connected.
I remember way back I was trying to make a cheap wifi-powered box with a display that could play short video's and stuff. The base idea came from https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ywr0A2aC_Jk, and I'd use a very cheap 3g-wifi router running openwrt as base. But in the end the firmware changed and made it impossible.
But nowadays with an arduino mini pro, i2c, cheap small displays or audio modules you can get a long way! It does however require you to purchase a lot of stuff like resistors, opamps, breadboards.. etc. And in theory, with the ESP8266-module you could make any device internet-connected.
there are birthday card that do the same, it's very little extra stuff compared to the computer itself, I imagine.
A birthday card that plays the Intel jingle would make a pretty good gift for a geek :P
The dirty relationship between life and entropy could be "hoard as much energy as possible, multiply and feel free to waste energy for fun."
Good point. However to me it still just seems terribly wasteful/stupid. Considering the aux battery in most computing devices, couldn't the musical thingie be embedded into the computer itself?
It is completely irrelevant, ecologically speaking.
> It is completely irrelevant, ecologically speaking.
How so? It makes the box unrecyclable; worse still, as soon as such an item is detected in the recycling plant it will often cause the whole batch of material to be rejected and dumped[1].
No-one has time to pick-through cardboard removing batteries and circuitry.
[1] Source: anecdote from a colleague who worked in a 'recyclarium'. Contaminated material causes the line to be stopped, batch dumped and machines cleaned.
The actual pre-processing sorting is quite fascinating, using spectrometers to detect the type of materials.
How so? It makes the box unrecyclable; worse still, as soon as such an item is detected in the recycling plant it will often cause the whole batch of material to be rejected and dumped[1].
No-one has time to pick-through cardboard removing batteries and circuitry.
[1] Source: anecdote from a colleague who worked in a 'recyclarium'. Contaminated material causes the line to be stopped, batch dumped and machines cleaned.
The actual pre-processing sorting is quite fascinating, using spectrometers to detect the type of materials.
From one of the comments above: "It's not the box, but a small plastic enclosure"
And while I sympathise, consider that this is part of packaging for a computer, where the manufacture of the computer itself will consume many times as many resources, and the power to use the computer over its lifetime will consume many times as many resources. With respect to the overall environmental impact of the purchase of that device, the inclusion of a device like that will be a rounding error.
And while I sympathise, consider that this is part of packaging for a computer, where the manufacture of the computer itself will consume many times as many resources, and the power to use the computer over its lifetime will consume many times as many resources. With respect to the overall environmental impact of the purchase of that device, the inclusion of a device like that will be a rounding error.
It's not really an excuse to waste more resources though. Saying "this only wastes a tiny amount of resources compared to this other thing" isn't justification to waste it anyway.
It's not just the NUC; don't forget the Minnowboard Max, which is also Intel-sponsored at least. It has slightly lower specs than this stick, but it's still far more powerful than the R-Pi and great for home automation work. I've got a couple here and I have no real complaints.
Looks like they just got a version bump http://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-nuc-broadwell,28344.h...
I hope they make one with a full size HDMI (maybe even HDMI 2?) next year.
Most of those examples were tech demonstrators and reference designs, AFAIK. A small number of units, if any, were available. I don't recall many partners bringing them to market. Intel's not in the business of selling a couple thousand of these units, they're looking for OEMs to pick it up and sell millions. Or at least shape/gauge the future market.
Exactly. Intel seems to be mainly interested in selling more processors and motherboards to OEMs than anything else. Intel seems to intervene on occasion to shake things up or show OEMs how its done. For eg., the Ultrabook was to help laptop manufacturers who were getting clobbered by Apple. NUC was so that OEMs would build competitors (like the Gigabyte BRIX Pro) to the Mac Mini and so on.
That is because their target customer has never been the end user. How many people with a smart phone have heard of Qualcomm?
Well. Intel has always pitched themselves to the end-customer. The 'Intel Inside', Ultrabook, etc., campaigns have all been so that the customer insists on an Intel device.
This kind of branding is called ingredient branding. They try to remain visible as the supplier of a component. Intel is the textbook example.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ingredient_branding
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ingredient_branding
But that's not to sell to the end user, but to make the ability to put those Intel Inside etc. stickers on your product a valuable feature for OEMs when considering whether to buy from Intel or a competitor.
Do they also have a laptop variant? Their Hardware is actually quite awesome - especially for Linux users
I was forced to use NUCs for a project. They were under powered for me. All I needed to do was draw 5 fullscreen quads at 1920x1080 but all they could handle was 4 fullscreen quads at 1280x720.
I'm sure they're great for some things so YMMV
I'm sure they're great for some things so YMMV
To be fair, that is a big requirement... Loads of mid to high end graphics cards from just a few years backfail at dual QHD screen.
I power 2x 1920x1080 screens off of a NUC and am very happy.
I power 2x 1920x1080 screens off of a NUC and am very happy.
No, it isn't.
1920 * 1080 pixels * 5 * 60 = 622MPixel/s of fillrate required.
Radeon 9700 Pro, high end from over 10 years ago, had a fillrate of 2600MPixels/s
Let's take a high end graphics card from a few years back, say... GTX 480? A 2010 card? That has a fillrate of 33,600 MPixels/sec.
5x 1920x1080 quads is child's play for any reasonable desktop GPU part. In fact high end cards from 2009 could game at 5760x2160 (that's 6x 1920x1080 displays) off of a single card.
1920 * 1080 pixels * 5 * 60 = 622MPixel/s of fillrate required.
Radeon 9700 Pro, high end from over 10 years ago, had a fillrate of 2600MPixels/s
Let's take a high end graphics card from a few years back, say... GTX 480? A 2010 card? That has a fillrate of 33,600 MPixels/sec.
5x 1920x1080 quads is child's play for any reasonable desktop GPU part. In fact high end cards from 2009 could game at 5760x2160 (that's 6x 1920x1080 displays) off of a single card.
Was that an Ivy Bridge or Haswell GPU?
> The Chromecast was a no-go
I find that the Chromecast is the perfect tech item. It does a few things and does them extremely well. Part of the reason why it out sold and is out used more then any other media player.
I find that the Chromecast is the perfect tech item. It does a few things and does them extremely well. Part of the reason why it out sold and is out used more then any other media player.
I've personally found the Chromecast to be a little underpowered in a lot of circumstances, particularly when it comes to mirroring a tab with a video playing. I ended up ordering one of those Fire TV sticks because Gary Busey told me to, and because it has way better specs; still waiting for it to arrive, but a couple of family members have already tried it out with a lot of success, and I imagine it'll go well with the Fire HDX my grandma got for Christmas.
Meanwhile, this Intel stick looks even better. Between this and the announcement of a new NUC with an i7, it looks like I'll be saving up for a couple more Intel-powered Linux devices this year.
But yeah, the Chromecast is still handy sometimes, and it does do some things well (like YouTube and Pandora). It's just not always the best fit for everyone.
Meanwhile, this Intel stick looks even better. Between this and the announcement of a new NUC with an i7, it looks like I'll be saving up for a couple more Intel-powered Linux devices this year.
But yeah, the Chromecast is still handy sometimes, and it does do some things well (like YouTube and Pandora). It's just not always the best fit for everyone.
Got my Fire TV stick before Christmas (impulse purchase when it was available for $19). I find it to be a much more useful device in general. Actually being able to select apps/videos through a UI on-screen is much better than dealing with a separate device, and having a dedicated remote to be more usable as well. The videos themselves seem play better.
I now use that over the PS4 for streaming video now. Chromecast I found really only useful for casting Youtube videos, which is a really niche use for a dedicated device.
I now use that over the PS4 for streaming video now. Chromecast I found really only useful for casting Youtube videos, which is a really niche use for a dedicated device.
I also bought mine for $19. It is used for streaming Amazon Prime. I tried to like it but using my phone and computer with Chromecast is so much easier. 50%+ of my use is to watch YouTube videos with Family and Friends.
>particularly when it comes to mirroring a tab with a video playing.
That has nothing to do with the processing power of the Chromecast and everything to do with the casting system. It's all just a video stream to the Chromecast.
That has nothing to do with the processing power of the Chromecast and everything to do with the casting system. It's all just a video stream to the Chromecast.
True, but I wouldn't have had to resort to tab mirroring if Chromecast supported Amazon Prime Video.
Which, admittedly, is also not a Chromecast issue per se, but since the Fire TV stick does support it (for obvious reasons), and since I ought to be watching videos and justifying my Prime membership, it'll probably end up being the more useful product to me. An Intel stick would probably end up being even more useful, since I wouldn't be at the mercy of Amazon to provide support for things (and would instead be at the mercy of XBMC or Kodi or whatever the hell it's called now to provide support for things).
Which, admittedly, is also not a Chromecast issue per se, but since the Fire TV stick does support it (for obvious reasons), and since I ought to be watching videos and justifying my Prime membership, it'll probably end up being the more useful product to me. An Intel stick would probably end up being even more useful, since I wouldn't be at the mercy of Amazon to provide support for things (and would instead be at the mercy of XBMC or Kodi or whatever the hell it's called now to provide support for things).
I love my Chromecast but I think the major reason it has done well is the price. $30 is still fantastic.
It is an interesting comparison. You could buy 5 Chromecasts for the price of one of these Intel sticks, so it seems not a fair comparison. BUT, chances are you really are going to only use one or the other, so in that way it is necessary to decide.
They are apples vs oranges.
Chromecast = Media Player
Stick = Computer
I am still thinking I want a NUC though.
Chromecast = Media Player
Stick = Computer
I am still thinking I want a NUC though.
Just seconding that opinion. I love my chromecasts. Using it with videostream on an Android phone is a great combination.
How do you know how much it's going to cost? I don't see that information anywhere.
Ah. Thanks for the link.
