More than you want to know about gift cards(bam.kalzumeus.com)
bam.kalzumeus.com
More than you want to know about gift cards
https://bam.kalzumeus.com/archive/more-than-you-want-to-know-about-gift-cards/
179 comments
It really depends on the economic situation of the recipient.
I am lucky enough to have more than enough money to maintain the life that I want to have. Giving me cash makes no material difference to me. It will most likely sit in a savings account for potentially the rest of my life. Don't do that especially if you need it (please!).
Finding an actual "physical" gift can be hard, time consuming, stressful, would prompt you to spend more than you afford to "ensure a proper gift", etc.
Gift cards for something I don't usually do is a relatively easy way to solve that. It's like saying "I know you can afford it, but you don't seem to XYZ that often, and maybe you'll like it". XYZ can be [discover a store], [try an experience], [visit some place] or anything else. If I know someone put a little money on that, I will honour that and hopefully discover something new, which is the best gift ever !. And you can put the exact amount that you feel comfortable putting (and in fact the amount itself does not really matter).
But indeed, if the recipient is in any position where cash could be helpful, or if they are saving for a purpose (travel, house, child, ...). Just give cash instead.
I am lucky enough to have more than enough money to maintain the life that I want to have. Giving me cash makes no material difference to me. It will most likely sit in a savings account for potentially the rest of my life. Don't do that especially if you need it (please!).
Finding an actual "physical" gift can be hard, time consuming, stressful, would prompt you to spend more than you afford to "ensure a proper gift", etc.
Gift cards for something I don't usually do is a relatively easy way to solve that. It's like saying "I know you can afford it, but you don't seem to XYZ that often, and maybe you'll like it". XYZ can be [discover a store], [try an experience], [visit some place] or anything else. If I know someone put a little money on that, I will honour that and hopefully discover something new, which is the best gift ever !. And you can put the exact amount that you feel comfortable putting (and in fact the amount itself does not really matter).
But indeed, if the recipient is in any position where cash could be helpful, or if they are saving for a purpose (travel, house, child, ...). Just give cash instead.
I don’t think it is, at least not in my family. Cash is no more of a faux pas than a gift card, at least. I happen to think either is a pretty lame gift. Instead of a gift card to LUSH, for example, just buy me a bath bomb or whatever. Maybe I won’t like the scent you choose, maybe I’ll love it—that’s the nature of receiving a gift. Besides, gift cards are rarely enough to cover an actual purchase with taxes and etc added, so they often end up forcing the recipient to spend some of their own money (or they gather dust until they expire).
I know some people are “hard to buy for” but this might be an indication that you shouldn’t be giving them a gift. If you don’t know them well enough to have a gift idea, or don’t feel comfortable asking for ideas, are you really obligated to get them something?
I know some people are “hard to buy for” but this might be an indication that you shouldn’t be giving them a gift. If you don’t know them well enough to have a gift idea, or don’t feel comfortable asking for ideas, are you really obligated to get them something?
My wife did something amazing this year that I think is relevant here. She had a baby shower to go to. She didn't know what to get the mother to be.
So she bought an Amazon gift card. And then she created a wishlist of items she thought the mother might need, doing the research to find reputable brands, unique solutions to problems, "best mom gadgets", etc (such as the pacifier that you can put liquids into; it lets you get liquid medicines into the baby, like cough syrup, without stress). She sent the gift card, and the link to the wishlist with an explanation.
It was both a pragmatic and thoughtful approach, without the risk of buying something she already had, or didn't need or want.
So she bought an Amazon gift card. And then she created a wishlist of items she thought the mother might need, doing the research to find reputable brands, unique solutions to problems, "best mom gadgets", etc (such as the pacifier that you can put liquids into; it lets you get liquid medicines into the baby, like cough syrup, without stress). She sent the gift card, and the link to the wishlist with an explanation.
It was both a pragmatic and thoughtful approach, without the risk of buying something she already had, or didn't need or want.
Your wife has just re-invented gift registries! Maybe this is cultural, but in the US for baby showers and weddings, usually specific wants/needs will be compiled into a list and registered either at a specific retailer, or with a web service; so you don't get double-buys or things you don't need.
It is a great idea, but it makes more sense when the recipient does the registering IMO.
It is a great idea, but it makes more sense when the recipient does the registering IMO.
Great, now Amazon thinks your wife is pregnant. Expect endless ads for diapers. LOL
> the pacifier that you can put liquids into; it lets you get liquid medicines into the baby
If you are unlucky enough to have to get medicine into a baby, something has happened and you are hopefully under the supervision of a doctor or a nurse who can aid with the practicalities.
Small babies are delicate machines and gifting any sort of medical aid "just in case" might give the recipient ideas. Feeding a baby cough syrup may have been just an example but sounds downright dangerous. Please be careful.
If you are unlucky enough to have to get medicine into a baby, something has happened and you are hopefully under the supervision of a doctor or a nurse who can aid with the practicalities.
Small babies are delicate machines and gifting any sort of medical aid "just in case" might give the recipient ideas. Feeding a baby cough syrup may have been just an example but sounds downright dangerous. Please be careful.
That's the best because it saves the mom time to do research, which once you're all making decent money is the true gift.
> it lets you get liquid medicines into the baby, like cough syrup
I realize this was just a casual example, but kids under two generally shouldn't be given any cough or cold meds (there are no over-the-counter cough meds for kids <2 sold in the US).
Definitely still useful for other meds though.
I realize this was just a casual example, but kids under two generally shouldn't be given any cough or cold meds (there are no over-the-counter cough meds for kids <2 sold in the US).
Definitely still useful for other meds though.
Could you share the list>
The next thing is Gift Affiliate Shower Funnel Marketing Cards - the server running on the java card itself in Rust of course
I didn't m to sound facetious but now I'm thinking about the ways of making a SaaS out of this : the incentive for the giver is easy enough ; the card maker gets a cut ; AWS should give you a great deal on hosting..
I didn't m to sound facetious but now I'm thinking about the ways of making a SaaS out of this : the incentive for the giver is easy enough ; the card maker gets a cut ; AWS should give you a great deal on hosting..
I'm not great at gifts but the thing I've learned is, consumables. Chocolate, wine, your bath bomb, fancy cookies, etc. They're fairly universal, won't run into the "already have it" problem, and don't leave the recipient feeling like they now need to hold onto something forever or risk offending you. You may not score a direct hit but generally if you know people at all you can't go too far wrong.
I used to make people cookies and sometimes candy. I'd try to have at least 4-5 varieties, individually wrapped at home, with rules: No nuts, no candy outside of chocolate chips, and most of the doughs would freeze well. I'd often include one new-to-me cookie, chocolate chips, snickerdoodles, brownies, and a colorful-but-plain sugar cookie.
They aren't fancy or anything, but they scale up well and folks will look forward to it.
They aren't fancy or anything, but they scale up well and folks will look forward to it.
I've made a bunch of fancy chocolate truffles more than once. The basic truffle can be rolled in all kinds of nuts and shit, so you get an assortment; the greatest expense is the packaging (pretty boxes, nice little paper shells to put them in).
Even if the recipient doesn't care for truffles (vegan, weight-loss dieter) they like the packaging, and they have something to share. And truffles are easy to make.
Even if the recipient doesn't care for truffles (vegan, weight-loss dieter) they like the packaging, and they have something to share. And truffles are easy to make.
We live in Georgia.
For a few years now we've bought a bunch of peaches sometime in the summer and made a bunch of peach jam, put it in pretty little jars, and brought them to holiday gatherings with my family around Philadelphia. It's always a hit.
The thing is, they actually have good peaches up there too! I know this because I ate so many of them when I lived near a good farmer's market there!
For a few years now we've bought a bunch of peaches sometime in the summer and made a bunch of peach jam, put it in pretty little jars, and brought them to holiday gatherings with my family around Philadelphia. It's always a hit.
The thing is, they actually have good peaches up there too! I know this because I ate so many of them when I lived near a good farmer's market there!
Ah, Gram Parsons, the "Georgia Peach". And Duane Allman.
Philly peaches: I believe that Robert E. Lee's troops got through a lot of "foraged" (stolen) peaches on the march to Gettysburg. Presumably squits was a big problem in the confederate army.
Philly peaches: I believe that Robert E. Lee's troops got through a lot of "foraged" (stolen) peaches on the march to Gettysburg. Presumably squits was a big problem in the confederate army.
My family pact this year is we have agreed to buy each other stationery. Paper, pencils, stickies, and fountain pen ink — all consumable and easy to find something for everyone (especially if they like sushi, cats, or owls.)
https://www.jetpens.com/Kurochiku-Mejirushi-Sticky-Notes/ct/...
https://www.jetpens.com/Kurochiku-Mejirushi-Sticky-Notes/ct/...
Someone being "hard to buy for" isn't a reflection of how well you know them (or if you don't know them). It is simply a reflection of not quite being able to buy them some of the things they'd really enjoy. It is hard to buy art supplies for the artist if you don't make art yourself, and it is similarly difficult to buy an avid reader books since you don't know what books they've read. On top of it all, they might not need or want much - or simply not express the wants well.
My family has always created wishlists to address this, but now that we're all adults, we've got the issue that we can buy what we want for ourselves. I've had to make a policy of delaying non-urgent purchases and putting them on my wishlist instead, because otherwise the answer to "What do you want for Christmas?" is "I don't know—I already bought all the [reasonably priced] things I want!"
If Christmas weren't a thing, I'd've bought some new cycling gloves a month or two ago, but as it is, I'll keep riding with my very-torn-up pair until Christmas so my family can continue to partake in the gift giving ritual we enjoy without having to resort to finding random stuff the recipient probably doesn't actually want.
