Acer is building a fancy electric bike with AI(electrek.co)
electrek.co
Acer is building a fancy electric bike with AI
https://electrek.co/2023/03/20/acer-ebii-electric-bike-ai/
25 comments
> predictively control the transmission
My 2010 automatic can throw a P003 "Turbocharger/Supercharger Boost Control Position Exceeded Learning Limit" error so apparently it's AI too!
My 2010 automatic can throw a P003 "Turbocharger/Supercharger Boost Control Position Exceeded Learning Limit" error so apparently it's AI too!
indeed, these things have been existing for a while.
Garmin has a nice Varia radar to show you cars coming from behind.
But the use case is pretty slim, and the added value hard to find.
-> Would you need to rely on an AI to avoid cars while being on a bike ? A bike isn't a car that needs AI, because drivers texts and are distracted. You can't be distracted on a bike (or you fall instantly)
You have eyes, and you need to keep balance anyway. Also, a bike can't brake or change directions on its own, best it can do is flash an alarm. And you don't need a flashing light to hear a reckless driver going 7000rpm at an intersection. So AI to detect cars is useless.
-> self locking bike ? Who can trust that ? car manufacturer already did that (poorly), it made an auto theft spree. And I'm not sure most drivers care anyway. So you can just lock your bike yourself in 30 seconds.
-> GPS tracking ? trackers already exist. However, I haven't seen a lot of frequent bike users caring about them. They cost dozens of bucks at worst, and nobody buy these. Just lock your bike with a U lock to avoid theft.
-> belt drive instead of chain ? Who cares ?
-> LED lighting all around ? Yeah, maybe. It's the same as having lights and reflective tires. As most users can't bother, so it's great to have the bike pre-fitted with these.
-> ebike battery to charge a phone ? It seems to be a feature that some users expect. But I wouldn't buy a bike to charge my phone. I have a charger at the office.
-> *optional accessories including fenders and a rear rack* ? come on, that's the most valuable features for a city bike. Why is this optional ?
This bike seems like a publicity stunt, or a bike for not-so-frequent riders...
I'm eager to see if they review priorities, for further versions.
Garmin has a nice Varia radar to show you cars coming from behind.
But the use case is pretty slim, and the added value hard to find.
-> Would you need to rely on an AI to avoid cars while being on a bike ? A bike isn't a car that needs AI, because drivers texts and are distracted. You can't be distracted on a bike (or you fall instantly)
You have eyes, and you need to keep balance anyway. Also, a bike can't brake or change directions on its own, best it can do is flash an alarm. And you don't need a flashing light to hear a reckless driver going 7000rpm at an intersection. So AI to detect cars is useless.
-> self locking bike ? Who can trust that ? car manufacturer already did that (poorly), it made an auto theft spree. And I'm not sure most drivers care anyway. So you can just lock your bike yourself in 30 seconds.
-> GPS tracking ? trackers already exist. However, I haven't seen a lot of frequent bike users caring about them. They cost dozens of bucks at worst, and nobody buy these. Just lock your bike with a U lock to avoid theft.
-> belt drive instead of chain ? Who cares ?
-> LED lighting all around ? Yeah, maybe. It's the same as having lights and reflective tires. As most users can't bother, so it's great to have the bike pre-fitted with these.
-> ebike battery to charge a phone ? It seems to be a feature that some users expect. But I wouldn't buy a bike to charge my phone. I have a charger at the office.
-> *optional accessories including fenders and a rear rack* ? come on, that's the most valuable features for a city bike. Why is this optional ?
This bike seems like a publicity stunt, or a bike for not-so-frequent riders...
I'm eager to see if they review priorities, for further versions.
It looks like the bike is in the 'foldable' shape, but isn't foldable?
These small foldable bikes are popular in Europe mainly because you can take them with you on public transport for free (they count as luggage if folded together.)
These small foldable bikes are popular in Europe mainly because you can take them with you on public transport for free (they count as luggage if folded together.)
The geometry is called mini velo and popular in some parts of the world because of the smaller wheels (tighter turns) and overall volume. Most of them are foldable these days but the two don’t technically equate (there are full-size foldable bikes).
Ew. And, no mention of the RGB LEDs it apparently must have to qualify as a bit of modern consumer electronics?