The 149$ version comes with Windows 8.1 Preloaded. The linux version is 89$.
Intel Linux support is usually pretty good so that Linux option is certainly appealing.
What a price difference. Wow. Dozens, nay, hundred of hours learning Linux finally pays off. Seriously now, I'm really pleased to see that you can choose Linux and pay so much less. Of course on a relatively more expensive machine that difference isn't much, but it's certainly a stark difference on such a cheap device.
Edit: I see there's a hardware difference too. That's a bit of a shame. I wonder what corporate forces are in action here..
Edit: I see there's a hardware difference too. That's a bit of a shame. I wonder what corporate forces are in action here..
I don't think it's evil corporate forces. They wanted a "budget" one with lower specs and realised they could reduce the price further by removing the Windows license.
I doubt it's actually that much of the price tag.
I doubt it's actually that much of the price tag.
Considering Microsoft is giving away Windows 8.1 "with Bing" free for small devices[1], I doubt the OS has any bearing on the price difference.
[1] http://www.howtogeek.com/195934/what-exactly-is-windows-8.1-...
[1] http://www.howtogeek.com/195934/what-exactly-is-windows-8.1-...
You're probably right. I didn't mean evil corporate forces. I will certainly concede that I used the wrong term. I was earnestly curious what the justification was. I should've said "business justification" or some such, given the (reasonable) interpretation of what I actually said.
> Wow. Dozens, nay, hundred of hours learning Linux finally pays off.
Eh, the hundreds of hours I spent learning Windows were much less useful to me.
Eh, the hundreds of hours I spent learning Windows were much less useful to me.
The Linux version has only 1GB RAM and only 8GB onboard flash.
Once again Linux is the "cheap" option. Linux isn't used by people to save the license cost and well I know I have a much greater need for RAM compared to the average computer user. So I would buy a $149 version then have to install Linux on top of that.
Sure, but Linux can also generally run much more efficiently than Windows. I think having Linux on the cheap version could conceivably be both a cut in licensing fees and also a way to make economy hardware specs viable.
I mentioned it above, but there is no license fee for Windows 8.1 with Bing. It's completely free for OEMs to sell on their hardware, they just can't modify the search settings at install time. The user can do whatever they want with the search settings, and it's a full 8.1 install from a technical viewpoint.
Basically, the difference in price between the two SKUs is purely hardware based. So, buy whichever hardware you need, and install GNU/Linux.
On a side note, I have an HP Stream 7 tablet with an Atom CPU and 1GB RAM, and it runs 8.1 very well. I'd imagine even the lower spec SKU of the Intel stick would run it fine. Storage space would be the only real issue for that OS.
Basically, the difference in price between the two SKUs is purely hardware based. So, buy whichever hardware you need, and install GNU/Linux.
On a side note, I have an HP Stream 7 tablet with an Atom CPU and 1GB RAM, and it runs 8.1 very well. I'd imagine even the lower spec SKU of the Intel stick would run it fine. Storage space would be the only real issue for that OS.
I wonder how big the gap is now. It would be interesting to see some benchmarks comparing Windows 8.1 with Bing (where the 32-bit version runs in 1GB) with an equivalent full-spec Linux.
That's a good point, the recent push by Microsoft towards mobile devices has undoubtedly led to significant improvements. Without some hard data I am certainly being speculative, just speaking from experience.
More than enough to run XBMC (multimedia) or File server (own cloud, bittorrent sync, etc...).
For something less than an AppleTV, that is indeed appealing.
I don't know, but since its form-factor and size puts in direct contention with Android Sticks (which go for about 60$), it should be priced similarly. Also it has to be cheaper than the cheapest Celeron-based Intel NUC(140$). So i expect the price should be somewhere in between.
If it is better it could cost more. Some people probably thinks a full Windows/Linux computer is worth more than an Android stick.
Web design/business fail: The page is lacking a "Register to get updates" form. I find this to be a common frustration point for industrial product companies. Their websites typically have different degrees of sucking.
Hardware design fail: A male HDMI connector on something this big is a bad idea. You don't want to hang this kind of weight (imagine USB other cables connected to it) off an HDMI connector on a TV or monitor. The female connectors are not designed as load-bearing devices. It'd be far better to put a female HDMI connector on the stick and let people use a proper HDMI cable.
Hardware design fail: A male HDMI connector on something this big is a bad idea. You don't want to hang this kind of weight (imagine USB other cables connected to it) off an HDMI connector on a TV or monitor. The female connectors are not designed as load-bearing devices. It'd be far better to put a female HDMI connector on the stick and let people use a proper HDMI cable.
Surely you can get an extension HDMI cable if that bothers you.
Haven't you heard of MK809 dongle? Quad core, much cheaper than Intel, with full Android unlike Chromecast, able to install Linux distribution: http://amzn.com/B00EE4KKDA
I am of two minds about Intel. Lately they have been producing some fairly interesting products. But at the same time they have a virtual stranglehold on the x86 ISA.
Really? PS4 and Xbone are AMD, and selling like truckloads.
Yes, it is an odd development. But then what is now AMD's GPU division, ATI, used to be THE supplier of console gaming GPUs.
Sure, there are issues with the ARM world. But i kinda prefer the vibrant market there over the 2 1/2 horse race that is x86.
Sure, there are issues with the ARM world. But i kinda prefer the vibrant market there over the 2 1/2 horse race that is x86.
Many ARM CPUs are licensed transistor layouts from ARM. There's only a handful of companies actually designing their cores. Most of the diversity comes from the other bits of silicon in the SoC, but there's plenty of diversity in the x86 motherboard space too.
For Xbox 360 and WiiU, the PS3 had an nVidia GPU
Vishera is a beast. Love it. And I fell in love with this intel gadget which I wasn't expecting.
Hardware like that makes me yearn for one with no wireless and a pair of Gigabit Ethernet ports to use as a firewall and server.
It's fairly interesting to note what it's not: Android or Chrome OS. I suspect Microsoft will do quite well out of this, especially in the digital signage market, anywhere which is reasonably price sensitive but if developer time and cost can be reduced then they get a lot of leeway.
Still, yet another reminder that the cost of computing is collapsing. Most of the cost here is Intel margin and in the case of the more expensive one MS licenses.
It's fairly interesting to note what it's not: Android or Chrome OS. I suspect Microsoft will do quite well out of this, especially in the digital signage market, anywhere which is reasonably price sensitive but if developer time and cost can be reduced then they get a lot of leeway.
Still, yet another reminder that the cost of computing is collapsing. Most of the cost here is Intel margin and in the case of the more expensive one MS licenses.
> Hardware like that makes me yearn for one with no wireless and a pair of Gigabit Ethernet ports to use as a firewall and server.
Unfortunately, general purpose hardware and operating system needs a fair amount of juice to route and inspect 1gbps of traffic.
Best performance per watt I've found is the Edgerouter Lite but that has dedicated routing acceleration hardware to achieve what it does with the little mips processor it has.
Closest you'll find is Soekris, ALIX or APU for a routing platform. A Beaglebone black makes a nice little box for lightweight serving on its own.
Unfortunately, general purpose hardware and operating system needs a fair amount of juice to route and inspect 1gbps of traffic.
Best performance per watt I've found is the Edgerouter Lite but that has dedicated routing acceleration hardware to achieve what it does with the little mips processor it has.
Closest you'll find is Soekris, ALIX or APU for a routing platform. A Beaglebone black makes a nice little box for lightweight serving on its own.
+1 for the ERLite; it's a MIPS62r2 Cavium Octeon with 512MB RAM[1]. With the latest firmware, it's running Debian Wheezy, and I've had no trouble with adding the normal Debian repos and adding things like Privoxy to it (though I suspect these would be overwritten in a FW update). With Privoxy loaded and being used as an HTTP proxy for my local net with the EasyList rules, it doesn't break about 5%CPU with 100mbit/sec of inbound traffic and some web browsing going through it (I'm running NAT as well).
Being honest, it's a bit hacky for consumers...you'd be good to know Vyatta (what it uses under the hood) to get the most out of it, since there are still some things the web UI can't do (L2TP VPN being one, or PPTP without a Radius server for auth). However, it's a heck of a lot cheaper, smaller, and more power efficient than my previous P4 box running pfSense with Intel Pro/1000GTs, so I'm pretty happy with it.
I do think it'd be super awesome if Ubiquiti released a pfSense or m0n0wall-based EdgeRouter with the same hardware acceleration...I'd gladly pay $200 or so for that, but the ERLite is damn hard to beat for $100.
1. http://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/MIPS/ERLite-3
Being honest, it's a bit hacky for consumers...you'd be good to know Vyatta (what it uses under the hood) to get the most out of it, since there are still some things the web UI can't do (L2TP VPN being one, or PPTP without a Radius server for auth). However, it's a heck of a lot cheaper, smaller, and more power efficient than my previous P4 box running pfSense with Intel Pro/1000GTs, so I'm pretty happy with it.
I do think it'd be super awesome if Ubiquiti released a pfSense or m0n0wall-based EdgeRouter with the same hardware acceleration...I'd gladly pay $200 or so for that, but the ERLite is damn hard to beat for $100.
1. http://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/MIPS/ERLite-3
Check out the Intel Atom Avoton and Rangley SOCs. Nice x86 cores, ECC, crypto acceleration, VT-x, passive TDP, and 4x 1/2.5gbe or 1x 10gbe depending on the serdes. I only wish they had VT-d to get sr iov. If you really need more connectivity going the trident + Intel + cumulus white box switch rate has crazy throughput per watt.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silvermont
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silvermont
Can you shed more light/context on "trident + intel + cumulus". I'm familiar with cumulus but not trident.
Sure. By "trident" I really mean any merchant silicon switching platform. The Broadcom Trident ASIC/chipset really kicked this market segment off in 2011/2012ish. I mentioned it specifically as products like the Juniper QFX3500 series really opened up the door for things like fat/high radix clos networks that we're seeing in production.