The curse of having enough money and not wanting a lot of things. :-)
If Christmas weren't a thing, I'd've bought some new cycling gloves a month or two ago, but as it is, I'll keep riding with my very-torn-up pair until Christmas so my family can continue to partake in the gift giving ritual we enjoy without having to resort to finding random stuff the recipient probably doesn't actually want.
The curse of having enough money and not wanting a lot of things. :-)
Maybe my extended family is weird, but most gift giving is extremely impersonal these days and only done as a matter of tradition. People are making up wish lists and sending them to others specifically to avoid forcing the other party to invest a lot of effort into a gift that might not be received well.
Gift cards are the worst of both worlds - just as impersonal as cash, but even more limiting.
Gift cards are the worst of both worlds - just as impersonal as cash, but even more limiting.
Pro Tip: Cracker Barrel Country stores are great... They have tons of low-cost and quite universally likeable throw-away nick-nacks that you can pick up and keep in a closet of your house until an awkward "I don't know what to get this person" situation comes up. :P
I don’t like getting Knickknacks, but my favorite kitchen accessories make good gifts for many people. Instant read thermometers, silicone oven mits, etc
Err, no!
I have rather a small kitchen, and I like cooking. In the same way that a carpenter prefers to choose his own tools, I prefer to choose my own kitchen implements. I'd prefer to receive consumable ingredients that can last a year or two on the shelf (no, not stem ginger in brandy, thanks all the same).
I have rather a small kitchen, and I like cooking. In the same way that a carpenter prefers to choose his own tools, I prefer to choose my own kitchen implements. I'd prefer to receive consumable ingredients that can last a year or two on the shelf (no, not stem ginger in brandy, thanks all the same).
[deleted]
> you shouldn’t be giving them a gift
I hate buying birthday and christmas gifts, and I don't expect to receive them either. I don't have space in my small flat for stuff that doesn't earn the space it occupies, and I assume my relatives don't either.
My policy is to buy presents for people when I find something that I think they'd want. I usually check with them first, so that I'm getting the correct style or model. This process isn't synchronised with any anniversaries, except that if it's near an anniversary, a date-adjustment might occur. For an occasion for which some kind of gift would be expected (e.g. 21st, birth, retirement), if I don't find the right thing, they get cash.
I prefer not to give cash ("it's the thought that counts", and giving cash doesn't involve a lot of thought), and in practice I only give cash to my grown-up kids, who understand how I operate. The hardest target is small kids, who enjoy unwrapping things and enjoying them immediately. I've given cash to my toddler granddaughters too, though (via the investment fund their parents operate); but not on their birthdays.
My late father didn't want people to give him "hard" gifts - stuff that he had to keep somewhere, or worse: put on display to prove he appreciated it. He preferred gifts of food, or other stuff that could be consumed fairly quickly. I'm the same, and I treat others as I would like to be treated myself. I have enough stuff (but I'm running low on caviar).
I think a random, well-targeted, gift on a non-anniversary, coming out of blue sky, is much more exciting than yet another plastic birthday present, arriving on the same day as all the other anniversary presents, that will last a couple of weeks before going to landfill.
I often forget my own birthday. I'm fine with a Happy Birthday phone-call - or none. If someone needs an anniversary gift, for whatever reason, I visit a few card shops, and choose a really snazzy, expensive one. Some of my rels are still displaying fancy commercial cards I sent them ten years ago; I'm still displaying a hand-made card drawn by my 2-year-old granddaughter.
My christmas-card list is zero lines long.
I hate buying birthday and christmas gifts, and I don't expect to receive them either. I don't have space in my small flat for stuff that doesn't earn the space it occupies, and I assume my relatives don't either.
My policy is to buy presents for people when I find something that I think they'd want. I usually check with them first, so that I'm getting the correct style or model. This process isn't synchronised with any anniversaries, except that if it's near an anniversary, a date-adjustment might occur. For an occasion for which some kind of gift would be expected (e.g. 21st, birth, retirement), if I don't find the right thing, they get cash.
I prefer not to give cash ("it's the thought that counts", and giving cash doesn't involve a lot of thought), and in practice I only give cash to my grown-up kids, who understand how I operate. The hardest target is small kids, who enjoy unwrapping things and enjoying them immediately. I've given cash to my toddler granddaughters too, though (via the investment fund their parents operate); but not on their birthdays.
My late father didn't want people to give him "hard" gifts - stuff that he had to keep somewhere, or worse: put on display to prove he appreciated it. He preferred gifts of food, or other stuff that could be consumed fairly quickly. I'm the same, and I treat others as I would like to be treated myself. I have enough stuff (but I'm running low on caviar).
I think a random, well-targeted, gift on a non-anniversary, coming out of blue sky, is much more exciting than yet another plastic birthday present, arriving on the same day as all the other anniversary presents, that will last a couple of weeks before going to landfill.
I often forget my own birthday. I'm fine with a Happy Birthday phone-call - or none. If someone needs an anniversary gift, for whatever reason, I visit a few card shops, and choose a really snazzy, expensive one. Some of my rels are still displaying fancy commercial cards I sent them ten years ago; I'm still displaying a hand-made card drawn by my 2-year-old granddaughter.
My christmas-card list is zero lines long.
I mean, it's all cultural.
But the idea is that a gift is personal, and that cash is impersonal. The universality is exactly what makes it impersonal.
The ideal gift (again, in US cultural context) is one that reflects something unique about the giver, or recipient, or the relationship between them. An exchange of cash is something that happens between strangers on a regular basis.
But the idea is that a gift is personal, and that cash is impersonal. The universality is exactly what makes it impersonal.
The ideal gift (again, in US cultural context) is one that reflects something unique about the giver, or recipient, or the relationship between them. An exchange of cash is something that happens between strangers on a regular basis.
This is generally solved with a note alongside the cash.
"Please treat yourself to a meal at my favourite restaurant, X."
"I think you can buy some plants for the garden."
"Please treat yourself to a meal at my favourite restaurant, X."
"I think you can buy some plants for the garden."
> This is generally solved with a note alongside the cash.
I think "solved" here should be "mitigated". Certainly culturally it seems lots of people don't consider this equivalent although logically it could be seen as "better".
I think "solved" here should be "mitigated". Certainly culturally it seems lots of people don't consider this equivalent although logically it could be seen as "better".
This is the same idea behind giving a gift card (if it's done thoughtfully).
Don't agree.
If you do something like that, you are making your gift conditional.
If you do something like that, you are making your gift conditional.
Lets be clear, a gift card is just as shitty a gift - it just manages to be a mite less crass
A gift card is more crass and far shittier than cash. It is giving me an obligation to shop somewhere and to keep track of that.
I do not want to carry a stupid gift card around with me, or have to remember to use it, or how much more is left on it. And the principle of it is that the cash they could have given you is now earning the retailer interest?
I do not want to carry a stupid gift card around with me, or have to remember to use it, or how much more is left on it. And the principle of it is that the cash they could have given you is now earning the retailer interest?
I agree that it's shittier (from an ease-of-use perspective), but I don't agree that it's more crass. The usual objection to cash or cash-equivalent gifts is that they're impersonal and show that you don't know the recipient well enough to pick a gift they'd like, or care enough to expend the effort to find one.
A gift card (at least if it isn't something generic like Amazon or Starbucks) at least says "I wasn't sure what to get you, but I know you like X-type things, and store Y is all about X-type things, so here's a gift card for store Y". I think this sort of thing can work well for hobbies where a gift-giver might not be able to reasonably choose what to get. Like, for example, I wouldn't mind a gift card to a hobbyist electronics store like Adafruit, but, given the nature of the things I buy there, I would never expect any of my friends (or even my girlfriend) to know what I'd find useful from there without asking me for a specific thing to get for me, which would ruin any amount of surprise. But on receiving that gift card, I'd think it was a nice surprise, and very thoughtful that they remembered that time I was talking about how I bought an ESP32 dev board and was playing around with some electronics projects.
But yeah, if someone gave me an Amazon gift card, I would find that as thoughtless as cash (fortunately still easy to use, since I buy things from Amazon all the time, and I can easily just add the gift card to my account and then not worry about it anymore). And if someone gave me a Starbucks gift card, they clearly do not know me at all, as I don't drink coffee.
Again, totally agree that gift cards are worse than cash from a usability perspective, but I think they're less crass. You might be unhappy to receive a gift card, but there are many people who would fell warmer and fuzzier receiving a (thoughtfully-selected) gift card, rather than cash.
> And the principle of it is that the cash they could have given you is now earning the retailer interest?
As the article says, vanishingly few retailers make interest or investment returns off gift card money. Nearly all of them consider it working capital and use it to help run their businesses.
Either way, I find this to be a weird objection. A gift is about the giver and the receiver. If a third party makes interest off some unrelated side transaction, it's kinda petty to be worked up about it.
A gift card (at least if it isn't something generic like Amazon or Starbucks) at least says "I wasn't sure what to get you, but I know you like X-type things, and store Y is all about X-type things, so here's a gift card for store Y". I think this sort of thing can work well for hobbies where a gift-giver might not be able to reasonably choose what to get. Like, for example, I wouldn't mind a gift card to a hobbyist electronics store like Adafruit, but, given the nature of the things I buy there, I would never expect any of my friends (or even my girlfriend) to know what I'd find useful from there without asking me for a specific thing to get for me, which would ruin any amount of surprise. But on receiving that gift card, I'd think it was a nice surprise, and very thoughtful that they remembered that time I was talking about how I bought an ESP32 dev board and was playing around with some electronics projects.
But yeah, if someone gave me an Amazon gift card, I would find that as thoughtless as cash (fortunately still easy to use, since I buy things from Amazon all the time, and I can easily just add the gift card to my account and then not worry about it anymore). And if someone gave me a Starbucks gift card, they clearly do not know me at all, as I don't drink coffee.
