Bluesky now has 30 million users(bsky.app)
bsky.app
Bluesky now has 30 million users
https://bsky.app/profile/bsky.app/post/3lgu4lg6j2k2v
191 comments
1. The quality of pictures is lower than on Twitter, which I was using mostly for porn
2. Blocking someone prevents that person from even seeing your posts, which means that from the perspective of a lurker, it's best not to follow anyone, not to engage with anyone at all, not to make anyone aware of your existence, because 1% of people you follow will block you just because they're having a bad day
3. The Python client makes baby Jesus cry
2. Blocking someone prevents that person from even seeing your posts, which means that from the perspective of a lurker, it's best not to follow anyone, not to engage with anyone at all, not to make anyone aware of your existence, because 1% of people you follow will block you just because they're having a bad day
3. The Python client makes baby Jesus cry
1. Sorry for you
2. Don’t almost all blocks behave that way? Twitter’s always did. Seems Elon, in his infinite social acuity, has confused “block” with “mute?” Vast majority of users want to be able to actually “block” people
3. Baby Jesus cries very easily, he’s a baby
2. Don’t almost all blocks behave that way? Twitter’s always did. Seems Elon, in his infinite social acuity, has confused “block” with “mute?” Vast majority of users want to be able to actually “block” people
3. Baby Jesus cries very easily, he’s a baby
> Don’t almost all blocks behave that way?
No
> Baby Jesus cries very easily, he’s a baby
I've never seen official baby Jesus merch with him crying
No
> Baby Jesus cries very easily, he’s a baby
I've never seen official baby Jesus merch with him crying
> I've never seen official baby Jesus merch with him crying
You might have been distracted attending more immediate matters, Mr. Anal_Reactor.
You might have been distracted attending more immediate matters, Mr. Anal_Reactor.
> No
That's how Twitter's block always worked before the advent of Naughty Old Mr Car. It's also how the block on every social media thing I can think of works.
That's how Twitter's block always worked before the advent of Naughty Old Mr Car. It's also how the block on every social media thing I can think of works.
And with that, I think the door on Mastodon gaining widespread adoption is closed forever.
We had a very brief window when the Twitter Exodus was happening and non-techies were giving Mastodon a try. But it wasn't good enough, as far as giving the Twitter refugees what they wanted to see, and so they simply moved on to the nearest Twitter-With-The-Numbers-Filed-Off platform and stayed there instead.
There's probably a good post-mortem study someone could do on this (someone more tuned in than me, since I never had a Twitter account to begin with), and the larger ramifications for why many of the FLOSS platforms fail to gain the adoption they think they will when the flagship proprietary platform becomes intolerable. cf: the failure of Windows 11 refugees to move to Linux, Chrome refugees to move to Firefox, etc.
We had a very brief window when the Twitter Exodus was happening and non-techies were giving Mastodon a try. But it wasn't good enough, as far as giving the Twitter refugees what they wanted to see, and so they simply moved on to the nearest Twitter-With-The-Numbers-Filed-Off platform and stayed there instead.
There's probably a good post-mortem study someone could do on this (someone more tuned in than me, since I never had a Twitter account to begin with), and the larger ramifications for why many of the FLOSS platforms fail to gain the adoption they think they will when the flagship proprietary platform becomes intolerable. cf: the failure of Windows 11 refugees to move to Linux, Chrome refugees to move to Firefox, etc.
I tried Mastodon twice, and got banned in both occasions for saying things mildly critical of Israel and Ukraine.
Mastodon's biggest problem is the hyper-aggressive content moderation on the larger instances. Speaking about Mastodon's tech and UI, it's vastly superior to Bluesky. But they drive people away and then complain that people don't come.
Mastodon's biggest problem is the hyper-aggressive content moderation on the larger instances. Speaking about Mastodon's tech and UI, it's vastly superior to Bluesky. But they drive people away and then complain that people don't come.
The fediverse can be quite an echo chamber.
But to be honest the UX of Mastodon is just unusable. Following someone is not a click on Follow button. It's the most basic feature I can think of. And it's complicated there. It just couldn't work. Bluesky just did it better.