From memory the Trident boxes supported 640gbs of throughput on SFP+ or QSFP ports, about 10,000 prefixes/routes, a couple thousand ACL terms, 1 or 2u, and around 200watts. They cost maybe $20,000 at launch are down to $5-10,000 now depending on volume and vendor. That's great for a TOR or agg switch if you can manage the individual devices (as opposed to a switch chassis like a nexus 7K).
The other thing those really opened up is cheap as chips edge devices. 10,000 routes isnt a lot, but it works if you have limited peers or can do summarization off device like a route reflector. These chipsets, and trident in particular, also work great with things like OpenFlow as you move that expensive route computation off device to a specialized platform.
The trident platform is basically EOL'd, everyones moved on to Trident II for the most part. Trident II is like 100,000 prefixes, 50,000 ACLs, 1 or 2u, 200 to 400 watts, 1.2TBs of forwarding, and SFP+/QSFP ports. Price is $15-25,000 depending on volume and vendor etc. Pushing 640gbs of throughput for ~$20,000 is pretty crazy. It means I could build a single 10kVa server rack that pushes a legit 1tbs of traffic to the internets for about $200,000. Totally insane to think about compared to just a few years ago.
The next big change should be moving from 10/40 serdes to 25/100 in the next year or so. The Broadcom Tomahawk should be like 3tbs in 2u and a couple hundred watts for comparable prices. If you need to convert between 10/40 and 25/100 ("gearbox") cost and complexity will go up a bit.
http://etherealmind.com/merchant-silicon-vendor-software-ris... http://whiteboxswitch.com/collections/10-gigabit-ethernet-sw...
edit: and to clarify these platforms usually use Intel CPUs to run the OS/route engines. The OS/RE/HAL, like cumulus provides, is then responsible for pushing updates down to the switching asic.
From memory the Trident boxes supported 640gbs of throughput on SFP+ or QSFP ports, about 10,000 prefixes/routes, a couple thousand ACL terms, 1 or 2u, and around 200watts. They cost maybe $20,000 at launch are down to $5-10,000 now depending on volume and vendor. That's great for a TOR or agg switch if you can manage the individual devices (as opposed to a switch chassis like a nexus 7K).
The other thing those really opened up is cheap as chips edge devices. 10,000 routes isnt a lot, but it works if you have limited peers or can do summarization off device like a route reflector. These chipsets, and trident in particular, also work great with things like OpenFlow as you move that expensive route computation off device to a specialized platform.
The trident platform is basically EOL'd, everyones moved on to Trident II for the most part. Trident II is like 100,000 prefixes, 50,000 ACLs, 1 or 2u, 200 to 400 watts, 1.2TBs of forwarding, and SFP+/QSFP ports. Price is $15-25,000 depending on volume and vendor etc. Pushing 640gbs of throughput for ~$20,000 is pretty crazy. It means I could build a single 10kVa server rack that pushes a legit 1tbs of traffic to the internets for about $200,000. Totally insane to think about compared to just a few years ago.
The next big change should be moving from 10/40 serdes to 25/100 in the next year or so. The Broadcom Tomahawk should be like 3tbs in 2u and a couple hundred watts for comparable prices. If you need to convert between 10/40 and 25/100 ("gearbox") cost and complexity will go up a bit.
http://etherealmind.com/merchant-silicon-vendor-software-ris... http://whiteboxswitch.com/collections/10-gigabit-ethernet-sw...
edit: and to clarify these platforms usually use Intel CPUs to run the OS/route engines. The OS/RE/HAL, like cumulus provides, is then responsible for pushing updates down to the switching asic.
Thanks, that was really helpful.
Any thoughts on the just announced Annapurna purchase? I know it's not apples to apples but would be interested to hear your thoughts.
Any thoughts on the just announced Annapurna purchase? I know it's not apples to apples but would be interested to hear your thoughts.
I have a vague memory that FreeBSD does ship with the binary blobs for the acceleration, so pfsense might be doable. I did install FreeBSD on mine for a while, but you need some external setup to build packages as there isnt enough storage for the ports tree and no mips binary packages.
There are ARM CPUs available that do network forwarding in hardware. Some even support iptables rules.
I would be very surprised if a quad-core current-gen Atom could not do that in software, though. I could route 300Mbps through OpenBSD's pf on an AMD Geode.
I would be very surprised if a quad-core current-gen Atom could not do that in software, though. I could route 300Mbps through OpenBSD's pf on an AMD Geode.
There's a lot out there that can do NAT and some firewalling in software at large fractions of a gigabit/s for pretty cheap. But if you throw in QoS and queue management the CPU requirements get very high by the standards of MIPS and embedded x86. And unfortunately, none of the network acceleration hardware you'll find on any of those SoCs has anything like a hardware implementation of fq_codel or even RED.
The CeroWRT project has been searching for more than a year for a new generation of hardware to use as the platform for their development of better router software. There's nothing affordable that can keep up with the really fast DOCSIS connections available while doing anything intelligent on a per-packet basis.
The CeroWRT project has been searching for more than a year for a new generation of hardware to use as the platform for their development of better router software. There's nothing affordable that can keep up with the really fast DOCSIS connections available while doing anything intelligent on a per-packet basis.
How about running the packet filter in a dual-NIC VM on a VT-d capable PC? Dell T20 has Xeon E3 for $500 with 1TB disk and 4GB RAM. Add a PCI NIC for firewall purposes and still have the rest of the PC for use to run other VMs. GPU can be passed through to another VM.
Yeah, using desktop-class hardware works almost effortlessly, but it's not really a good substitute for a $120 router that gets by with passive cooling. This discussion is about whole computers that could hide inside the power supply for that server and run off its standby power rail.
If you're going to be running a server 24/7 anyways, it makes sense to equip it to also be your firewall and gateway. But that doesn't eliminate the huge gap between such a machine and off-the-shelf consumer networking equipment.
If you're going to be running a server 24/7 anyways, it makes sense to equip it to also be your firewall and gateway. But that doesn't eliminate the huge gap between such a machine and off-the-shelf consumer networking equipment.
It may become easier for consumers to buy a general-purpose PC once and change software as needed, rather than chasing the ever moving ceiling of low-end disposable hardware.
I've lost track of the number of cheap special-purpose appliances I've bought, which turned out to have limitations not present in a general-purpose PC. Consumer routers and NAS devices are already in this category, soon to be joined by compute sticks.
The problem is that buyers rarely know which part of the long tail they may need later. As Intel motherboards converge into a SoC and peripherals support USB3.1+, hopefully we end up with a future that looks like Google's Project Ara, i.e. small modules.
I've lost track of the number of cheap special-purpose appliances I've bought, which turned out to have limitations not present in a general-purpose PC. Consumer routers and NAS devices are already in this category, soon to be joined by compute sticks.
The problem is that buyers rarely know which part of the long tail they may need later. As Intel motherboards converge into a SoC and peripherals support USB3.1+, hopefully we end up with a future that looks like Google's Project Ara, i.e. small modules.
L7 SPI is expensive whereas simple routing of 1 Gbps usually demands only a single core and 64-128 MiB of RAM. Large production shops have such FE load balancer / router boxes in HA mode (ie CARP) that barely break a sweat.
What about an Orange Pi? Comes with Gigabit and a dedicated ethernet chip.
> Hardware like that makes me yearn for one with no wireless and a pair of Gigabit Ethernet ports to use as a firewall and server.
Yeah, me too.. I currently use a fan-less Via board with integrated 686 compatible CPU. It's been great, but it's now 7 (?) years old so it might be time for an upgrade. Wonder if they still make them, they never got the attention they deserved.
Edit:
The boards are called EPIA and come in different sizes: http://www.viaembedded.com/en/products/boards/
Mine has this processor - It's not Intel or AMD, but "Pentium compatible" :)
Seems like these haven't matured a lot, and are expensive and hard to come by compared to other mini-itx boards. Do like the fanless, integrated processor on mine though, and that the power consumption is really low.
Yeah, me too.. I currently use a fan-less Via board with integrated 686 compatible CPU. It's been great, but it's now 7 (?) years old so it might be time for an upgrade. Wonder if they still make them, they never got the attention they deserved.
Edit:
The boards are called EPIA and come in different sizes: http://www.viaembedded.com/en/products/boards/
Mine has this processor - It's not Intel or AMD, but "Pentium compatible" :)
cpu0: VIA Esther processor 1000MHz ("CentaurHauls" 686-class) 1 GHz
Seems like these haven't matured a lot, and are expensive and hard to come by compared to other mini-itx boards. Do like the fanless, integrated processor on mine though, and that the power consumption is really low.
There are fanless Atom motherboards with dual ethernet. Should be a painless upgrade for you when that time comes.
Microsoft made licenses for their OS's free for anything under 9 inches.
Not sure it applies to this, since it doesn't have a screen. Windows is used in a lot of embedded applications, and I think we still charge for that (disclaimer: unknowledgeable Microsoft employee).
They'll go great lengths to prevent Linux from getting any more exposure than Windows on any format. A zero or negative-cost license is to be expected.
For embedded applications? Those aren't exactly visible; as a consumer, you can't really tell if it is running windows or not. Anyways, I'm not sure.
I thought that was for devices with screens under 9 inches, e.g phones and some tablets. Is there still no charge if it doesn't have a screen?
You'd think not because desktop PCs, ultra compact PCs (NUC, Brix) by definition don't come with a screen either - screens are add ons. I think the 9" rule basically applied to mobile devices only, i.e. tablets and smartphones.
Is that for OEMs or for end users? I thought it was just for OEMs.
>Hardware like that makes me yearn for one with no wireless and a pair of Gigabit Ethernet ports to use as a firewall and server.