Again, totally agree that gift cards are worse than cash from a usability perspective, but I think they're less crass. You might be unhappy to receive a gift card, but there are many people who would fell warmer and fuzzier receiving a (thoughtfully-selected) gift card, rather than cash.
> And the principle of it is that the cash they could have given you is now earning the retailer interest?
As the article says, vanishingly few retailers make interest or investment returns off gift card money. Nearly all of them consider it working capital and use it to help run their businesses.
Either way, I find this to be a weird objection. A gift is about the giver and the receiver. If a third party makes interest off some unrelated side transaction, it's kinda petty to be worked up about it.
I will give you that gift cards can be used to signal they noticed you like a certain type of thing, but a gift card to Amazon or Target does not do that.
If you really do not know what the other person would like as a gift, and do not want to do cash, a regular phone calls I think is more meaningful. I want for almost nothing except home cooked food that would be given as a gift, but just calling and spending a few min to say hello and update on happenings in your life is much preferred.
If you really do not know what the other person would like as a gift, and do not want to do cash, a regular phone calls I think is more meaningful. I want for almost nothing except home cooked food that would be given as a gift, but just calling and spending a few min to say hello and update on happenings in your life is much preferred.
[deleted]
Yup.
I've never purchased a gift card. I've received them (for participating in a COVID survey actually - but I'd have participated for nothing), and I gave them to people. If they'd given me cash, I'd probably have kept it.
I've never purchased a gift card. I've received them (for participating in a COVID survey actually - but I'd have participated for nothing), and I gave them to people. If they'd given me cash, I'd probably have kept it.
Could it also be that it would get awkward if two people exchanged cash gifts and they were different amounts.
(Also could get awkward if it was the same amount.)
(Also could get awkward if it was the same amount.)
If it's a type of exchange where that may happen, then neither side likely needs the money. It's best to get just give a card. I think cash is more appropriate for parents/grandparents/aunts giving money to their kids/grandkids/etc, and less appropriate between peers. If you feel the need to get your peer something, then get them something you think they may like. If you don't know what that is, then IMO you should stick with a card or nothing at all.
My family has been moving away from gift giving, in favor of spending time together instead. Show people you care for them all year long and don't buy in to these over-commercialized traditions.
My family has been moving away from gift giving, in favor of spending time together instead. Show people you care for them all year long and don't buy in to these over-commercialized traditions.
> something unique about the giver
Yass. If I'm giving a gift, as often as not it expresses me, rather than the giftee. E.g. I don't know what the giftee likes to read; so I buy them a book that I'd like to be given. Even if they don't like the book, they have the opportunity to know me better. Signed editions are cool, because they may have resale value.
And it's absolutely OK to ebay my gifts; once it's given, it's not mine any more, and it's yours to dispose of as you see fit. I'd prefer if you kept it and used it, of course; but gifting is intrisically haphazard. For me, it's essential that you completely let go of what you've given.
Yass. If I'm giving a gift, as often as not it expresses me, rather than the giftee. E.g. I don't know what the giftee likes to read; so I buy them a book that I'd like to be given. Even if they don't like the book, they have the opportunity to know me better. Signed editions are cool, because they may have resale value.
And it's absolutely OK to ebay my gifts; once it's given, it's not mine any more, and it's yours to dispose of as you see fit. I'd prefer if you kept it and used it, of course; but gifting is intrisically haphazard. For me, it's essential that you completely let go of what you've given.
https://jeremyperson.com/2009/12/25/dilbert-christmas-gifts
I'm terrible at gifts, but I'd never give cash/gift cards (cash that expires and you can only spend in one shop)
The point of a gift is to show that you understand your friend/family member and have spent your own time to try to make them happy
I'm terrible at gifts, but I'd never give cash/gift cards (cash that expires and you can only spend in one shop)
The point of a gift is to show that you understand your friend/family member and have spent your own time to try to make them happy
> cash that expires
In some places, gift cards cannot legally expire. Other objections still apply, but fortunately not always that one, which I agree is gross.
In some places, gift cards cannot legally expire. Other objections still apply, but fortunately not always that one, which I agree is gross.
In chinese culture, it's a pretty normal thing to give red envelopes with cash inside[0]
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_envelope
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_envelope
I get those from my boss every year. pretty cool tradition.
Those are a family thing, though. Other than at my wedding, I've only ever received a straight cash gift from family members (eg, grandparents).
Every Chinese kid gets these during the New Year celebrations. It's not a family thing so much as it's cultural.
I married a Chinese woman, and thus at New Year’s all the children would go out of their way to do me favours so I would give them their red packets.
I jokingly complained that I was getting a bad deal: I didn’t get red packets as a child, but I had to give them away as an adult. But my aunt-in-law put it most amusingly:
“Giving red packets is even luckier than receiving them.”
How so?
“Do you have money to put in the packet and still eat? That’s pretty lucky."
I jokingly complained that I was getting a bad deal: I didn’t get red packets as a child, but I had to give them away as an adult. But my aunt-in-law put it most amusingly:
“Giving red packets is even luckier than receiving them.”
How so?
“Do you have money to put in the packet and still eat? That’s pretty lucky."
But mostly within families, right? Admittedly I don't have any first hand exposure to these customs, but are red envelopes being given at work parties or between adult friends? The Wikipedia article cited in this thread is a bit vague on this:
"Red envelopes are gifts presented at social and family gatherings such as weddings or holidays such as Chinese New Year. The red color of the envelope symbolizes good luck and is a symbol to ward off evil spirits. It is also gifted when a person is visiting as a gesture of kindness for visiting. The act of requesting red packets is normally called tao hongbao or yao lishi, and in the south of China, dou li shi. Red envelopes are usually given out to the younger generation who are normally still in school or unemployed."
I loved Sacred Economics and I'm all about figuring out how to reintegrate potlatching and other gift economy ideas into the western world. We desperately need mechanisms other than inheritance for transferring wealth to the younger generations. So I'd love to hear that these practices are occurring outside extended families, but that's not been my impression.
"Red envelopes are gifts presented at social and family gatherings such as weddings or holidays such as Chinese New Year. The red color of the envelope symbolizes good luck and is a symbol to ward off evil spirits. It is also gifted when a person is visiting as a gesture of kindness for visiting. The act of requesting red packets is normally called tao hongbao or yao lishi, and in the south of China, dou li shi. Red envelopes are usually given out to the younger generation who are normally still in school or unemployed."
I loved Sacred Economics and I'm all about figuring out how to reintegrate potlatching and other gift economy ideas into the western world. We desperately need mechanisms other than inheritance for transferring wealth to the younger generations. So I'd love to hear that these practices are occurring outside extended families, but that's not been my impression.
I mean, it's "mostly within families" in the sense that most gifting occurs within family anywhere, but it certainly isn't restricted to familial contexts; you could definitely give them to friends, co-workers, teachers or other acquaintances.
Traditionally, there's some nuances to it, e.g. it's often a tradition associated with visiting someone, and it is meant to have symbolic intent, meaning that it doesn't fit settings like secret santas.
Traditionally, there's some nuances to it, e.g. it's often a tradition associated with visiting someone, and it is meant to have symbolic intent, meaning that it doesn't fit settings like secret santas.
Also given by managers to staff and generally to people that help you in your day-to-day life.
Cool! I wonder if it’s maybe an analog to westerners giving extra big tips at the holiday season to their hairdresser, barista, cleaning lady, etc
Is that a Western thing?
I know they do it in South Africa (along with a "13th month" of pay), and I'm assuming the US too.
Outside of those two, I don't really know of any other Western cultures where tipping is much of a thing at all - let alone big tips at the end of the year.
I know they do it in South Africa (along with a "13th month" of pay), and I'm assuming the US too.
Outside of those two, I don't really know of any other Western cultures where tipping is much of a thing at all - let alone big tips at the end of the year.
> I don't really know of any other Western cultures where tipping is much of a thing at all
When my dad sent me to the barbers for a haircut, he gave me a coin to tip the barber. I think the idea was that the barber might remember me (9 year-old kid)! I don't have much hair now, so I don't have to tip barbers. But I tip taxi-drivers, evern though I know I'll probably never see them again, and if I do, they csrtainly won't remember me.
I tip waiters, because I believe they depend on tips to get decent pay. I hate it that this is necessary. I also HATE that tips for waiters go into the tip-jar, and are shared by kitchen staff and management.
People should get proper pay. How hard is that to understand?
When my dad sent me to the barbers for a haircut, he gave me a coin to tip the barber. I think the idea was that the barber might remember me (9 year-old kid)! I don't have much hair now, so I don't have to tip barbers. But I tip taxi-drivers, evern though I know I'll probably never see them again, and if I do, they csrtainly won't remember me.
I tip waiters, because I believe they depend on tips to get decent pay. I hate it that this is necessary. I also HATE that tips for waiters go into the tip-jar, and are shared by kitchen staff and management.
People should get proper pay. How hard is that to understand?
In Britain some people (used to?) give small tips to the paper boy, postman, milkman and dustmen at Christmas.
Maybe nowadays this is the Amazon and Deliveroo zero-hours-contract drivers.
https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/bills/article-2524513/En...
Maybe nowadays this is the Amazon and Deliveroo zero-hours-contract drivers.
https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/bills/article-2524513/En...
> dustmen
The "sanitary operatives" in the UK used to ring your doorbell in the run-up to Christmas, more-or-less demanding a tip. If you didn't tip, then you risked having your Christmas rubbish languishing for a couple of weeks, or even strewed over your garden path. Happily, that practice is now ILLEGAL.