I agree that the UX of Mastodon was not the best. I tried several times to use it and it just never "clicked". Bluesky just worked for me, almost without trying.
Maybe my problem with Mastodon was choosing the server to join. My brain knows that it's federated and it really doesn't matter which server you choose. However it always felt like I was choosing the wrong server somehow. Just that little bit of friction was enough to drive me away.
Maybe my problem with Mastodon was choosing the server to join. My brain knows that it's federated and it really doesn't matter which server you choose. However it always felt like I was choosing the wrong server somehow. Just that little bit of friction was enough to drive me away.
Most tech discussion I follow is still on Mastodon. And when Bluesky inevitably goes the way of Twitter due to VC toxicity, Mastodon will still be standing.
> And with that, I think the door on Mastodon gaining widespread adoption is closed forever.
Probably not _forever_; Bluesky is, at least for now, centralised enough that if Bluesky-the-entity screws up sufficiently badly, well, where else are people going to go?
But, honestly, Mastodon as _mainstream_ was always a long-shot. UX matters, and while Mastodon's is _fine_ once you're used to it, it's quite hostile to new users. Bluesky had the advantage that people already knew how to use it, because it's basically the same UX as Twitter.
Probably not _forever_; Bluesky is, at least for now, centralised enough that if Bluesky-the-entity screws up sufficiently badly, well, where else are people going to go?
But, honestly, Mastodon as _mainstream_ was always a long-shot. UX matters, and while Mastodon's is _fine_ once you're used to it, it's quite hostile to new users. Bluesky had the advantage that people already knew how to use it, because it's basically the same UX as Twitter.
You would think people would learn from their mistakes and not move onto another centralized platform backed by VC money, but here we are.
If people cared about decentralization then we would not have seen the consolidation that we've seen. That's true even for technologies who pitch decentralization as a core feature, as we saw with cryptocurrencies -- the original argument was that cryptocurrencies allowed a decentralization of finance, but then we saw a handful of platforms centralize the trades, and most people who bought cryptocurrencies were pleased to have this convenience.
From moxie.org:
"Given the history of why web1 became web2, what seems strange to me about web3 is that technologies like ethereum have been built with many of the same implicit trappings as web1. To make these technologies usable, the space is consolidating around… platforms. Again. People who will run servers for you, and iterate on the new functionality that emerges. Infura, OpenSea, Coinbase, Etherscan."
They also make this point:
"I think this is very similar to the situation with email. I can run my own mail server, but it doesn’t functionally matter for privacy, censorship resistance, or control – because GMail is going to be on the other end of every email that I send or receive anyway."
For a variety of reasons, people have not felt that it is worthwhile to fight for decentralization.
From moxie.org:
"Given the history of why web1 became web2, what seems strange to me about web3 is that technologies like ethereum have been built with many of the same implicit trappings as web1. To make these technologies usable, the space is consolidating around… platforms. Again. People who will run servers for you, and iterate on the new functionality that emerges. Infura, OpenSea, Coinbase, Etherscan."
They also make this point:
"I think this is very similar to the situation with email. I can run my own mail server, but it doesn’t functionally matter for privacy, censorship resistance, or control – because GMail is going to be on the other end of every email that I send or receive anyway."
For a variety of reasons, people have not felt that it is worthwhile to fight for decentralization.
People don’t really care about decentralisation.
Bluesky arrived at the right time, unlike Mastodon.
Bluesky arrived at the right time, unlike Mastodon.
And it didn't involve a really confusing question as a barrier to entry.
Bluesky asks about which server to use on registration like mastodon.social does. For me the difference seems to be better marketing for Bluesky which makes people want to deal with the change and somewhat enjoy it rather than see every obstacle as a pain.
Bluesky does have some advantages like starter packs (and network effect now that it has so many accounts).
Bluesky does have some advantages like starter packs (and network effect now that it has so many accounts).
Mastodon typed in almost any search engine points to mastodon.social; in some cases joinmastodon.org shows up on top which still suggests mastodon.social but has a distinguish "pick another server" button on right side.
Bluesky by default creates account on bsky.social, while there's barely noticeable button with icon that allows you to provide another server.