You may want to take a look at these:
http://www.hystou.com/products/fanless-computers/celeron-103...
It's small and fanless with dual gigabit ethernet ports. I use one with VyOS as a dedicated firewall/router/VPN client.
Disclaimer: I bought mine from a 3rd party seller (via taobao) and not that site, although I believe they are the manufacturer.
You may want to take a look at these:
http://www.hystou.com/products/fanless-computers/celeron-103...
It's small and fanless with dual gigabit ethernet ports. I use one with VyOS as a dedicated firewall/router/VPN client.
Disclaimer: I bought mine from a 3rd party seller (via taobao) and not that site, although I believe they are the manufacturer.
> Most of the cost here is Intel margin
Hard to say. Intel has taken a loss on their mobile division lately [1], and I'm assuming this is a mobile-class processor. ARM has had them spooked, enough to make a major shift into mobile-first development and offering heavy discounts (or perhaps even selling at cost or at a loss) on mobile hardware.
[1] http://www.zdnet.com/article/intel-to-merge-pc-and-mobile-pr...!
Hard to say. Intel has taken a loss on their mobile division lately [1], and I'm assuming this is a mobile-class processor. ARM has had them spooked, enough to make a major shift into mobile-first development and offering heavy discounts (or perhaps even selling at cost or at a loss) on mobile hardware.
[1] http://www.zdnet.com/article/intel-to-merge-pc-and-mobile-pr...!
I run one of these and I am quite happy with it:
http://archlinuxarm.org/platforms/armv7/marvell/mirabox
The arch support is good (apart of wireless).
http://archlinuxarm.org/platforms/armv7/marvell/mirabox
The arch support is good (apart of wireless).
$149 for Windows 8.1 version and $89 for Linux version, not bad.
via: http://techreport.com/news/27619/intel-compute-stick-is-a-14...
via: http://techreport.com/news/27619/intel-compute-stick-is-a-14...
... and the Linux version will have half the RAM (1GB instead of 2GB) and a fourth the storage (8GB instead of 32GB).
I think I might pass on this.
I think I might pass on this.
Yup. Seems like pointless, instant-gratification consumerism when server boxes are far faster, cheaper and greener. Worse, it's an un-upgradable device to buy and throw away. Anyone that needs more horsepower, it's far simpler to either trade up, use a real server or just use a cloud/VPS similar to AWS.
"server boxes are far faster, cheaper and greener. Worse, it's an un-upgradable device to buy and throw away."
How many of these devices would you have to buy and throw away to match the environmental material footprint of even one 1U rack-mount server? They're tiny. Orders of magnitude matter.
(Similar effect: However "disposable" USB flash drives may superficially seem, compared to the floppies they replaced they are nothing. And I do not just mean that the USB sticks can hold lots of stuff... I mean that if you pile a normal computer user of the 2015 era's USB sticks in one pile, and a normal computer user of the 1990 era's floppy disks into another pile, the floppies would tower over the entire pile of USB drives and almost certainly have a much larger environmental footprint. I hedge only for the possibility that the nasty flash memory might dominate the floppies manufacturing, but the floppies do irreducibly have an awful lot more plastic in them, so I'm still guessing the floppy pile comfortably "wins".)
How many of these devices would you have to buy and throw away to match the environmental material footprint of even one 1U rack-mount server? They're tiny. Orders of magnitude matter.
(Similar effect: However "disposable" USB flash drives may superficially seem, compared to the floppies they replaced they are nothing. And I do not just mean that the USB sticks can hold lots of stuff... I mean that if you pile a normal computer user of the 2015 era's USB sticks in one pile, and a normal computer user of the 1990 era's floppy disks into another pile, the floppies would tower over the entire pile of USB drives and almost certainly have a much larger environmental footprint. I hedge only for the possibility that the nasty flash memory might dominate the floppies manufacturing, but the floppies do irreducibly have an awful lot more plastic in them, so I'm still guessing the floppy pile comfortably "wins".)
Floppies are plastic and vinyl. Flash drives require an entire foundry worth of heavy metals and exotic compounds. I doubt it is the clear win you think.
How many of these sticks, powered hubs and controlling computers would you have to buy to equal one green 1U server? On the order of 64 USB sticks, 15 powered hubs AND one computer... That's 15 cheap bricks and a computer's power supply that have to be made and suck down power versus a quality, high-efficiency switching PSU that is about ~98% efficient. Doing the math on the supply chain sourcing of each component is pointless, because it wouldn't be practical, and at present, it's impossible to source all materials from goods to actual, verified origin (not shady middlemen).
Also, how much power would be lost by all those cheap bricks compared to a single, efficient switching power supply?
It also would be 65 systems to maintain.
Renting a fraction (via cloud/VPS) of a green server (good PUE DCs and LP gear) is far cheaper and greener. But more importantly, waste fewer computing resources.
Also, how much power would be lost by all those cheap bricks compared to a single, efficient switching power supply?
It also would be 65 systems to maintain.
Renting a fraction (via cloud/VPS) of a green server (good PUE DCs and LP gear) is far cheaper and greener. But more importantly, waste fewer computing resources.
How does a cloud VM satisfy the 'intel stick' use-case? Where is the HDMI port?
Also, since you're piling on every possible thing you can to make your case, you should also include the power systems of every networking device between your cloud VM and you.
Also, since you're piling on every possible thing you can to make your case, you should also include the power systems of every networking device between your cloud VM and you.
What use case? They are already loads of TV tuner cards that are cheaper and exist.
The stick in question is not a TV tuner card. It is a full-fledged PC.
It's been too long since I built a PC so I'll take your word on the faster/cheaper argument, but greener? Can you really build a server box that uses less power than a 1-2A USB device?
>Can you really build a server box that uses less power than a 1-2A USB device?
Not sure, but I think the point was that its "greener" because you can swap out individual parts over time using the same case and ultimately producing less waste. You may also argue that individual components are easier to recycle.
Not sure, but I think the point was that its "greener" because you can swap out individual parts over time using the same case and ultimately producing less waste. You may also argue that individual components are easier to recycle.
At scale, compute boxes are rarely upgraded because it's TCO cheaper to invest in newer systems (or CPU, mb, RAM). IOW, it's cheaper to wait and refresh everything, that is unless you're adding RAM, CPUs or disks.
If form factors don't change, reusing the mounting hw, PSUs and enclosures can be doable. Some web shops wait until boxes die entirely before replacement while IT shops lifecycle out all gear (usually everything but racks) in 4-6 years.
These hotdog USB sticks aren't upgradable at all and they're limited to the processing power of 5-10W.
If form factors don't change, reusing the mounting hw, PSUs and enclosures can be doable. Some web shops wait until boxes die entirely before replacement while IT shops lifecycle out all gear (usually everything but racks) in 4-6 years.
These hotdog USB sticks aren't upgradable at all and they're limited to the processing power of 5-10W.
Compare oranges-to-oranges or it's a straw man: Using an equal fraction of an efficient server is undoubtedly.
You've missed the point that this isn't about horsepower but about being a "set top box". I can't connect AWS to my television.
It has USB and microSD slots. This device is clearly not intended for serious computing, but it is more like a general purpose media device. Like a Chromecast/FireTV that is 100% customizable.
Reminds me of the tail end of netbooks. After MS had resuscitated XP via a restrictive OEM license, and Intel had cooked up the first gen or so of Atom...
Linux will probably run fine on those specs, remember Windows has a ton of overhead in terms of RAM and storage.
I'm not really concerned about whether Linux will run 'fine' on less hardware, I'd just want to be able to purchase the higher-end (hardware-wise) version.
I'm not going to buy the high-end version if it requires me to buy the prepackaged Windows license however.
I'm not going to buy the high-end version if it requires me to buy the prepackaged Windows license however.
Windows 8.1 with Bing version is free (as in free beer), you don't have to buy it. It is just pre-installed and can be removed.
Yeah, its strange that the OS is preinstalled, whereas with the Intel NUC I believe it comes without an OS and you need to do the setup yourself, which is preferable.
It may be preferable to you, but it's certainly not for the intended audience.
[deleted]
Windows will run amazing on these and all things considered storage isn't an issue. They have really optimized for ultra small devices and id be willing to bet windows 8.1 on these would be super awesome actually. My daughters tablet with similar specs but only 1gb of ram is smooth as can be.
This raises an interesting question.
How much memory does Mac OS X Yosemite need?
How much engineering effort is spent on optimization and improving performance, as opposed to changing the look'n'feel and adding consumer-focused features?
How much memory does Mac OS X Yosemite need?
How much engineering effort is spent on optimization and improving performance, as opposed to changing the look'n'feel and adding consumer-focused features?
Apple works hard on power efficiency. You don't get high battery life for free. Memory usage may get less attention, but, for example, they do 'swap' to memory by compressing pages (does it help? I wouldn't know. Read http://dfrws.org/2014/proceedings/DFRWS2014-1.pdf)
Edit: oops. That paper isn't evaluating performance, as I thought it would.
Edit: oops. That paper isn't evaluating performance, as I thought it would.
Anyone else have 100% CPU storeaccountd with iBooks offline?
Looking at the ubuntu system requirements page, they say: "From experience, we all know that it is recommended to have 2048 MiB RAM to properly run a day to day Ubuntu." .
Of course you can run something else, but for a hassle free experience , ubuntu seems like the best choice.
Of course you can run something else, but for a hassle free experience , ubuntu seems like the best choice.
With Unity you certainly need more RAM but nothing prevents one from installing another wm like xfce, awesome or lxde to save a ton on RAM and run just fine on 1 Gb.
That's simply not true.
I'll happily buy the higher-end version and handle the Linux install myself, as long as I can remove the Windows license and get a subsequent refund from Microsoft.
But if thats not possible then I'll just wait until some other manufacturer makes a bad-ass Linux version for the same price, or less ..