The "sanitary operatives" in the UK used to ring your doorbell in the run-up to Christmas, more-or-less demanding a tip. If you didn't tip, then you risked having your Christmas rubbish languishing for a couple of weeks, or even strewed over your garden path. Happily, that practice is now ILLEGAL.
Interesting, thanks for that.
Maybe Aussies are the odd ones out in this regard...
I've definitely seen hongbao exchanged between adult friends in a wedding setting, but I'm not sure if this extends to the general case.
I zelle’d (US instant payment system for participating financial institutions) someone their cash wedding gift, to heck with social convention.
this is the correct way, fast, no transaction fees, no one takes a cut
And safe and easy. Cash in an envelope could be lost, and then it's gone. A check could be lost and would need to be canceled and re-written. And either way you have to take an extra step to get it in your bank account. (At least with a check, most banks have a phone deposit option. You'd have to physically take the cash to a bank branch or at best ATM.)
Giving cash is common in India, and I believe several other Asian countries.
Edit: In fact, in India it is common for folks to keep track of how much who gave, so that that a similar/slightly larger amount can be returned when the time comes.
Edit2: Another cultural tidbit, in India generally you give an odd number ending in 1. Common gifts are 11, 21, 51, 101, 501, 1001 ...
Edit: In fact, in India it is common for folks to keep track of how much who gave, so that that a similar/slightly larger amount can be returned when the time comes.
Edit2: Another cultural tidbit, in India generally you give an odd number ending in 1. Common gifts are 11, 21, 51, 101, 501, 1001 ...
Cash is common in China...or now a days, on WeChat you can send a "Red packet" of money to friends or in a groups. If you go to a wedding, you drop your red packet in a box...while in the US we have "gift registries" where a newly wed are forced to acquire physical possessions they may or may not need.
I'm not sure why cash is taboo in US - I suspect it's derived from corporations trying to drive customers to purchase items, even gift cards. After all, $1 saved is $1 not spent and that's bad for profits /s.
I'm not sure why cash is taboo in US - I suspect it's derived from corporations trying to drive customers to purchase items, even gift cards. After all, $1 saved is $1 not spent and that's bad for profits /s.
My father in law would do things like taping bills to the bottom of a Nutella jar and wrapping that as a gift for grandkids.
Was appreciated by all. Cash as a gift can be fun if you are creative with it.
Was appreciated by all. Cash as a gift can be fun if you are creative with it.
This. I recently got married and one of the gifts was a box of origami boats made from cash, with a nice card about how our marriage boat will take us on many great journeys. At the end of the day, it was cash but it really stuck out as an excellent gift.
Even when people ask for specific gifts (think wedding registries... baby shower gift lists...) I still just gift them cash/Venmo with a personal message, usually double or triple whatever the gift ideas recommended. I do not care about the cultural strings attached, because if I was in the situation of asking for gifts- usually caused by a taboo of directly asking for money- I would be thankful for the cash.
I see commenters here on HN talking about how 'thoughtful' a gift card is... no, a gift card is selfishly deciding how someone else should spend money that was supposed to be a gift.
I see commenters here on HN talking about how 'thoughtful' a gift card is... no, a gift card is selfishly deciding how someone else should spend money that was supposed to be a gift.
Cash in a nice card can certainly be as good or better than a gift card. It's not necessarily a faux-pas. But it really depends on the situation. In some cases a gift card can be better if it is clear that the giver put some thought into the selection of the card (i.e., where it can be redeemed). There is something about the fact that the funds on a gift card can only be used in a restricted way that encourages the recipient to use it on something special. When I get cash, by contrast, I usually just put it in my bank account. I appreciate getting it, but its a different experience from a well selected gift card. (This can be at least partially addressed by including a note with the cash with some ideas on how to spend it.)
Note, however, that I'm assuming that the gift card is well selected. In practice, I find that this is usually not the case--probably because the giver was simply looking for an alternative to giving cash. Under these circumstances I agree that cash is actually better. There are few gifts worse than a gift card to a restaurant you don't like, for products you aren't interested in, or to a totally generic store.
I think the gold standard remains a thoughtful, nonmonetary gift. But that's often just not realistic.
Edit: A sibling comment points out that this is all cultural. And they're exactly right. So I suppose I should specify that I'm a Christmas-celebrating American. YMMV for gift-giving holidays and rituals from other traditions.
Note, however, that I'm assuming that the gift card is well selected. In practice, I find that this is usually not the case--probably because the giver was simply looking for an alternative to giving cash. Under these circumstances I agree that cash is actually better. There are few gifts worse than a gift card to a restaurant you don't like, for products you aren't interested in, or to a totally generic store.
I think the gold standard remains a thoughtful, nonmonetary gift. But that's often just not realistic.
Edit: A sibling comment points out that this is all cultural. And they're exactly right. So I suppose I should specify that I'm a Christmas-celebrating American. YMMV for gift-giving holidays and rituals from other traditions.
The last two times, I’ve included a short url that redirects to a notion page personalized for the person. As in it includes the nickname or something. The page includes instructions on how to add the gift card to the store’s app and/or site (with an account). All relevant links included to make it as easy as possible.
I also looked up apps that can be gift card aggregators and will include that next time too.
—-
I did a similar thing when I gifted Alexa Echo Show devices (the ones with a screen). These instructions included how to use a separate Amazon account so the device won’t get your contacts etc, if the person wants that privacy. Along with two 3 minute videos setting up the device and going over a few basic aspects of it. This would be a ton of work for one gift. I have now done this gift 5x and primarily to average technical people.
Basically what I’m saying is. Gift giving is hard. It makes me super anxious and stressed. I think I’ve found my own niche/trick of including personalized instructions and information. I’ve never tried this on an equally techy person though!
I also looked up apps that can be gift card aggregators and will include that next time too.
—-
I did a similar thing when I gifted Alexa Echo Show devices (the ones with a screen). These instructions included how to use a separate Amazon account so the device won’t get your contacts etc, if the person wants that privacy. Along with two 3 minute videos setting up the device and going over a few basic aspects of it. This would be a ton of work for one gift. I have now done this gift 5x and primarily to average technical people.
Basically what I’m saying is. Gift giving is hard. It makes me super anxious and stressed. I think I’ve found my own niche/trick of including personalized instructions and information. I’ve never tried this on an equally techy person though!
Hey, I started an app that’s centered around birthday gifts (https://hbd.cool). You can send gift cards and digital greetings kind of like you describe, it’s a fun way to personalize what’s usually a boring gift (as other commenters have mentioned). Would love to get your feedback on it!
Hey sorry I didn’t see this before. I’ll be sure to give feed back soon
I'm with you. Cash for adults. Toys for kids. If it discourages anyone from giving me a gift in the future, that's all the better. I like give giving, not gift exchanging.
I don't think it always is a faux-pas, and it depends on the recipient and your relationship with them.
Some people believe that cash is an impersonal gift and that you should spend more effort to find a personal gift that the recipient would enjoy. I would find it weird if a friend came to my birthday party and gave me cash, but a gift of a nice whiskey or gin, or a silly joke gift, would feel normal. (Also no gift at all would be fine!)
I've given cash as wedding gifts with the suggestion/hope that the couple spends it on something fun during their honeymoon (but of course they're free to spend it on whatever they like). Plenty of friends who I've talked to have agreed that cash is a fine wedding gift (and sometimes preferred). Most people set up gift registries for weddings, so it's not like the non-monetary gifts from the registry are a big surprise that required a lot of thought and personal attention on the giver's part.
> Anyone who tries to put me down for doing so will simply not be receiving a gift from me next year
Hell, anyone who complains in any way about a gift they've received should fall off the gift-giving list, regardless of what the gift was. Even if someone gives you a gift you don't like or won't use, the gracious thing is to accept it and give thanks. It really is the thought that counts. If you can re-purpose or re-gift it to someone who would actually appreciate it, and do it in a way that won't end up offending the gift-giver, all the better.
I've heard the argument that you should tell the gift giver, because you don't want them to waste their money on something you don't like, but I'm not really persuaded by that. Maybe in some situations, but probably not most. Again, depends on the relationship between the people involved.
Some people believe that cash is an impersonal gift and that you should spend more effort to find a personal gift that the recipient would enjoy. I would find it weird if a friend came to my birthday party and gave me cash, but a gift of a nice whiskey or gin, or a silly joke gift, would feel normal. (Also no gift at all would be fine!)
I've given cash as wedding gifts with the suggestion/hope that the couple spends it on something fun during their honeymoon (but of course they're free to spend it on whatever they like). Plenty of friends who I've talked to have agreed that cash is a fine wedding gift (and sometimes preferred). Most people set up gift registries for weddings, so it's not like the non-monetary gifts from the registry are a big surprise that required a lot of thought and personal attention on the giver's part.
> Anyone who tries to put me down for doing so will simply not be receiving a gift from me next year
Hell, anyone who complains in any way about a gift they've received should fall off the gift-giving list, regardless of what the gift was. Even if someone gives you a gift you don't like or won't use, the gracious thing is to accept it and give thanks. It really is the thought that counts. If you can re-purpose or re-gift it to someone who would actually appreciate it, and do it in a way that won't end up offending the gift-giver, all the better.
I've heard the argument that you should tell the gift giver, because you don't want them to waste their money on something you don't like, but I'm not really persuaded by that. Maybe in some situations, but probably not most. Again, depends on the relationship between the people involved.
> I would find it weird if a friend came to my birthday party and gave me cash
When I was twelve, my (much richer) friend came to my birthday party; but he didn't know it was my birthday. It was very impressive that on learing the facts, he immediately whipped out his wallet and gave me a tenner (I had never owned a tenner, and I didn't own a wallet).