An ordinary user will head to what it'll find in the search results, fill out credentials and log in. It won't change the defaults if it actually notice there's a possibility to do that at all. Not mention a mass user needs to be aware in the first place that there are other instances/servers, and you can interoperate with these just like with email providers. Neither mastodon or bluesky explains that in a simple discoverable fashion - which IMO should be done long ago.
Bluesky by default creates account on bsky.social, while there's barely noticeable button with icon that allows you to provide another server.
An ordinary user will head to what it'll find in the search results, fill out credentials and log in. It won't change the defaults if it actually notice there's a possibility to do that at all. Not mention a mass user needs to be aware in the first place that there are other instances/servers, and you can interoperate with these just like with email providers. Neither mastodon or bluesky explains that in a simple discoverable fashion - which IMO should be done long ago.
one cool difference between Bluesky and Mastodon (et al) is that server choice on registration is not an immutable permanent decision and you can choose to seamlessly migrate at a later time by updating your DID document
so the slick registration flow nets you less lock-in compared to if e.g. the mainstream Mastodon app were funnelling users onto one megainstance, since you can still get away afterwards without needing people to re-follow you
so the slick registration flow nets you less lock-in compared to if e.g. the mainstream Mastodon app were funnelling users onto one megainstance, since you can still get away afterwards without needing people to re-follow you
Not sure if we're using the same method, but when I go to sign up it asks me for a username, then selects <username>@bsky.social as my full username.
On the previous screen, you can change your account provider
"Bluesky asks about which server to use on registration"
No he doesn't ask, you're wrong.
And there is no single one alternative server where we can register and interact with people on bsky.app
No he doesn't ask, you're wrong.
And there is no single one alternative server where we can register and interact with people on bsky.app
> "Bluesky asks about which server to use on registration"
>
> No he doesn't ask, you're wrong.
It's not very prominent, but the Android mobile app does have the option to change what server you register on.
https://ibb.co/s9pzTt3k
You can tap on the bold "Bluesky Social" text to change it.
> And there is no single one alternative server where we can register and interact with people on bsky.app
You absolutely can host a PDS that interacts flawlessly with the rest of the network. I host my own. There's an entire section in the README about self-hosting: https://github.com/bluesky-social/pds?tab=readme-ov-file#sel...
It's not very prominent, but the Android mobile app does have the option to change what server you register on.
https://ibb.co/s9pzTt3k
You can tap on the bold "Bluesky Social" text to change it.
> And there is no single one alternative server where we can register and interact with people on bsky.app
You absolutely can host a PDS that interacts flawlessly with the rest of the network. I host my own. There's an entire section in the README about self-hosting: https://github.com/bluesky-social/pds?tab=readme-ov-file#sel...
You're right, when I tried again the field was hidden behind a link. Last time I checked (sometime last month) it was a field that defaulted to bsky.social (maybe within the account name?). Or I could be misremembering.
In any case, my previous comment is wrong indeed.
In any case, my previous comment is wrong indeed.
Yeah - technically the same button, but with a slightly more subtle treatment. People were getting confused by it and bouncing. IMO, since it's only really useful if you already know what you're doing and already have a PDS ready to go, there's no harm making the first-time experience smoother.
This is all totally going to change when OAuth rolls out, so hopefully we can find a better compromise then.
This is all totally going to change when OAuth rolls out, so hopefully we can find a better compromise then.
> Bluesky asks about which server to use on registration
No, it does not.
No, it does not.
> Bluesky arrived at the right time, unlike Mastodon.
In fact Mastodon had a better chance than BlueSky ever had, but had a significantly worse onboarding experience.
Mastodon was there at the right time, (Nov 2022) but was extremely unprepared to onboard millions of users simultaneously and more people were left confused on how to use the platform or even how to create an account or "which instance" to sign up to.
This is the obvious reason why BlueSky succeeded and took off, as predicted. [0]
[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35750185
In fact Mastodon had a better chance than BlueSky ever had, but had a significantly worse onboarding experience.
Mastodon was there at the right time, (Nov 2022) but was extremely unprepared to onboard millions of users simultaneously and more people were left confused on how to use the platform or even how to create an account or "which instance" to sign up to.