But if thats not possible then I'll just wait until some other manufacturer makes a bad-ass Linux version for the same price, or less ..
That actually seems expensive for a device without a screen or input devices.
I wish that Chromecast and Apple TV supported an open standard for streaming rather than everyone using their own proprietary standards.
I wish that Chromecast and Apple TV supported an open standard for streaming rather than everyone using their own proprietary standards.
Prices are getting low enough that Microsoft could sell people a copy of windows with a desktop computer bundeled in for free.
"Bookmark this page, and then set a reminder to check in soon." this is how product announcements work these days?
Would've been nice to have a bit of actual information.
Would've been nice to have a bit of actual information.
I just wish there was a standard through which one could contact a server on a regular basis and ask for a well formatted list of updates from a logical channel. I think I would call it Atom ... no, that's too common of a name. I would call it really simple syndication. That's a much catchier name.
I wonder if anyone could use a standard like that, if such a thing existing and worked really well with a boatload of software.
Or, like one of the child comments said: send me an email. I'm not yet to the point of adding calendar entries to "check back soon" for a website.
I wonder if anyone could use a standard like that, if such a thing existing and worked really well with a boatload of software.
Or, like one of the child comments said: send me an email. I'm not yet to the point of adding calendar entries to "check back soon" for a website.
They should at least collect emails, but, I guess, they expect a new wave of PR when it actually launches.
When companies have actual competitive value to offer, marketing is easier. I guess.
Like Edison did. Or didn't. Did that ever launch?
Yes, but it's overpriced and the specs are poor (when compared to other embedded-like solutions)
I'm quite happy with an edison board for $50. Is that overpriced?
Haters gonna hate. Microsoft, Intel, Google - these brands are never cool for some ungrateful as where we are today is in big part thanks to those three.
There's always https://www.changedetection.com that will let you know...
seriously, what a bunch of dinosaurs
Honestly, I'd rather see that instead of the current version which is "Give us your email, and then spam all your contacts, and maybe we'll bump you up on the exclusive early beta list".
Half of these companies think they're launching a cure for cancer delivered via an exclusive nightclub with the "beta signups".
Half of these companies think they're launching a cure for cancer delivered via an exclusive nightclub with the "beta signups".
TBH, early adopters have no problem giving their email for these kind of stuff. Even weirder is your conclusion that if you give someone your email he can spam your contacts, which he obviously can't.
He meant sites offering you a free product or a months worth of credit for sending a message to X of your friends if they sign up as well (and if they're smart they get your friends email addresses like that even if they don't sign up)
What do you suggest that would be better and also not upset people?
"TV sticks" of this form factor have been all the rage on AliExpress, DealExtreme, and the like, although their popularity seems to have waned somewhat compared set-top-boxes (I read somewhere that it was due to trouble managing heat while customers demanded more powerful processors, but I don't know). See http://www.google.com/cse?q=tv+stick&sa=&cx=partner-pub-8120... and http://liliputing.com/?s=tv+stick
They've mostly run on ARM and Android, with some hobbyists loading more traditional Linux distros on. Probably the most notable exception that I know of is the following: http://liliputing.com/2014/12/100-bay-trail-pc-stick-can-run...
If this is priced well it will be interesting to see how it impacts that landscape.
They've mostly run on ARM and Android, with some hobbyists loading more traditional Linux distros on. Probably the most notable exception that I know of is the following: http://liliputing.com/2014/12/100-bay-trail-pc-stick-can-run...
If this is priced well it will be interesting to see how it impacts that landscape.
This has already been done by some Chinese manufacturers, http://www.szapec.com/default.asp?id=1793, and the Meegopad (http://www.cnx-software.com/2014/10/15/meego-t01-hdmi-tv-sti...).
And given that the Intel's Linux version will only have 1GB of RAM, and maybe a slower CPU than a Windows version, these Chinese alternative could get quite a bit more attractive, given that their price will go down in time as well.
And given that the Intel's Linux version will only have 1GB of RAM, and maybe a slower CPU than a Windows version, these Chinese alternative could get quite a bit more attractive, given that their price will go down in time as well.
I was pleasantly surprised to find the Intel NUC ("next unit of computing ", sigh) devices recently - I've bought one and it sits under my TV. Having a full PC instead of a Chromecast/Roku stick/whatever really is awesome. Not only can I use every streaming option out there, I can also browse the web and order food, look up maps, etc. etc.
It'll be interesting to see how these perform, but if they are similar to the NUC units, they'll be worth the extra money. The only complaint I have with mine is actually software based - I can't find a way to make the Windows 8.1 tiles larger (and more suitable for TV viewing distances)
It'll be interesting to see how these perform, but if they are similar to the NUC units, they'll be worth the extra money. The only complaint I have with mine is actually software based - I can't find a way to make the Windows 8.1 tiles larger (and more suitable for TV viewing distances)
This post and comments thread have brought the NUC to my attention for the first time and they look really cool. Curious, though, how did you handle storage? It appears they don't ship with memory? Do you just install your own in its chassis or use external?
I currently "tab cast" from a laptop running Chrome to a Chromecast for viewing non-video web content on the big screen, but these NUCs look really cool. I can totally see the value in having a full blown PC like an NUC or this compute stick as well.
I currently "tab cast" from a laptop running Chrome to a Chromecast for viewing non-video web content on the big screen, but these NUCs look really cool. I can totally see the value in having a full blown PC like an NUC or this compute stick as well.
The NUC we just got at work to play around with uses standard laptop size RAM in 2 SO-DIMM slots.
For storage, there are two NUC models - a slimmer one has just room for an mSATA SSD, then there is a thicker one the mSATA/mini-PCIe slot with a standard 2.5" mounting tray.
You will still have to get a WiFi adapter if you need WiFi. There are lots of standard half-size mini-PCIe WiFi cards.
Not sure how the video works yet, but if you order one make sure to get a mini-HDMI to HDMI or a mini DisplayPort to regular DisplayPort adapter.
For storage, there are two NUC models - a slimmer one has just room for an mSATA SSD, then there is a thicker one the mSATA/mini-PCIe slot with a standard 2.5" mounting tray.
You will still have to get a WiFi adapter if you need WiFi. There are lots of standard half-size mini-PCIe WiFi cards.
Not sure how the video works yet, but if you order one make sure to get a mini-HDMI to HDMI or a mini DisplayPort to regular DisplayPort adapter.
You have to add SO-DIMM RAM and a mSata drive.
There's also a mini PCI-e for a Wifi card.
Somewhat similar open-hardware project that'll ship in March: https://www.crowdsupply.com/inverse-path/usb-armory (I'm not involved with the project)
There have been so many ARM mini PCs over the last couple of years, this one is vastly different from those and the one you posted in that this one will be x86.
Fascinatingly in one of the comments sections, someone referred to this product which looks like it's almost exactly the same product, just not directly made by Intel: http://de.aliexpress.com/item/2014-Original-MeegoPad-Meego-T...
Why this is interesting to me is that most of the popular hot-dog-on-a-stick devices run some crappy, limited, or proprietary OS (although if you have time to invest, many can be upgraded to Linux). But this one will ship with Linux or Windows.
For some decent background info on this form factor, see: http://www.stickcomputing.com
For some decent background info on this form factor, see: http://www.stickcomputing.com
As the power increases beyond Atom processors, I think this will be very compelling.
I'd love to be able to unplug a dongle from my desktop monitor at home, and plug it into a tablet sized device to use on the train, then plug it into my monitor when I get to work, or a hotel rooms tv screen, or the presentation screen in our office conference room, etc. etc.
I'd love to be able to unplug a dongle from my desktop monitor at home, and plug it into a tablet sized device to use on the train, then plug it into my monitor when I get to work, or a hotel rooms tv screen, or the presentation screen in our office conference room, etc. etc.
Wouldn't that often just be easier if it were your phone, so you didn't have to carry multiple devices?
Yes, phone would be ideal, but I think we're seeing that a phone OS is usually quite stripped down vs a desktop.
Though I haven't tried the Ubuntu Touch stuff, so maybe that is the right solution.
Pluging an HDMI or USB dongle into a display is pretty simple, I suspect pairing with your phone would be more difficult, or would require cables and such.
Though I haven't tried the Ubuntu Touch stuff, so maybe that is the right solution.
Pluging an HDMI or USB dongle into a display is pretty simple, I suspect pairing with your phone would be more difficult, or would require cables and such.
I was really stoked when the Motorola Atrix came out, and was hoping that would turn into a trend:
http://www.phonearena.com/reviews/Motorola-ATRIX-4G-Laptop-D...
http://www.phonearena.com/reviews/Motorola-ATRIX-4G-Laptop-D...
I'm not clear how these work: is the idea that each device (desktop, tablet, etc) has a CPU and this is an additional CPU, so you're basically carting around your own VM and the host equipment can let you play in it's garden or not, complete with network access?
Why is it that I don't see many corporate IT departments adopting this?
Why is it that I don't see many corporate IT departments adopting this?
It's a full, separate system on a USB stick. This means it will need to patched and maintained, and that apps and dats will still need the usual back-and-forth sync of multiple systems.
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Cool.
Close, but not what I need. What I want (& maybe others?) is:
Compute on a stick that's a VM. Then, I can plug this into my laptop's HDMI or USB port to work on my project's local data/apps that's inside the VM.
Then I can take the stick when I travel, instead of taking my laptop. I can plug the stick into any laptop for full keyboard/trackpad. Or, I could plug the stick into a TV/monitor & use my phone/tablet's IO (keyboard/touch) over the same wifi. (Yes, the stick would need a minimal host OS to run a VM on a dumb monitor.)
Small local storage (working cache) with the rest in the cloud.
If such a device exists, please educate me/us.