We don't need more expensive, exotic ebikes. We need more "Cheap enough, good enough" ebikes that people will actually buy and use.
We don't need more expensive, exotic ebikes. We need more "Cheap enough, good enough" ebikes that people will actually buy and use.
Looks like nobody wants to make customer friendly product anymore, it needs to be packed to the brim with useless gimmicks and software which WILL become obsolete and outdated, and of course locked down as hard as possible.
It's really weird, all this dichotomy and delusion - on one hand there are numerous educational initiatives, kids are learning from young age that we need to take care about environment. There are numerous government initiatives focused on telling individual people how to live, how many times to fly on vacation and how many times one is allowed to leave residential area.
And yet I'm unable to buy electric bike WITH INTERCHANGEABLE PARTS - you know - just like all the bikes were for more than 200 years until now.
And yet I'm unable to buy electric bike WITH INTERCHANGEABLE PARTS - you know - just like all the bikes were for more than 200 years until now.
I've been fairly happy with the Rad Power bikes - I test rode a few many years back and felt they did a good job of "Understanding how to build a good mass market ebike" - they got that a motor covers the sins of a heavy bike, and put the money where it matters. They also, at least at the time, used some fairly generic interfaces such that you could swap out battery packs/controllers/etc without much loss of function (though their console wouldn't work with a random replacement controller). My only real complaint is that they ship with cable disc brakes, which are... eh, adequate, in the flats. I much prefer dual piston hydraulic brakes for any sort of serious hill use.
> Looks like nobody wants to make customer friendly product anymore...
Of course not. Where's the money in that? How are you going to sell all the behavioral data on the backend if you don't have a cell modem in it? (car makers, I'm looking at you)
> ...kids are learning from young age that we need to take care about environment.
Sure! And in practice, this looks virtually indistinguishable from any other sort of consumerism, except it's Green Consumerism. You have to buy the right products to show that you Care(TM) about the environment, and, of course, have to have the money to buy those. How many people purchased Teslas because now a $100k luxury car was an environmental status signal, while living in gigantic houses and having 100 mile commutes?
> And yet I'm unable to buy electric bike WITH INTERCHANGEABLE PARTS...
It's not just ebikes. Bikes in general are going to manufacturer-proprietary parts. Low Tech Magazine had a long rant on it recently - https://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2023/02/can-we-make-bicycles...
> Looks like nobody wants to make customer friendly product anymore...
Of course not. Where's the money in that? How are you going to sell all the behavioral data on the backend if you don't have a cell modem in it? (car makers, I'm looking at you)
> ...kids are learning from young age that we need to take care about environment.
Sure! And in practice, this looks virtually indistinguishable from any other sort of consumerism, except it's Green Consumerism. You have to buy the right products to show that you Care(TM) about the environment, and, of course, have to have the money to buy those. How many people purchased Teslas because now a $100k luxury car was an environmental status signal, while living in gigantic houses and having 100 mile commutes?
> And yet I'm unable to buy electric bike WITH INTERCHANGEABLE PARTS...
It's not just ebikes. Bikes in general are going to manufacturer-proprietary parts. Low Tech Magazine had a long rant on it recently - https://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2023/02/can-we-make-bicycles...
It’s a rant on the internet, saying it was all better long ago. File it in the same bin with processors are faster so why is everything slower.
It really does look like the Acer interpretation of an electric bike.
I'm wondering how many potholes it will take before the half-a-fork fails such that the front wheel gets wedged or comes off completely.
That isn't intrinsically horrible, the cannondale lefty is tried and true in the mountainbiking space, even if it is mostly a gimmick.
I actually laughed out loud when I clicked the article and saw the bike. It's like you crossed an old iPhone with a razer scooter and tried to build a bike from a description over the phone.
The gushing article about an outsider inventing a bike that solves all of the problems of cycling, is a recurring literary genre.
French company iWeech has been making AI-powered e-bikes for a while: https://iweech.com/en/
And they're actually pretty good, even without the AI part.
It's not hard to change gears and assistance level without AI. However, people riding these bikes have reported really good battery performance. The AI stuff automatically optimizes for that, especially when the battery is getting low.