When I was twelve, my (much richer) friend came to my birthday party; but he didn't know it was my birthday. It was very impressive that on learing the facts, he immediately whipped out his wallet and gave me a tenner (I had never owned a tenner, and I didn't own a wallet).
“Every year I give Leslie the same present I give everyone. A crisp twenty dollar bill..."
Here's an idea to make a cash gift more fun. If I know a family member is trying to save up for something they want (that is either too pricey or too personalized to buy as a gift outright), I'll fold up some cash (origami style - sometimes with tape) in the shape of that item and send that as a gift to contribute to the purchase of the item.
It shows you put some thought into the gift, while leaving them free to spend the money where and however they want. And carefully unfolding it all is a bit of payback for the creative wrapping some siblings like to do :)
It shows you put some thought into the gift, while leaving them free to spend the money where and however they want. And carefully unfolding it all is a bit of payback for the creative wrapping some siblings like to do :)
Along those lines, my mother in law rolled up two dollar bills in a tin can. We were spending the bills all over town. They are rare enough that some places wondered if they were real. Your bank can probably get you as many as you need.
The opposite is true in my circles. Cash is always appreciated while gift cards will earn you dirty looks from bystanders and an awkward, "Erm, uh, thanks!" from the recipient.
It’s not really a faux pas but it’s not very thoughtful. Receiving a small amount of money is also irrelevant to most middle class and above people.
I don't see a gift card as much more thoughtful than cash, but there's at least the slight push of "use this to spoil yourself" when it's something indulgent like Starbucks, the liquor store, Steam, whatever. Versus cash where you may have given it with that intent, but it just as easily ends up folded into the general pot and becoming something boring like gas, groceries, whatever.
Yeah exactly. As the article points out, if you give someone a gift card to a book store knowing they’re an avid reader then that person will presumably use it to buy some books they really want to read. Then when they’re reading they’ll think of you and feel good. On the other hand, if you go out and just buy them some books they might smile and thank you sheepishly but then those books might sit unread on a shelf forever.
People’s tastes can be very specific and so it may be very difficult to buy them a gift they’ll truly appreciate and enjoy unless you’re very close. It’s much easier to buy a gift card for a retailer (coffee, books, video games, makeup, fashion) in their area of interest than to try to buy something truly suited to their tastes. This is especially the case for casual acquaintances such as coworkers.
People’s tastes can be very specific and so it may be very difficult to buy them a gift they’ll truly appreciate and enjoy unless you’re very close. It’s much easier to buy a gift card for a retailer (coffee, books, video games, makeup, fashion) in their area of interest than to try to buy something truly suited to their tastes. This is especially the case for casual acquaintances such as coworkers.
If you're poor then it's definitely appreciated. If you've got money then it's nice, but doesn't have the same effect.
There’s also a meme of envelopes getting raided for the cash within them (“don’t send money through the mail”).
I’ve never actually heard of anyone getting burned by this in modern times though. For sufficiently valuable gift cards (e.g. Amazon), the same hazard exists.
I’ve never actually heard of anyone getting burned by this in modern times though. For sufficiently valuable gift cards (e.g. Amazon), the same hazard exists.
I wish this were a real thing: https://mobile.twitter.com/TwoClawsMedia/status/121003095448...
> why it faux-pas to just put cash in a nice card
Maybe it is in the US. Here in Russia it's kinda common to gift cash. There are even special cards for that. Many stores do sell gift cards, but I've yet to see someone buy or redeem one.
Maybe it is in the US. Here in Russia it's kinda common to gift cash. There are even special cards for that. Many stores do sell gift cards, but I've yet to see someone buy or redeem one.
In Poland, gift cards are relatively common, but not common enough. The problem is there are many different stores, and it might be hard to gauge which card the recipient would be interested in the most. For women, IKEA cards are common (for furniture). Empik (a store with books, board games, video games and some random third party stuff) is a popular gift card choice. So is Allegro (all kinds of products, started as Ebay-like service, these days is more like Amazon/Aliexpress connecting third party vendors to buyers).
For gamers, Steam cards are not too bad.
For gamers, Steam cards are not too bad.
From the article:
Personal financial columnists and comedians do not understand the jobs that gift cards do. They are not cash-but-worse-in-every-way. Closed loop cards allow a giver to personalize a gift to the recipient. A Barnes and Noble gift card to a favorite niece tells that niece that you remember she is a reader, unlike those uncreative family members who would just give her cash.
If anyone’s psychology is being manipulated, it is likely the recipient, on a theory very similar to the one that causes many readers’ employers to offer a gym stipend instead of the equivalent amount of salary. You appreciate the money more, not less, because of the story about your relationship it comes with.
Personal financial columnists and comedians do not understand the jobs that gift cards do. They are not cash-but-worse-in-every-way. Closed loop cards allow a giver to personalize a gift to the recipient. A Barnes and Noble gift card to a favorite niece tells that niece that you remember she is a reader, unlike those uncreative family members who would just give her cash.
If anyone’s psychology is being manipulated, it is likely the recipient, on a theory very similar to the one that causes many readers’ employers to offer a gym stipend instead of the equivalent amount of salary. You appreciate the money more, not less, because of the story about your relationship it comes with.
“I think a gift card is a bad gift. You take money that is good everywhere...” (long pause, punctuated by applause and laughter)
—Mitch Hedberg, 1968 - 2005
—Mitch Hedberg, 1968 - 2005
It works until everyone does it. It's kind of weird when I give my mom cash in a card and she gives me cash in a card...
Is it? In my family it definitely isn’t.
Probably some trade consortium trying to convince you that cash is looked down upon. I've yet to meet a younger person who didn't appreciate "cold hard cash" in a card, a la Lucy Van Pelt.
We make the same "hope it fits" joke every year and everyone still smiles, so I guess it works fine.
My family accepts cash and equivalents for Christmas.
The past four Christmas I've sent bank transfers on the 25th.
Shopping malls, ATMs and banks get just too crowded those days.
The past four Christmas I've sent bank transfers on the 25th.
Shopping malls, ATMs and banks get just too crowded those days.
Gift cards are the ultimate anti-consumer scam:
- If you buy a gift card that isn’t worth enough for what you actually buy, the store “wins” because you will probably make up the difference with cash and they then sell you something you either would not have bought at all, or bought somewhere else.
- If you buy a gift card that is worth more than whatever you end up buying, the store “wins” again because they have received the full value and you did not.
- If you buy a gift card and by some miracle it is exactly matching the cost of what you buy, the store “wins” yet again because (a) you were still only able to purchase items from that store, and (b) the entire time you were holding the card, it was slowly losing value because only bad things could have happened: the store might have stopped offering what you wanted, the price could have changed, or heck the store could have simply gone out of business. Meanwhile, the store was already paid by you for the card (in yesterday’s dollars) so they could do almost anything with that CASH, including putting it in a saving account, and end up better off than you.
Simply put, it is never, ever, ever to your advantage to have a gift card. Ever!! Cash is better in every possible way.
- If you buy a gift card that isn’t worth enough for what you actually buy, the store “wins” because you will probably make up the difference with cash and they then sell you something you either would not have bought at all, or bought somewhere else.
- If you buy a gift card that is worth more than whatever you end up buying, the store “wins” again because they have received the full value and you did not.
- If you buy a gift card and by some miracle it is exactly matching the cost of what you buy, the store “wins” yet again because (a) you were still only able to purchase items from that store, and (b) the entire time you were holding the card, it was slowly losing value because only bad things could have happened: the store might have stopped offering what you wanted, the price could have changed, or heck the store could have simply gone out of business. Meanwhile, the store was already paid by you for the card (in yesterday’s dollars) so they could do almost anything with that CASH, including putting it in a saving account, and end up better off than you.
Simply put, it is never, ever, ever to your advantage to have a gift card. Ever!! Cash is better in every possible way.
I mostly agree with you, but I don't think most people are buying gift cards for themselves. Why would they when there are activation fees attached to these products? Generally they're given out as kind of a lazy gift among family and friends during the holidays, or somtimes from businesses to their employees. As long as the card is for something mildly useful like Starbucks (Although according to the post this seems to be the one that is actually redeemed the least), or Amazon then I wouldn't be too upset about receiving one. At the end of the day though I'm in the same camp as you when it comes to my own spending. I don't like to give money to anyone for anything less than immediate services rendered.
I only ever saw activation fees for cards that correspond to prepaid credit cards. Gift cards for everything else cost exactly what the face value is.
I'd add one small exception; around here restaurants tend to do sales at certain times where if you buy a 50 dollar gift card, they'll add another 20 dollar gift card free, sometimes it is buy-one-get-one, which you can buy and enjoy like a coupon for taking out your family. For places you go to anyway, this is a great way to save a little.
So I admittedly don't tend to think of consumerism as a game that a consumer can win, but I just wanted to add one more route here. What if you buy a gift card on special deal that gives you an additional percentage of funds for you to spend? Such as... Buy $100 get an additional $20. Assuming this is a place that you regularly want to shop? Then you are effectively getting $20 off a purchase you were going to make anyways.
Perkbox in the UK does this. You can buy gift cards for less than their face value as an employee perk if your company subscribes to the service.
Yeah see that's what I thought, I feel like I saw a gift card like that through Sephora this year during the black Friday/Cyber Monday madness and I was really tempted to actually buy a gift card for once.
> If you buy a gift card that is worth more than whatever you end up buying, the store “wins” again because they have received the full value and you did not
Escheatment laws in most US states ensure gift card issuers can't just keep unredeemed balances for themselves. Unclaimed balances are remitted to the states.
Escheatment laws in most US states ensure gift card issuers can't just keep unredeemed balances for themselves. Unclaimed balances are remitted to the states.