Close, but not what I need. What I want (& maybe others?) is:
Compute on a stick that's a VM. Then, I can plug this into my laptop's HDMI or USB port to work on my project's local data/apps that's inside the VM.
Then I can take the stick when I travel, instead of taking my laptop. I can plug the stick into any laptop for full keyboard/trackpad. Or, I could plug the stick into a TV/monitor & use my phone/tablet's IO (keyboard/touch) over the same wifi. (Yes, the stick would need a minimal host OS to run a VM on a dumb monitor.)
Small local storage (working cache) with the rest in the cloud.
If such a device exists, please educate me/us.
This is totally unfeasible unfortunately. Either you support running the VM on the stick inside the host device's OS (supporting every major OS), without requiring root access nor installing anything. Or you boot from the stick and include display, keyboard and mouse/trackpad/touch drivers for every potential device you're going to plug it into. And for your last option (TV/monitor using phone/tablet IO) you'll also need an app for Android, iOS, Windows Mobile etc.
Without metric tons of engineering effort for a questionable use-case. The cheaper and more sensible options are: bigger laptop or run the workload elsewhere.
I appreciate your inputs, but IMO this use case is kind of inevitable.
Yes, it's hard, and not quite doable today. But, there are millions of people working on making the components of this solution better.
It's so attractive to carry around a computer in our pockets (our "phones") and it's really not much of a stretch to envision a near future where the thing in our pocket is our "local data/projects" that we can plug into any larger display or keyboard /IO on demand.
Before you know it, it's going to seem archaic to have local working data on any other device than the one in your pocket. And it's going to seem archaic that any nice large interface (screen or keyboard) is tied to only 1 device.
Yes, it's hard, and not quite doable today. But, there are millions of people working on making the components of this solution better.
It's so attractive to carry around a computer in our pockets (our "phones") and it's really not much of a stretch to envision a near future where the thing in our pocket is our "local data/projects" that we can plug into any larger display or keyboard /IO on demand.
Before you know it, it's going to seem archaic to have local working data on any other device than the one in your pocket. And it's going to seem archaic that any nice large interface (screen or keyboard) is tied to only 1 device.
I agree and thought of that a couple years ago. The issue is that it takes a loong time to converge APIs of desktop and mobile. Plus, there are power and cooling issues. Next, stuffing in a CPU and GPU that can satisfy both requirements is basically asking for completely new cores that can do high power and low power. Cooling for 3D desktop games would require tradeoffs.
The issue is whether it's worth having a bicycle that can turn into a car and a car that can turn into a bicycle. Most of the time, the execution on these is terrible at both.
The issue is whether it's worth having a bicycle that can turn into a car and a car that can turn into a bicycle. Most of the time, the execution on these is terrible at both.
> Small local storage (working cache) with the rest in the cloud.
> Before you know it, it's going to seem archaic to have local working data on any other device than the one in your pocket.
These requirements seem to contradict each other. Do you want a thin/cloud client or offline compute?
Moka5 has an offline compute offering, http://www.moka5.com/2014/10/21/comparing-moka5-livepc-vs-vm...
> Before you know it, it's going to seem archaic to have local working data on any other device than the one in your pocket.
These requirements seem to contradict each other. Do you want a thin/cloud client or offline compute?
Moka5 has an offline compute offering, http://www.moka5.com/2014/10/21/comparing-moka5-livepc-vs-vm...
Does Moka5 have something new eg they're still alive?
Moka5 was basically running apps on packaged VMware hypervisors on Mac and Windows endpoints, but centrally-managed like Citrix Metaframe.
The better approach is simply wrap the app up in a read-only bundle, use an fs driver to redirect writes to a shadow vol and deploy it to endpoints without having N addl VMs to manage (so it can work ThinApp or client-side.). Even the OS minus config should really be a verifiable, read-only archive.
Disclaimer: I've had mtgs with Monica at Stanford. The similar word from both Citrix and Vmware is that that neither could develop sustainable professional relationships for an acquisition event to occur. Sad, but typical.
Moka5 was basically running apps on packaged VMware hypervisors on Mac and Windows endpoints, but centrally-managed like Citrix Metaframe.
The better approach is simply wrap the app up in a read-only bundle, use an fs driver to redirect writes to a shadow vol and deploy it to endpoints without having N addl VMs to manage (so it can work ThinApp or client-side.). Even the OS minus config should really be a verifiable, read-only archive.
Disclaimer: I've had mtgs with Monica at Stanford. The similar word from both Citrix and Vmware is that that neither could develop sustainable professional relationships for an acquisition event to occur. Sad, but typical.
My 2c ... I see a problem with it not being able to fit into the HDMI ports on my TV ... due to the design of the TV there is only room for a compact HDMI cable (the port is located in a small recessed section). In this case I'd need to connect it with an HDMI extension cable, and would end up having to mount the dongle itself somewhere.
Its probably better to buy an ultra compact PC such as an Intel NUC or Gigabyte Brix, which come with VESA mounts for mounting onto the back of the TV, and store data on an SSD drive.
Its probably better to buy an ultra compact PC such as an Intel NUC or Gigabyte Brix, which come with VESA mounts for mounting onto the back of the TV, and store data on an SSD drive.
Amazon Fire TV Stick came with just a 3 inch HDMI 'extender' cable to fix this problem.
Articles online say this will ship with an HDMI extender, which is pretty standard, honestly. Every one of these HDMI dongle computers I've bought like Chromecast came with one.
NUC and Brix are also more powerful. I could almost see myself carrying one of these around like I used to carry around a USB memory stick. Plug it into any monitor or TV and I've got a computer. Not sure what I would do about mouse a keyboard, though.
Bluetooth mouse / keyboard
Having public places like schools, libraries and even the local Starbucks just have a stack of Bluetooth peripherals and screens whilst you carry your own computer in your pocket would suit so many people.
Laptops are great but clunky and not really solving the issue of computing without lugging it around. Tablets are great but are exceeding difficult to work on at the moment.
This will be a fine middle ground.
Laptops are great but clunky and not really solving the issue of computing without lugging it around. Tablets are great but are exceeding difficult to work on at the moment.
This will be a fine middle ground.
Tablets are great but are exceeding difficult to work on at the moment.
How so? Something like a Surface seems fine if you need a tablet for work.
I think the peripherals dock would be a decent solution for certain environments (schools, libraries, maybe hospitals, military bases, cruise ships, and such), but relying on public places to have well-kept and generally available peripherals would be folly.
How so? Something like a Surface seems fine if you need a tablet for work.
I think the peripherals dock would be a decent solution for certain environments (schools, libraries, maybe hospitals, military bases, cruise ships, and such), but relying on public places to have well-kept and generally available peripherals would be folly.
Is it expectable that this will ship with Intel Management Engine?
And if so why is it that 4 hours after posting there is no mention of this? We should be asking these questions upfront.
And if so why is it that 4 hours after posting there is no mention of this? We should be asking these questions upfront.
Do Intel Atom chipsets support an AMT / ME processor? ARK has no mention of AMT: http://ark.intel.com/products/82116/Intel-Atom-Processor-Z37...
http://www.pymnts.com/in-depth/2014/intel-adds-encryption-to... says, "The protocol, code-named Baker Beach, “adds an extra layer of software to protect the payment process .. software resides and runs on the Intel chipset for enhanced security .. tablets with the Intel Atom processor code-named Bay Trail-T and future Intel Atom processors,” will also work ...Intel’s position is that it’s approach is more secure because it is using a security co-processor that appears to the OS as a separate external device"
That description implies a separate chip is added for use cases where Atom processors need OOB management/security.
http://www.pymnts.com/in-depth/2014/intel-adds-encryption-to... says, "The protocol, code-named Baker Beach, “adds an extra layer of software to protect the payment process .. software resides and runs on the Intel chipset for enhanced security .. tablets with the Intel Atom processor code-named Bay Trail-T and future Intel Atom processors,” will also work ...Intel’s position is that it’s approach is more secure because it is using a security co-processor that appears to the OS as a separate external device"
That description implies a separate chip is added for use cases where Atom processors need OOB management/security.
This is a very welcome leap towards a new platform. From the perspective the musical-instrument manufacturers, this now allows us to do something we've wanted to do in synthesizers, effects, digital-audio processing, and so on: build an instrument that can be upgraded.
I imagine a new controller category, akin to the current iOS USB/MIDI controllers that allow music-making with iPads/etc., albeit its a synth workstation with all the knobs you could possibly want, and maybe a little screen.
And of course, a place to stick the 'compute device' of choice. I'll get 3 or 4 of these, put a different pre-configured music-production system on each one, and make a complete suite of instruments that can be easily upgraded in the future.
Very nice to see this happening.
I imagine a new controller category, akin to the current iOS USB/MIDI controllers that allow music-making with iPads/etc., albeit its a synth workstation with all the knobs you could possibly want, and maybe a little screen.
And of course, a place to stick the 'compute device' of choice. I'll get 3 or 4 of these, put a different pre-configured music-production system on each one, and make a complete suite of instruments that can be easily upgraded in the future.
Very nice to see this happening.
I bought a i5 NUC [1] which I use for work (in the places I contract where I'm there for a bit longer than a few days). It's such a cool little device, the build took all of 15 minutes, and now Intel release this!
The NUCs come in a few sizes, the cheapest costing around 150 AUD. They make great media, desktop replacements or linux servers!
As soon as this little guy comes out I'm totally buying one (a stick), I like what they're doing with this stuff!
[1] http://www.intel.com.au/content/www/au/en/nuc/overview.html
The NUCs come in a few sizes, the cheapest costing around 150 AUD. They make great media, desktop replacements or linux servers!
As soon as this little guy comes out I'm totally buying one (a stick), I like what they're doing with this stuff!