I'm still a little bit skeptical, though. Living in a city with steep streets everywhere, I constantly have to anticipate, and be ready to start with the right gear/assistance after a stop.
Without a camera, I don't see how AI could do that. At best, it will quickly switch gear after realizing that the previous setting was off. Not so great to ride in a busy city.
And they're actually pretty good, even without the AI part.
It's not hard to change gears and assistance level without AI. However, people riding these bikes have reported really good battery performance. The AI stuff automatically optimizes for that, especially when the battery is getting low.
I'm still a little bit skeptical, though. Living in a city with steep streets everywhere, I constantly have to anticipate, and be ready to start with the right gear/assistance after a stop.
Without a camera, I don't see how AI could do that. At best, it will quickly switch gear after realizing that the previous setting was off. Not so great to ride in a busy city.
A.I. has no sense of the pain in the crotch on long rides even if with battery assisted power pedaling. Dynamic supporting touch points just above the back of the knee and at the crease between buttocks and thigh without interfering with circulation and obsoleting the seat saddle is what's needed in a new design invention.
See interval between
19. gluteus maximus 25. ischiocrurale
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_skeletal_muscles_of_th...
See interval between
19. gluteus maximus 25. ischiocrurale
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_skeletal_muscles_of_th...
You need a better saddle. It's as simple as that.
Higher-end shops have pressure pads that you can sit on. They can use the data from that to find a saddle that works for you.
Source: I bike a lot
Higher-end shops have pressure pads that you can sit on. They can use the data from that to find a saddle that works for you.
Source: I bike a lot
I'm skeptical that a change in saddle would make a huge difference for the average rider. I personally find that my comfort on the road bike correlates to how hard I'm working - active group rides I'm fine; noodling around with family on the same bike is a lot less comfortable. The only difference I can see is that I'm putting way more weight on the peddles in the first case compared to the latter.
I imagine your average rider is probably a lot closer to noodling around than a group ride.
I imagine your average rider is probably a lot closer to noodling around than a group ride.
Both you and the parent commenter are correct; A saddle that matches your personal anatomy will make a tremendous difference for all riding conditions, and the amount of times you vary your position on the bike will alleviate discomfort by allowing blood to flow naturally as your weight shifts. More intense riding conditions necessitate moving around on the saddle more often.
Additionally, if you simply ride your bike more often your groin and siting bones will feel more comfortable by acclimating to the pressure and movement. It's helpful to wear appropriate clothing in the areas that contact the saddle as well, such as a chamois liner, to reduce friction and add an appropriate amount of cushion.
Additionally, if you simply ride your bike more often your groin and siting bones will feel more comfortable by acclimating to the pressure and movement. It's helpful to wear appropriate clothing in the areas that contact the saddle as well, such as a chamois liner, to reduce friction and add an appropriate amount of cushion.
I would also be uncomfortable on a road bike when not exerting myself. That being said, there are good reasons why bikes come in different shapes for different use cases. Casual riding can be very comfortable with a more suitable frame and configuration.
The one-bike-that-does-it-all (aka "quiver-killer") is an elusive beast in the cycling community, it's no surprise your road bike doesn't fit the bill. The style most people end up settling on is something along the lines of a light-ish steel touring frame, with reasonable slack and tire clearance, equipped with a Brooks saddle and handlebars with multiple hand positions.
The one-bike-that-does-it-all (aka "quiver-killer") is an elusive beast in the cycling community, it's no surprise your road bike doesn't fit the bill. The style most people end up settling on is something along the lines of a light-ish steel touring frame, with reasonable slack and tire clearance, equipped with a Brooks saddle and handlebars with multiple hand positions.
LOLOL I wasted $900 on a "high end" Acer laptop once. _Never_ again will I trust them.
Anyone foolish enough to buy from Acer something where defects & cheap design can injure you deserves to, well, at least, lose the $$$ they fork over. They don't deserve the myriad injuries they will get though.
IOW: personal injury lawyers, start your engines!
Anyone foolish enough to buy from Acer something where defects & cheap design can injure you deserves to, well, at least, lose the $$$ they fork over. They don't deserve the myriad injuries they will get though.
IOW: personal injury lawyers, start your engines!
That would deserve a post of its own
but it's not an accurate perspective IMO, when it mixes all kinds of bikes.