Except when I get 20% off the gift card, and use it for stuff I was already going to buy. Like food.
Here in the UK there used to be a website for buying and selling gift cards (called Zeek). As you'd expect, the market value of a £100 gift card depended on the popularity of the issuing retailer. (Amazon vouchers would sell very quickly and for close to face value.) That website has since disappeared, but you can still do the same thing on eBay.
Exactly. Not all gift cards are created equal.
I got Visa cash gift cards from my employer as small bonuses. The terms sucked - don't use it and you get hit with a fee, it had an expiration date that cost money to "renew", etc.
Amazon's gift card policy is great. The money just sits in your account, doesn't expire, can be used for anything (except other Amazon gift cards) and there is no fee to reload it with a credit card AND you can reload with an exact amount.
So as soon as I got a crappy visa gift card, I'd just transfer 100% of the money to Amazon and spend it down over the next year. It was a perfect solution.
I got Visa cash gift cards from my employer as small bonuses. The terms sucked - don't use it and you get hit with a fee, it had an expiration date that cost money to "renew", etc.
Amazon's gift card policy is great. The money just sits in your account, doesn't expire, can be used for anything (except other Amazon gift cards) and there is no fee to reload it with a credit card AND you can reload with an exact amount.
So as soon as I got a crappy visa gift card, I'd just transfer 100% of the money to Amazon and spend it down over the next year. It was a perfect solution.
What about credit card rewards that are high in certain types of store (e.g., 6% cash back on groceries)? I don't see how this is more than the consumer getting a product 6% less than what they would initially pay.
Gift cards have better privacy than credit cards and can be used instead of a credit card for online shopping.
Conversely, here's really "All you need to know about gift cards": think about the interest being generated from all that cash sitting idle on some issuer's account while the recipient of your gift card decides how to spend their money.
> Most retailers do not have sufficient gift card liabilities and do not have sufficiently sophisticated treasury teams to make a meaningful amount of income off an investment portfolio.
This assumes that the retailer is the one holding the cash and not the issuer of the card. I'm by no means an expert in the industry but IIRC there's a whole lot more that goes into this than the author implies.
> Also, they have a much better option. Unlike insurers, who must maintain reserves by regulation, most businesses issuing closed loop gift cards are not required to maintain reserves. They can simply use the cash as a source of working capital for the business, similar to other sources of working capital, except substantially free. Even in a capital-drenched economy, it is tough to beat free.
Agreed, except it would be much better for it to be either me or my recipient who benefits from said "free money".
> Most retailers do not have sufficient gift card liabilities and do not have sufficiently sophisticated treasury teams to make a meaningful amount of income off an investment portfolio.
This assumes that the retailer is the one holding the cash and not the issuer of the card. I'm by no means an expert in the industry but IIRC there's a whole lot more that goes into this than the author implies.
> Also, they have a much better option. Unlike insurers, who must maintain reserves by regulation, most businesses issuing closed loop gift cards are not required to maintain reserves. They can simply use the cash as a source of working capital for the business, similar to other sources of working capital, except substantially free. Even in a capital-drenched economy, it is tough to beat free.
Agreed, except it would be much better for it to be either me or my recipient who benefits from said "free money".
My brother gifts us AmEx gift cards every year. I think he gets them at a discount so it does allow his gifting budget to go further but they are a pain in a-- to use. Unlike a store gift card, they are almost impossible to stack with other payment methods (at least online). Additionally, the test charges a store does to ensure the card is valid places a hold on some of the funds of the card (typically a dollar) making it virtually impossible to use all of the funds on the card. Typically, I end up adding them to my Amazon payment methods and buying an Amazon gift balance to myself and toss the remaining $1 of value in the trash.
I also end up "buying" the gift cards from my wife and son since I'm the only one with the patience to deal with them, so at least we get most of the value off of them rather than letting them expire. It's now 12 days until Xmas and I finally spent us down to only $11 left from last year's cards.
I also end up "buying" the gift cards from my wife and son since I'm the only one with the patience to deal with them, so at least we get most of the value off of them rather than letting them expire. It's now 12 days until Xmas and I finally spent us down to only $11 left from last year's cards.
Wouldn't it be easiest to use the money for routine spending, perhaps somewhere where splitting a bill is normal?
For example, next time you take the family to a restaurant. "Could you put $50 on this card please, and the rest on this one."
For example, next time you take the family to a restaurant. "Could you put $50 on this card please, and the rest on this one."
Also, just go to the gas station and prepay with the amount that the card has on it to the penny.
yes, the article mentions coupons briefly, which are ancestors and a very large topic. Diligent literature search turned up very little. The way the money is actually handled is trade secret it seems. This is a very old aspect of money handling in retail.
> it would be much better for it to be either me or my recipient who benefits
Better for whom?
Better for whom?
> Personal financial columnists and comedians do not understand the jobs that gift cards do. They are not cash-but-worse-in-every-way. Closed loop cards allow a giver to personalize a gift to the recipient. A Barnes and Noble gift card to a favorite niece tells that niece that you remember she is a reader, unlike those uncreative family members who would just give her cash.
The article doesn't actually explain the job being done by gift cards. The job is the one the giver is expected to perform: the ritual of gift giving. The gift card is hired by the giver for that job. But how did the giver get this job?
Far more interesting than the mechanics of gift card management would be an exploration of this ritual. Where does it come from, and why has it morphed into the economically-essential activity that the former religious holiday of Christmas has become? Are gift cards the last stop before the holiday returns to its roots, or will the next phase become even less recognizable?
The article doesn't actually explain the job being done by gift cards. The job is the one the giver is expected to perform: the ritual of gift giving. The gift card is hired by the giver for that job. But how did the giver get this job?
Far more interesting than the mechanics of gift card management would be an exploration of this ritual. Where does it come from, and why has it morphed into the economically-essential activity that the former religious holiday of Christmas has become? Are gift cards the last stop before the holiday returns to its roots, or will the next phase become even less recognizable?
Some of my family has reverted to just Christmas greeting cards. We were basically exchanging some amount of equal value cards. We decided to just skip that and get together and have a bit of food and company. For other parts of my family getting together and opening presents is part of the get together and has been a tradition in our family for 50+ years. We open our presents and then have a huge paper wad fight. It is kind of fun and trying to tailor the present to the person can be fun. But yeah if you are down to just exchanging gift cards. Just skip that part.
Honestly I wish I could get some people to switch to greeting cards only. The whole equal value exchange is there, but so is the stress of needing to pick out gifts. Honestly, in this day and age I'd rather they give me the gift of less stress by not having to pick out a gift.
Gift cards are about signaling. People are very brand loyal. Cash isn't brand loyal despite its flexibility. Cash and a card to say "buy books" feels less personal than a B&N card for some reason. There is the other part where the gift card is reserved money. Cash gets put into a pocket and spent on gas. A gift card is reserved and people feel anticipation of what they could go buy on their next trip. There is also the open moment when people feel like "Target gift card, I love Target!!!"
Also, do you mean the religious holiday that the church moved to the winter solstice because they couldn't get people to stop celebrating the solstice? Also, in the bible story of Christ, gift giving is the primary plot. A gift from God to save the sinners. You also have the Magi who travel far to bring gifts for Jesus. Gift giving is different than all-consuming commercialism and that has a bigger cause in our advertising controlled economy.
Also, do you mean the religious holiday that the church moved to the winter solstice because they couldn't get people to stop celebrating the solstice? Also, in the bible story of Christ, gift giving is the primary plot. A gift from God to save the sinners. You also have the Magi who travel far to bring gifts for Jesus. Gift giving is different than all-consuming commercialism and that has a bigger cause in our advertising controlled economy.
> A gift card is reserved and people feel anticipation of what they could go buy on their next trip.
Growing up in England, my aunt occasionally managed this with cash.
She would give me Scottish banknotes at Christmas, which look different, but can be spent without much difficulty almost anywhere in Britain.
(The aunt lives in England, so acquiring the Scottish banknotes probably took some effort.)
Growing up in England, my aunt occasionally managed this with cash.
She would give me Scottish banknotes at Christmas, which look different, but can be spent without much difficulty almost anywhere in Britain.
(The aunt lives in England, so acquiring the Scottish banknotes probably took some effort.)
The US equivalent of this, I think, would be giving two-dollar bills. They exist and are legal tender but are rarely seen.
What a lovely idea.
> reserved money
Right, which can make it function a "real" gift because one type of gift is the thing that the recipient wouldn't splurge on for themselves.
Maybe they'd enjoy a meal at a fancy restaurant but they're also frugal and wouldn't actually go. A gift card to the fancy restaurant means they'll probably go there and treat themselves courtesy of you.
Right, which can make it function a "real" gift because one type of gift is the thing that the recipient wouldn't splurge on for themselves.
Maybe they'd enjoy a meal at a fancy restaurant but they're also frugal and wouldn't actually go. A gift card to the fancy restaurant means they'll probably go there and treat themselves courtesy of you.
Gift giving on Christmas is derived from the wise men bringing gifts to the birth of jesus, and likely to earlier pagan rituals that predate Christmas. It is extremely unlikely that Christmas reverts to a banal religious thing. People like Christmas. Some countries, like Japan, have culturally assimilated it, without any of the religious tie ins.
I bet you more money is exchanged on Lunar New Year Day than Christmas. It is significant beyond cultures to have a day of gift giving.
> Closed loop cards allow a giver to personalize a gift to the recipient.
So does a quick note written inside a card with some cash in it.
A gift card is only better than cash when the giver can't or doesn't want to take the time to personalize a gift.
So does a quick note written inside a card with some cash in it.
A gift card is only better than cash when the giver can't or doesn't want to take the time to personalize a gift.