[1] http://www.intel.com.au/content/www/au/en/nuc/overview.html
This is fantastic. As a car PC enthusiast, this kind of device is going transform the car PC community once again. Up until now, small form-factor PC's have been somewhat unaffordable.
A Dell Venue 8 Pro with Windows 8.1 is about $150-$200 (and is a damned nice machine, surprisingly enough.) I'm having trouble seeing the use case(s) for a headless Intel PC.
The headless Intel PC has the benefit of being easier to conceal in the car. I could put this thing in a nice fan enclosure and put it under the passenger seat or equivalent out-of-sight place. Not to mention, the Intel headless PC looks smaller than that of any laptop out there. Each to his own though.
The Dell Venue 8 Pro sadly is $300 here in Australia. Obviously given the low Australian dollar, buying it overseas and shipping it will cost over $300 for me.x
The Dell Venue 8 Pro sadly is $300 here in Australia. Obviously given the low Australian dollar, buying it overseas and shipping it will cost over $300 for me.x
Damn! Wonder why Ubuntu Edge didn't get the funding. It was quite similar but much better, why carry a separate stick when your smartphone itself is capable.
If they support a keyboard and mouse via USB then wouldn't supplying power to 2 USB ports be an issue? Assuming the stick itself gets its power from HDMI.
>Assuming the stick itself gets its power from HDMI.
I wouldn't make that assumption; Chromecast can't do it, and it's a lot less demanding than this.
I wouldn't make that assumption; Chromecast can't do it, and it's a lot less demanding than this.
Chromecast doesn't because it doesn't support MHL-HDMI which added a power over HDMI option (HDMI does have power but it something like 50mA). The newest version of MHL-HDMI does 2A. I'm not sure if that's enough to power this Intel stick however.
Doubtful. Both Chromecast and Firestick require an external power source. Only TV's that support MHL can deliver power from the TV. I'm guessing that for wider adoption, this will not rely on that feature.
Such an elegant name.
I look forward to Windows 8.1 Professional Compute Stick Edition
Maybe they'll have a special collectors version at launch.
[deleted]
I just love the idea of having the computer being a plug in accessory to my display. Small enough that where ever I go and a display is available I have my computer and data.
Now if it is topped up with good sync software so I can have the truly workhorse computer at work/home and take whatever partition of it I want I will be sold
Now if it is topped up with good sync software so I can have the truly workhorse computer at work/home and take whatever partition of it I want I will be sold
Intel's compute stick strikes me as a vehicle for "Windows 8.1 with Bing", which also appears in cheap laptops. There are already many powerful followons to the Raspberry Pi, with 1-2 GB RAM and up to four ARM cores for $40-$100. Microsoft must have jogged Intel and said, Do something!
This could be a direct competitor to the digital signage folks over at Brightsign - http://www.brightsign.biz/digital-signage-products/overview/
Can you do touch screen over HDMI?
I know a tv can send back commands from e.g. the remote control over HDMI, it really is bidirectional communication, but I wouldn't know whether it's good enough for something like touchscreen.
Well you can do 100Mbps Ethernet over HDMI 1.4 with a compatible cable, so I don't see why it would be technically impossible. The question is, can this stick do it?
it read somewhere that it can keep up to 10 different connection/devices, I think over CEC.
There are various comm protocols
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI#Communication_channel_pro...
There are various comm protocols
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI#Communication_channel_pro...
No. Touch screen monitors with HDMI need another channel, usually a USB port, to send touch events. In theory, I guess you could send events over DDC, but then you're gonna have to get video driver makers involved, make sure that the spec you choose doesn't cause existing drivers to puke, etc.
On the picture there's a USB port, probably you will be able to use it to send touch events.
Lately Intel is trying to enter several device markets. Other than their core products they now have at least the following "compute" products:
- Intel NUC
- Intel Galileo
- Intel Edison
The sad thing to me is that none of them are even remotely innovative.
The NUC is just a small form factor PC, exceptionally well executed but nothing new.
Galileo is a Raspberry Pi
Edison is an Arduino (sort of)
Compute Stick is a Fire TV/Android Stick
None of these could be really considered booming markets. ARM is eating Intel's lunch in the mobile market and Intel is shooting for the products that are least likely to turn a profit. If they could get a viable x86 phone on the market (or start making ARM processors) I think they'd be in much better shape.
The NUC is just a small form factor PC, exceptionally well executed but nothing new.
Galileo is a Raspberry Pi
Edison is an Arduino (sort of)
Compute Stick is a Fire TV/Android Stick
None of these could be really considered booming markets. ARM is eating Intel's lunch in the mobile market and Intel is shooting for the products that are least likely to turn a profit. If they could get a viable x86 phone on the market (or start making ARM processors) I think they'd be in much better shape.
Great concept. I really like the idea of owning cheap computing devices. That way, if I break it I won't feel bad. Nothing feels worse than accidentally spilling water all over your expensive laptop. It would fit me just perfectly.
Hold on, who said it will be cheap?
Given Intel/Windows tablets cost less than $100 in stores today, there's no reason to think similar hardware minus the touchscreen will cost much more.
"Quad core" + wireless + storage for 100$.. what is going on here?
Intel is selling Bay Trail CPUs for $5. Microsoft is selling Windows 8.1 licenses for low-end devices at $15. Given an Android tablet with all the rest (wireless/storage) can be had for $40, sub-$100 Intel/Windows PCs became feasible.
They pre-install the Windows 8.1 with Bing version, which is free.
The linux version of the device is rumored to be priced at $90.
it's already for sale from chineese sellers. all this is, is a Intel case with exact same parts.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/221639054114?_trksid=p2059210.m274...
See http://lowendtalk.com/discussion/39399/meegopad-t01
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/221639054114?_trksid=p2059210.m274...
See http://lowendtalk.com/discussion/39399/meegopad-t01
A bit cheaper off DX:
http://www.dx.com/p/meegopad-t01-quad-core-android-4-4-windo...
Now imagine if this were wireless, so that you didn't have to connect it to a TV? And while we're at it, add a screen, so that you can use it when you're not around a monitor.
And... it's a smartphone with chromecast.
And... it's a smartphone with chromecast.
Compared to a smartphone, this has:
unlocked bootloader
open-source graphics driver
no app store restrictions
no Java overhead
no OEM customizationsCompared to the smartphones currently on the market, I agree. My argument is that the form factor / functionality of the smartphone is very compelling.
I am not going to buy this Intel product, but I would if it were a smartphone.
I am not going to buy this Intel product, but I would if it were a smartphone.
Intel has spent/lost a lot of money pursuing smartphone design wins, without success. Maybe Project Ara modules will give Intel another shot at smartphones or handheld devices.
Does anyone happen to know whether the quad-core atom mentioned would be sufficiently powerful to handle being a Plex client or Steam streaming client machine? This would make a remarkably cheap living room client PC.
Attach a highspeed microSD card reader (or build one in) and this would make a very compelling low power, personal media file server. Although needing to keep the television on to power it might get annoying.
I see this device as the perfect next-generation-chromecast.
You can download anything you want wirelessly and play it on your HD TV. No need for Chromecast to load youtube and be a "closed garden" of google.
Too bad the plug is on the end... my guess is that it's impossible to pick an arrangement that works for every TV, but this seems likely to be a problem for wall-mounted TVs like the one in the picture.
I'd have to imagine it probably comes with a short M-F cable or something like for such cases.
These ~10cm M-F extension cables are very common for these stick style mini PCs.
Most TVs have a side HDMI port.
Consider the use case suggested by the image on the copy i.e; on-screen projection of slides in a business meeting. Can this use case be met with a tablet/smart phone using a VGA adapter?
The "business meeting" use case pictured doesn't make a lot of sense. The copy at the bottom says the stick itself is a computer, not a video receiver, so there'd have to be a keyboard/mouse/controller of some kind connected to it, and they'd have to get the slide deck onto it somehow, and open PowerPoint, and that just doesn't seem particularly useful. It's much easier to use some wireless display technology and cast it from a laptop, or plug in a cable.
What they say they're aiming for are simple, self-contained (display-only?) kiosks... which maybe could be useful, for some people. You could also use it as a media center. If it could magically transform a huge TV into a touch screen, on the other hand... that would be amazing.
What they say they're aiming for are simple, self-contained (display-only?) kiosks... which maybe could be useful, for some people. You could also use it as a media center. If it could magically transform a huge TV into a touch screen, on the other hand... that would be amazing.
It supports Bluetooth, so you could pair a remote or a smartphone with it, and it's easier to carry than a laptop. Remember there's a full version of MS Office on it, too.
What makes more sense to me, though, would be a phone with an HDMI port (or wireless video capability) that connects directly to the projector. It's one less device to carry. If you don't want to walk over to the phone to advance to the next slide, you could still add a Bluetooth remote or control it from one of those smart watches.
(I'm kind of suprised that Blackberry never tried something like what I just described--it would have been a great way to differentiate themselves in the enterprise sector and keep the iPhone at bay.)
What makes more sense to me, though, would be a phone with an HDMI port (or wireless video capability) that connects directly to the projector. It's one less device to carry. If you don't want to walk over to the phone to advance to the next slide, you could still add a Bluetooth remote or control it from one of those smart watches.
(I'm kind of suprised that Blackberry never tried something like what I just described--it would have been a great way to differentiate themselves in the enterprise sector and keep the iPhone at bay.)
Some phones tried the HDMI out (I bought my Droid Razr because of it), but I guess market research has shown that people don't really care. Most phones (including the iPhone) still support the HDMI out over USB in some form, and still next to nobody uses it.
> I'm kind of suprised that Blackberry never tried
The BlackBerry Z10 I have in some drawer at home has a micro HDMI out. Also BB OS 10 can act as an UPnP server and a Samba share, and I think it supports Miracast or something.
The BlackBerry Z10 I have in some drawer at home has a micro HDMI out. Also BB OS 10 can act as an UPnP server and a Samba share, and I think it supports Miracast or something.