-> you can't compare bikes to go to work and sport bike. Sport bikes aim for performance, not being lean. Sport bikes have carbon fibre frames, proprietary components, the new wheel mounts, as mentioned,... And they pretty much last only a few years.
*BUT* previous road bikes were not better : the horizontal mounting would worn out after a few years. Your back wheel would become hard to secure, and would swerve left and ram the frame.
The brakes on the rim would also wear it out, so that you had to change the whole wheels (which is expensive) from time to time, and not just a disc.
Also, old steel frames could rust and become floppy after a few years.
And material science wasn't as good a few years ago, so a lot of things could happen to your bike (cracks on the seat post mounting, bent chainset, ...)
So all in all, the useful lifespan of sport bikes weren't better.
-> then utility bikes : modern utility bikes are still made out of steel or aluminium, standard components, and are still much more sturdy and dependable for the same reason.
Mine will soon be 10, has spent 2 weeks at the bottom of a lake just after I had it, has countless scratches, has had countless crashes with cars and urban furniture, I rode under the rain or freezing mist, in the forests, cobbled streets, in the city; the bike stayed outside in freezing winter or hot summer, the blokes tried to steal it,... And it's still there. I just had to change the wheels twice.
OP also overplays compatibility issues. You indeed used to have standard components, and you still do ! But instead of having to choose between 5 or 7 gears, you can choose between 5 and 11 gears on utility bikes. And old parts are still available.
There are just some parts that became shorter lived, for reasons : Forks now have suspensions, and saddles are now comfortable, thanks to foam.
On the other hand, OP underplays the issue with electric bikes. There is indeed a lack of standardization for these. Which means that when your battery gets worn out (typically after 800 cycles, so 3-5 years), odds are that your battery isn't produced anymore, and you can dispose of the bike.
please resubmit it to discuss it further !
but it's not an accurate perspective IMO, when it mixes all kinds of bikes.
-> you can't compare bikes to go to work and sport bike. Sport bikes aim for performance, not being lean. Sport bikes have carbon fibre frames, proprietary components, the new wheel mounts, as mentioned,... And they pretty much last only a few years.
*BUT* previous road bikes were not better : the horizontal mounting would worn out after a few years. Your back wheel would become hard to secure, and would swerve left and ram the frame.
The brakes on the rim would also wear it out, so that you had to change the whole wheels (which is expensive) from time to time, and not just a disc.
Also, old steel frames could rust and become floppy after a few years.
And material science wasn't as good a few years ago, so a lot of things could happen to your bike (cracks on the seat post mounting, bent chainset, ...)
So all in all, the useful lifespan of sport bikes weren't better.
-> then utility bikes : modern utility bikes are still made out of steel or aluminium, standard components, and are still much more sturdy and dependable for the same reason.
Mine will soon be 10, has spent 2 weeks at the bottom of a lake just after I had it, has countless scratches, has had countless crashes with cars and urban furniture, I rode under the rain or freezing mist, in the forests, cobbled streets, in the city; the bike stayed outside in freezing winter or hot summer, the blokes tried to steal it,... And it's still there. I just had to change the wheels twice.
OP also overplays compatibility issues. You indeed used to have standard components, and you still do ! But instead of having to choose between 5 or 7 gears, you can choose between 5 and 11 gears on utility bikes. And old parts are still available.
There are just some parts that became shorter lived, for reasons : Forks now have suspensions, and saddles are now comfortable, thanks to foam.
On the other hand, OP underplays the issue with electric bikes. There is indeed a lack of standardization for these. Which means that when your battery gets worn out (typically after 800 cycles, so 3-5 years), odds are that your battery isn't produced anymore, and you can dispose of the bike.
please resubmit it to discuss it further !
My argument is simple.
Why do we need fancy bikes with AI when we can't even get sustainability right.
It's like we are tying to solve problems we created over and over while ignoring the most obvious problems and their solutions.
Why do we need fancy bikes with AI when we can't even get sustainability right.
It's like we are tying to solve problems we created over and over while ignoring the most obvious problems and their solutions.
I'm all for e-bikes but you'd have to pay me $1500-$2500 to ride this ugly thing.
So, not AI, then. Just more scammy marketing copy.