The one advantage of cash and cash equivalents (open loop) over closed loop is that the recipient can decide what they want to spend their money on. Maybe I have enough books for now but do need a pair of shoes.
Or maybe your niece is boycotting B&N for some reason, or knows a much better, cheaper bookstore to shop at.
One thing that drives me nuts, when I give in and produce a list of stuff I'd kinda sorta like for the various relatives requesting such and, inevitably, most of it's just books, is that no one will buy them used. I tell them to, over and over, but they won't do it. I'd rather receive the same number of books and know they spent less on them. Or 3x as many books for the same money. But no. They just won't do it.
Then again, I think toys should be removed from their store packaging before being wrapped, but I always lose that struggle, too. People seem really stuck on only giving visibly-new things. I suspect there's some Fussellian class-analysis to be done on that behavior.
Then again, I think toys should be removed from their store packaging before being wrapped, but I always lose that struggle, too. People seem really stuck on only giving visibly-new things. I suspect there's some Fussellian class-analysis to be done on that behavior.
The next step would be buying religious benefits directly. I don't know, say, "indulgences", that one could purchase directly from a church. Cut out the middle men.
/s
/s
The job being done by gift cards is transferring money to your relatives with some protection against them spending it on drugs.
(Source: a relative who used to give me gift cards.)
(Source: a relative who used to give me gift cards.)
Given all the gift card scams on the internet, I would think it would be pretty straightforward to convert a gift card into drugs but at a net loss in value.
> employers to offer a gym stipend instead of the equivalent amount of salary
Isn't that partly tax benefit and partly the hope that steering employees to better health, results in better employees? E.g., for 20usd I can give them 16usd cash after taxes (or whatever) or 20usd worth of gym membership AND I'd rather my employee exercise than spend money on candy.
> A Barnes and Noble gift card to a favorite niece tells that niece that you remember she is a reader, unlike those uncreative family members who would just give her cash.
My first thought was, as others have mentioned too, "buy a card and give cash", but the thoughtful card costs money, so the recipient pays through poor convenience for the cost of the paper card, instead of the giver spending money on the thoughtful presentation.
Isn't that partly tax benefit and partly the hope that steering employees to better health, results in better employees? E.g., for 20usd I can give them 16usd cash after taxes (or whatever) or 20usd worth of gym membership AND I'd rather my employee exercise than spend money on candy.
> A Barnes and Noble gift card to a favorite niece tells that niece that you remember she is a reader, unlike those uncreative family members who would just give her cash.
My first thought was, as others have mentioned too, "buy a card and give cash", but the thoughtful card costs money, so the recipient pays through poor convenience for the cost of the paper card, instead of the giver spending money on the thoughtful presentation.
At least in the US, the gym has to be exclusive to employees and their families to qualify for a tax benefit.
> You can exclude the value of an employee's use of an on-premises gym or other athletic facility you operate from an employee's wages if substantially all use of the facility during the calendar year is by your employees, their spouses, and their dependent children. For this purpose, an employee's dependent child is a child or stepchild who is the employee's dependent or who, if both parents are deceased, hasn't attained the age of 25. The exclusion doesn't apply to any athletic facility if access to the facility is made available to the general public through the sale of memberships, the rental of the facility, or a similar arrangement.
https://www.irs.gov/publications/p15b#en_US_2021_publink1000...
> You can exclude the value of an employee's use of an on-premises gym or other athletic facility you operate from an employee's wages if substantially all use of the facility during the calendar year is by your employees, their spouses, and their dependent children. For this purpose, an employee's dependent child is a child or stepchild who is the employee's dependent or who, if both parents are deceased, hasn't attained the age of 25. The exclusion doesn't apply to any athletic facility if access to the facility is made available to the general public through the sale of memberships, the rental of the facility, or a similar arrangement.
https://www.irs.gov/publications/p15b#en_US_2021_publink1000...
The company gets not just better employees, but marginally cheaper ones. Healthier employees reduce health insurance premiums for corporate group plans.
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IME, a gift card is a nice/friendly way to push a frugal person to spend money on themselves that they wouldn't do otherwise. If it's cash they'll just deposit it. If a gift card they might actually buy themselves something.
Yes, this exactly. I'm surprised more people aren't thinking of this. Gift cards are nice because it kind of allows/forces you in a guilt-free way to relax and spend something at a certain store rather than just being cash that you feel you'd have to decide how to use it in the best way.
My theory on gift giving is to get the person something they probably want but normally wouldn't, for whatever reason, buy themselves. Like a nice bottle of wine, a lot of people would love it, but would also feel silly spending money on it. It's obviously not always that easy to do this but anytime you can I've found it goes over really well. And yeah, it usually involves kinda silly luxuries like wine.
> it’s very tempting for a payments geek to wax laconic about…
That’s a novel use of laconic to me. Maybe he meant lyrical?
That’s a novel use of laconic to me. Maybe he meant lyrical?
Sounds OK to me. I could imagine 'gift cards are just interfaces', which is laconic, among other adjectives.
If so it is a novel use of “wax” for me.
indeed, it's kind of an oxymoron!
Idea: “unlocked” public bitcoin wallets with autogenerated key pairs that can be given to someone without them needing a pre-existing wallet.
1) transactions are instant and free, ie giving over physical ownership of a pub/private key pair (this could be done via scan of a QR code)
2) no prior onboarding necessary (avoids the repeated question “do you have this wallet/app?”)
Before, if I didn’t have cash, to tip a valet I’d have to ask them “do you have Zelle or Venmo?”, then I’d get their details, then send them money. Here, I could just pull out my wallet, create a new wallet with the specific amount, show them the QR code and say “scan this and it’s yours”.
Basically bitcoin gift cards without the store-specific lock-in.
1) transactions are instant and free, ie giving over physical ownership of a pub/private key pair (this could be done via scan of a QR code)
2) no prior onboarding necessary (avoids the repeated question “do you have this wallet/app?”)
Before, if I didn’t have cash, to tip a valet I’d have to ask them “do you have Zelle or Venmo?”, then I’d get their details, then send them money. Here, I could just pull out my wallet, create a new wallet with the specific amount, show them the QR code and say “scan this and it’s yours”.
Basically bitcoin gift cards without the store-specific lock-in.
Wouldn't your valet example be even easier with venmo? Or is it because the money has a QR code instead of the account - that could easily be done with venmo, but isn't, it's true.
With crypto I worry about the transaction costs dwarfing the utility of something like this. Without a central exchange avoiding fees for the tiny movement of crypto, you'd lose too much in transaction costs when setting up a new wallet to give away. But if you have a central exchange running it anyways why not just expose this UX over an existing cnetralized payment system like venmo?
With Venmo, I still need to ask for their username. A two way transfer of information still has to occur. Same with current wallet-to-wallet transactions. Even if we are in the same app, I need to know your wallet username or address to send you money.
With cash, you can leave a tip in a tip jar, with no “end destination wallet” if you will.
This would aim to solve that issue. The key pair would be contained in whatever the handoff mechanism is (QR code?) so that only a one-way information transfer needs to occur, ie giving someone the QR code or handing them a gift card representation of it. The funds would be locked up in this handoff state until that person were to transfer the funds off or claim ownership another way.
As for the fees, I covered this in my other comment, but basically there would be no on-chain transaction. The funds would never switch wallets.
With cash, you can leave a tip in a tip jar, with no “end destination wallet” if you will.
This would aim to solve that issue. The key pair would be contained in whatever the handoff mechanism is (QR code?) so that only a one-way information transfer needs to occur, ie giving someone the QR code or handing them a gift card representation of it. The funds would be locked up in this handoff state until that person were to transfer the funds off or claim ownership another way.
As for the fees, I covered this in my other comment, but basically there would be no on-chain transaction. The funds would never switch wallets.
With venmo you can just scan their account QR code to send them money, which is easily accessible in the app. I even have a card from them with my qr code printed on it. It requires them to have an account, but this seems no more onerous than understanding how to spend the new wallet you just got the keys to.
When you create the wallet, and put money in it however, there have to be fees right? I understand transferring the wallet is not going to cost anything because you are just sharing a private key, but you still have to fill the wallet. And now the recipient also has to move the money out of the wallet on the blockchain to use it, paying transaction fees. (Worse, they have to do so before you do, since you made the wallet you still have the private key! This needs another centralized service to prevent you from spending money you tipped)
I think the crypto angle is a red herring, what is really important to your idea is the QR-code flow that doesn't require the recipient to have done any setup. That's a good idea.
When you create the wallet, and put money in it however, there have to be fees right? I understand transferring the wallet is not going to cost anything because you are just sharing a private key, but you still have to fill the wallet. And now the recipient also has to move the money out of the wallet on the blockchain to use it, paying transaction fees. (Worse, they have to do so before you do, since you made the wallet you still have the private key! This needs another centralized service to prevent you from spending money you tipped)
I think the crypto angle is a red herring, what is really important to your idea is the QR-code flow that doesn't require the recipient to have done any setup. That's a good idea.
> you can just scan their QR code
You still have to ask them if they have Venmo, ask them for their QR code, scan it, create the transaction, and then send it, and then make sure you sent it to the right person.
The loading wallet/unloading wallet concern is definitely warranted. I’d imagine that this would have to become a new special type of wallet, that the private keys are never accessible to the end-user. You could verify funds in the wallet per the blockchain as normal etc but the administrative account permissions would have to be abstracted to a more centralized system of control unfortunately.
If you spent the funds directly from these temp/“cash” wallets, you wouldn’t need to pay fees on the way out either, right. Furthermore, if you could pay directly with these types of cash wallets, businesses could just utilize the direct transfer themselves and never cash them out when customers use them to purchase from them.