I've done this before. I had a micro-HDMI to HDMI connector, and a HDMI to DVI connector to plug the phone into the projector. This was about 2 years ago, and I was using a 2 year old phone, IIRC. The experience sucked, but mostly because the app I was using didn't support most PowerPoint features.
I'm sure modern phones and apps could handle it pretty well, though. Using the official MS Office apps would probably solve the major issues I had.
I'm sure modern phones and apps could handle it pretty well, though. Using the official MS Office apps would probably solve the major issues I had.
Here's hoping they'll offer a version for embedded computing (and support it better than they historically supported their embedded motherboards).
Cotton candy [1] has been around for some years. This looks pretty similar.
[1] http://www.fxitech.com/
[1] http://www.fxitech.com/
I really hope they get a 90 degree adapter for the HDMI.
This looks sick.Now all I need is a resizable monitor.
I think this will come in the form of an LCD on flexible fabric in a few years. You'll roll it up into a tube and take it with you in your messenger bag.
Can't wait to go camping with my 53 inch LCD screen in my backpack LOL.
Short throw micro-projector and a [white 'canvas'] tent?
I wonder if you could hook this up to your computer and run it like a VM but it's just a whole computer you can use from your main machine?
Well, it has wireless, so you could just use it as a remote desktop.
I actually run a Chromebook 14 with a 27 in monitor and wireless mouse and keyboard. It suits my needs. I am presently able to control my two Win7 computers through Chrome remote desktop. It seems that the Compute Stick once set up should be able to be run from any remote desktop with only power to the stick. This gives me a Win8.1 computer inside my Chrome system. I need to maintain a Win computer due to legacy issues, with some of my hobbies. I can combine all of my data from the two Win7's and an XP in one Win8.1 computer and retire a lot of old equipment. I will have to try it when I get the Compute Stick. My needs are simple, and it works for me, I am not a high end user. It will clear a lot of space on my computer desk, and fit in my computer case when I travel.
This is really big. We might now upgrade to the next Roku with Netflix running in Chrome on Linux, fast, now an Intel CPU device, really cool.
Off topic: while running Noscript I know I am just begging for broken websites, but this page shouldn't be outright unstyled without JS.
I run into lots of sites that won't load at all with scripts off. Just a blank screen. Or image sharing sites (flickr) where the image you want to see won't load at with scripts off.
I've been looking for a board like this that has HDMI in and out for real time image processing. It seems nobody makes such an animal.
Your dream board would have far to small of a market because no one is going to license a hackable system that can sit between two HDCP devices for HDCP. If the board doesn't have HDCP why would you pay the HDMI royalties. Would be much simpler to use DVI capture card and HDMI->DVI adapters.
HDMI is separate from and does not require HDCP. You can have an unencrypted HDMI signal from, for example, an industrial video camera.
Yet, I do agree with you: It's a small market.
Yet, I do agree with you: It's a small market.
So any comments on how is this better than a Raspberry Pi for example? You could all this using an arduino or a pi isn't it?
The advantage of this Intel stick compared to RPI is:
- more power
- x86
- Run Windows (this might be interesting for lot's of users)
- Bigger storage
- Better and compact pack
Disadvantages: - More power consumption (??? any numbers on this)
- Expensive compared to RPI
- I guess it will be hard to beat the RPI community with this product.
- No GPIO
EDIT:
Add GPIO
- x86
- Run Windows (this might be interesting for lot's of users)
- Bigger storage
- Better and compact pack
Disadvantages: - More power consumption (??? any numbers on this)
- Expensive compared to RPI
- I guess it will be hard to beat the RPI community with this product.
- No GPIO
EDIT:
Add GPIO
Can a malicious display install a rootkit on the device? If there's USB access, this seems like an avenue worth exploring...
It can via DP (make a DP connection that's actually Thunderbolt, flash the firmware) but that's on OS X - see http://bgr.com/2014/12/30/mac-os-x-thunderbolt-hack/.
And this DP connection isn't Thunderbolt, it just does DP.
And this DP connection isn't Thunderbolt, it just does DP.
"Bookmark this page, and then set a reminder to check in soon."
Hello, Marketing 101 called, and said, "sign up for Mailchimp."
Hello, Marketing 101 called, and said, "sign up for Mailchimp."
Very cool, but...
I think the future is our compute power in our "phones" that work with ambient peripherals (keyboards, monitors).
I think the future is our compute power in our "phones" that work with ambient peripherals (keyboards, monitors).
Could we see people move from a phone to carrying two devices? One which is quite personal (phone, social, camera, etc) and one which is a little more generic (general computing device). I'm thinking about how most people would be reluctant to let their phone out of their sight, while they could also use a general stick that allowed tasks, work, etc.
I usually have my phone in my pocket, and my Moto360 watch on my wrist. Two devices. I used to be really reluctant to let my phone out of sight but since getting the smart watch, I no longer mind because it does an absolute fantastic job at notifying me of emails, texts, and other alerts. No longer do I have to pull out my phone to check stuff etc.
I may be in the minority but it's definitely changed my habits. I feel as if it's "easier" for some reason.
I may be in the minority but it's definitely changed my habits. I feel as if it's "easier" for some reason.
The one system image idea is the next logical progression of N screens. The engineering issue is providing enough cooling to a laptop+phone when being used as a desktop/laptop... The entire dock would have to be a heatsink for folks that want to play their 3d games.
Totally, anybody aware of anybody working on this?
Surprisingly enough, it's already doable:
http://www.redmondpie.com/how-to-set-up-the-galaxy-nexus-as-...
http://www.redmondpie.com/how-to-set-up-the-galaxy-nexus-as-...
You can use MHL and bluetooth keyboard and mouse for something similar today.
"compute-on-a-stick" what a name...
I seriously couldn't decide if the copywriter was laughing when he or she wrote "The Intel Compute Stick is a new generation compute-on-a-stick device." (Because x-on-a-stick is an inherently funny phrasing.) But I read the text very carefully and concluded that it was written earnestly, so I didn't leave a comment.
It really is a new generation of compute-on-a-stick device.
It really is a new generation of compute-on-a-stick device.
The code names would all have to come from Something About Mary
I'm totally thrilled about this ..cant wait to try one,
( ps. i work there, funny i heard about it here first ...big company :) )
( ps. i work there, funny i heard about it here first ...big company :) )
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Wow, very impressive.
But > Bookmark this page, and then set a reminder to check in soon
Where is email subscription form?
But > Bookmark this page, and then set a reminder to check in soon
Where is email subscription form?
I am currently crafting together a new desktop, seeing this makes me feel really silly.
The interesting thing would be if you could stack them and cloud compute.
They're power limited by what a USB port can provide. It would make more sense to buy actual rack-mounted gear.
Also, you'll need to setup a cloud cluster... A nontrivial task.
Also, you'll need to setup a cloud cluster... A nontrivial task.
*cloud compute stick
What's the SoC in this NUC? Is this a Broadwell i3 ? Which one ?
Any idea whether this will run on 5V or 12V or something else?
What are the existing products this will compete with?
For the media enthusiasts, likely the Chromecast and I believe Amazon also offers a HDMI stick computer.
It doesn't seem like it's really competing with the Chromecast. My impression was that the Compute Stick can actually run software by itself, not requiring a connection to another device.
roku also has one. there was an open source one announced here on HN last week.
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In my opinion this will compete more with the RPI kind of market and also USB sticks.
Basically one can use this as a "more functional" USB Storage.
In the past couple of years there have been dozens of similar products based on ARM SoCs out there.
Yup. If any of this class of product were any good, we'd be using them right now. And even if Intel produced the best of breed, how much computing power can be wringed out of the power supplied by USB (say 10W max, which is generous)? Not much.
(This product line is DOA.)
(This product line is DOA.)
"Bookmark this page, and then set a reminder to check in soon."
That made me chuckle. If just there was a technology based in XML that could be used to do that...
That made me chuckle. If just there was a technology based in XML that could be used to do that...
So long, NUC!
The NUC has different niches than what this is going for. The NUC line at the low end will probably be pushed out by this, but a lot of NUCs are sold with things like PCIe ports and the like that this thing almost certainly won't have. The low end has a lot of differentiation, especially in boutique devices where you just need a processor, and some kind of output.
needs more ram and better cpu before that
They are such idiots for not having the picture of the device in the palm of a hand or something. Marketing fail.
what do you need to have besides a tv or monitor to use the Compute Stick?
Wow.
I have a feeling this could be a game changer.
I'm more than impressed... I'm stunned.
I have a feeling this could be a game changer.
I'm more than impressed... I'm stunned.
Can one install WinXP, Win7, Win10 or Linux too? Or is the BIOS/Efi locked down?
But, it doesn't exist. This will be interesting, when it exists.
"Bookmark this page, and then set a reminder to check in soon"?
Intel, you totally fail at social media!
Intel, you totally fail at social media!
I'm anxiously awaiting for Intel to team up with Justin Timberlake and offer us Compute in a Box.
Intel offers "... Pre-installed with Windows 8.1* or Linux, ...".
"First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." Mahatma Gandhi
"First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." Mahatma Gandhi
The bigger consumer companies have been shuffling their feet, releasing arbitrary, very closed off pieces of tech that I don't really need. I really applaud Intel for making the tiny little PC I've been wanting for media and linux tomfoolery. The Chromecast was a no-go, and now with an apple tv, I'm feeling a little too enclosed; they don't have enough apps to satisfy all my media needs.
I've been watching the mini-pc market, chronically unsatisfied with what's been released up to this point. The Intel compute stick finally looks like the thing I've been looking for, mainly because they balance the size and low price, with just enough power for what I need. To top it off they're offering a Linux version, so I don't have to be worried about buying into a closed off platform.