You still have to ask them if they have Venmo, ask them for their QR code, scan it, create the transaction, and then send it, and then make sure you sent it to the right person.
The loading wallet/unloading wallet concern is definitely warranted. I’d imagine that this would have to become a new special type of wallet, that the private keys are never accessible to the end-user. You could verify funds in the wallet per the blockchain as normal etc but the administrative account permissions would have to be abstracted to a more centralized system of control unfortunately.
If you spent the funds directly from these temp/“cash” wallets, you wouldn’t need to pay fees on the way out either, right. Furthermore, if you could pay directly with these types of cash wallets, businesses could just utilize the direct transfer themselves and never cash them out when customers use them to purchase from them.
Right, what you have described requires a central authority to 1) manage access to the funds (instead of trusting the tipper not to spend the funds he gave the tippee), and 2) avoid blockchain overhead by spending from accounts directly. Double spending then is prevented by trust in the central authority in both cases. The only useful part of the crypto currency left is the account-less nature of it, which can be done off the blockchain (has to be really here per number 2).
It's a UX problem in the payments space, which is not really a problem crypto helps with is my point. Definitely see the problem, just don't see the crypto angle.
It's a UX problem in the payments space, which is not really a problem crypto helps with is my point. Definitely see the problem, just don't see the crypto angle.
Well said, I agree with that, although I do think there is a difference between trusting a central authority to maintain an opaque system vs merely being a regulatory figure maintaining a transparent system. If that’s even possible :)
We are currently still trusting places like Coinbase as much as we would need to already, to implement this sort of system. Why? Because you’re right - it’s a current UX problem of payments, not something crypto inherently solves.
We are currently still trusting places like Coinbase as much as we would need to already, to implement this sort of system. Why? Because you’re right - it’s a current UX problem of payments, not something crypto inherently solves.
transactions are very much not free when paying with bitcoin, and this has been tried in a few forms already but none have been successful. how can they spend what you give them? are you going to sit there and explain bitcoin to the waiter?
Let me clarify. Yes, you have to pay transaction fees when transferring money on the blockchain.
I am proposing that no transaction would occur. Just like when you hand cash to someone, no external transfer needs to take place. You would essentially be giving them full access to said wallet, and giving up ownership. No transaction would need to be recorded to the blockchain because no actual wallet transfer would take place. Only the immediate physical ownership of the keys which could happen offline, instantly, etc.
The rest of your questions are not answered so easily, and agreed, this still doesn’t answer the issue of onboarding to crypto in general. What it does solve though is the necessary onboarding to creating a wallet and understanding how to receive bitcoin. No one needs to “understand” how to receive cash. You stick your hand out and receive it. Should be just as easy as that with bitcoin.
I am proposing that no transaction would occur. Just like when you hand cash to someone, no external transfer needs to take place. You would essentially be giving them full access to said wallet, and giving up ownership. No transaction would need to be recorded to the blockchain because no actual wallet transfer would take place. Only the immediate physical ownership of the keys which could happen offline, instantly, etc.
The rest of your questions are not answered so easily, and agreed, this still doesn’t answer the issue of onboarding to crypto in general. What it does solve though is the necessary onboarding to creating a wallet and understanding how to receive bitcoin. No one needs to “understand” how to receive cash. You stick your hand out and receive it. Should be just as easy as that with bitcoin.
Since this amounts to handing over the password to a wallet, what guarantee does the recipient of the wallet have that they are now the exclusive holder of that password?
You could easily have retained access yourself, so after you walk away you can yank the funds out of it.
Or you could hand out access to the same wallet to a half dozen people.
Without actually transferring the funds to a wallet you know you exclusively control, you have no way to know that you've actually received anything of value.
You could easily have retained access yourself, so after you walk away you can yank the funds out of it.
Or you could hand out access to the same wallet to a half dozen people.
Without actually transferring the funds to a wallet you know you exclusively control, you have no way to know that you've actually received anything of value.
Very true - this is elaborated on in the rest of this thread. Basically, the holder would have to be locked out of the private key from creation of the wallet, and there would have to be trust placed in a centralized regulatory body to issue and redeem these wallets.
The holder of the QR code can't be locked out of having the QR code.
I am not sure I buy into your statement here. I believe there is a way.
The blockchain itself is literally the way. That's why it's there. If you take it out, double spends.
Similarly: https://btextc.com/send.html
This is spot on, and I like that you don’t need hardware for it unlike opendime.
Phone numbers are a bit scary though, prone to SIM takeover hacks and other insecurities. And you still have to ask for/have their phone number. I’d prefer to manage the hand-off part of it myself through my medium of choice.
Phone numbers are a bit scary though, prone to SIM takeover hacks and other insecurities. And you still have to ask for/have their phone number. I’d prefer to manage the hand-off part of it myself through my medium of choice.
Vulnerable to double spends.
How can you claim that this is vulnerable to double spends when we haven’t even finished defining the system?
Double spending is a symptom of a broken system. Let us at least figure out the system first so we can determine if it is broken.
Of course double spending is a concern that will need to be navigated in a system like this. Check out some of other discussions in this thread about where that leads - a centralized authoritative body responsible for issuing and “transferring” these wallets.
Double spending is a symptom of a broken system. Let us at least figure out the system first so we can determine if it is broken.
Of course double spending is a concern that will need to be navigated in a system like this. Check out some of other discussions in this thread about where that leads - a centralized authoritative body responsible for issuing and “transferring” these wallets.
Payment by simple QR codes is inherently vulnerable to double spends. Because QR codes can be copied.
If you give the same QR code to two people in the same taxi, literally nothing in the system can ever distinguish between them.
If you give the same QR code to two people in the same taxi, literally nothing in the system can ever distinguish between them.
> "Open-loop gift cards are issued under the aegis of a payments network, like Visa or American Express"
It's ironic that Amex is used as an example given that they are a closed-loop network.
It's ironic that Amex is used as an example given that they are a closed-loop network.
I can spend an Amex card at any retailer that takes amex, vs my Best Buy gift card is only usable at Best Buy. In what way is Amex a closed-loop network?
When it comes to the network, a closed-loop network refers to the fact that the network operator is also the issuing bank (e.g. Amex, Discover). Open loop networks, the network operator is not the issuing bank (e.g. Visa, Mastercard).
Patio11 is correct in that from a gift card usage perspective, Amex is open loop. But I'm just pointing out that from a network perspective, they are not.
Patio11 is correct in that from a gift card usage perspective, Amex is open loop. But I'm just pointing out that from a network perspective, they are not.
If anyone is looking for a gift card provider to send gift cards via email, try out Tremendous! We use and love them. Nice APIs and super simple to integrate.
I once worked at a small business, single-location franchisee of a niche brand. I got a pretty good look at our balance sheet a few times and damn it sure looked like giftcard holders owned us. I think that line item was like 70% of our liabilities. equity was tiny.
We also sorta ran like shit, which makes sense when you consider those incentives.
We also sorta ran like shit, which makes sense when you consider those incentives.
Gifting is much more than just a monetary value transfer from one person to another (unless you're a soulless tax lawyer) and so many people here are forgetting that.
I see gift cards to be somewhere between a thoughtful physical gift and a bank transfer.
I'd rather give my nephew a $50 gift card to a bookstore than $40 in cash.
I see gift cards to be somewhere between a thoughtful physical gift and a bank transfer.
I'd rather give my nephew a $50 gift card to a bookstore than $40 in cash.
this is pretty much exactly what he says in the article.
Over the years, I have given my parents stocking stuffers and a donation to their favorite charity. They buy what they want and so the small items to open are things they will use/make them smile. And the big gift, the donation, does a whole lot of good and we all are happy.
> A Barnes and Noble gift card to a favorite niece tells that niece that you remember she is a reader
Why not just write a note and give that alongside some cash?
The only time I buy gift cards is if I can get some sort of a discount. There's no other reason for me to buy them.
Why not just write a note and give that alongside some cash?
The only time I buy gift cards is if I can get some sort of a discount. There's no other reason for me to buy them.
Does anyone have an example of what he refers to as an open-loop gift card? Is is the same thing as a prepaid debit card? Are there other types?
Yes a prepaid debit card is a type of open-loop card.
The two main types of open-loop cards in this industry are prepaid gift cards and reloadable prepaid debit cards. You probably see the gift cards all the time if you live in the US, they are often on an endcap near the front of grocery stores and pharmacies. Once the funds have been fully debited from the gift card account the card can't be used again, and these also expire after a few years if they aren't redeemed. Reloadable debit cards are basically a simplified bank account often used by the underbanked or for people who may not want to use a debit card tied to their bank or a credit card for whatever reason.
For the most part folks can use these products to make any purchase that one could make with a normal debit or credit card, but there are some exceptions to that. I think most of the streaming services don't accept them, and probably many other subscription based services that use periodic charges to an account.
The two main types of open-loop cards in this industry are prepaid gift cards and reloadable prepaid debit cards. You probably see the gift cards all the time if you live in the US, they are often on an endcap near the front of grocery stores and pharmacies. Once the funds have been fully debited from the gift card account the card can't be used again, and these also expire after a few years if they aren't redeemed. Reloadable debit cards are basically a simplified bank account often used by the underbanked or for people who may not want to use a debit card tied to their bank or a credit card for whatever reason.
For the most part folks can use these products to make any purchase that one could make with a normal debit or credit card, but there are some exceptions to that. I think most of the streaming services don't accept them, and probably many other subscription based services that use periodic charges to an account.
Would you people gift something like an expensive cruise travel package in a gift card?
I just do it anyway. It's a more universal gift card without fees and expiration dates...
Anyone who tries to put me down for doing so will simply not be receiving a gift from me next year... Screw stressful stores. plastic cards, and standing in line, my method is much more "green"... :P