This is the obvious reason why BlueSky succeeded and took off, as predicted. [0]
[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35750185
Yep, I was at the registration screen multiple times and always left confused. I’m a user now, but it’s quite dead for me while I got featured in a few starter packs a while ago on Bluesky.
Also, onboarding.
Mastodon needs to be more streamlined.
Mastodon needs to be more streamlined.
Helped by Mastodon having truly awful branding
They only care about their filter bubble, and BlueSky provides a guaranteed hermetic experience.
What put me off from mastodon is the fact that you can't migrate your account easily.
Yes, Bluesky is more centralized, but I feel like it is decentralized in the ways that matter for a Twitter/X Alternative use case :
- Self hosting of data, easy migration - Automatic verification via DNS - Custom feeds, Custom moderation, but you can still use the official ones
Yes, Bluesky is more centralized, but I feel like it is decentralized in the ways that matter for a Twitter/X Alternative use case :
- Self hosting of data, easy migration - Automatic verification via DNS - Custom feeds, Custom moderation, but you can still use the official ones
It should be noted that, at least for now, account migration can only go one way. That is, from the main Bluesky PDS to an external one. According to the documentation on account migration[0], they plan to enable incoming migrations at some point in the future, but there's no timeline.
I'm sure a big reason for this the possibility for abuse, since "migrating" an account is a different action than simply "creating" a new one
[0]: https://github.com/bluesky-social/pds/blob/main/ACCOUNT_MIGR...
I'm sure a big reason for this the possibility for abuse, since "migrating" an account is a different action than simply "creating" a new one
[0]: https://github.com/bluesky-social/pds/blob/main/ACCOUNT_MIGR...
Depending on when you tried things might be much better now. Moving accounts can be done in a couple of simple clicks. You might have issues with your history, which stays behind because cool URIs don't change.
Just use all of them, don't hold yourself to one system.
With more places, comes more mental load and time waste. I for one use HN, Mastodon, and a single Discord server with some friends. I don't care about the rest.
We already have a wildly successful open protocol for communication, email. People also want the advantages of centralization.
Have you tried setting up and running an email server the past decade? Email is horribly centralized.
Nostr is the way. It will take time but it's sufficiently decentralized. Doesn't require DNS. Users hold their own keys. Fairly easy to run a relay. It's also a trust network, with encryption out of the box, so I think it will become a usable successor for email+GPG.
Nostr is the way. It will take time but it's sufficiently decentralized. Doesn't require DNS. Users hold their own keys. Fairly easy to run a relay. It's also a trust network, with encryption out of the box, so I think it will become a usable successor for email+GPG.
Yes.
> Email is horribly centralized
You’re seeing the downsides of decentralization not the result of centralization. There’s ~100’s of thousands of independently operated email servers, but nobody is directly forcing people to listen to everyone else. Instead they must stay reasonably open because the cloud didn’t win, work school and emails are still frequently independent.
> Email is horribly centralized
You’re seeing the downsides of decentralization not the result of centralization. There’s ~100’s of thousands of independently operated email servers, but nobody is directly forcing people to listen to everyone else. Instead they must stay reasonably open because the cloud didn’t win, work school and emails are still frequently independent.
> Users hold their own keys.
This is an absolute killer for mainstream adoption. Normal people _absolutely do not want to manage keys_. And will lose them. Like, see Bitcoin; relatively enthusiast user base, and still people lose keys _all the time_.
This is an absolute killer for mainstream adoption. Normal people _absolutely do not want to manage keys_. And will lose them. Like, see Bitcoin; relatively enthusiast user base, and still people lose keys _all the time_.
Username checks out.
You don’t have to run faster than the bear, just faster than the other guy.
This misses the point much like saying people should use Linux because it's open source. Open source is great, but at the end of the day, people will use software that they're both capable of using and that solves their problems. If you don't tick both of those boxes, the rest of it doesn't matter. Social media is the same, owning your data is nice, but if the barrier to both entry and maintenance is too high for a regular user, it's not going to happen.
In theory Bluesky is not centralised. In practice there's only one company operating a relay.
The model of "identity backed by domain ownership" is a nice one, and deals with the Mastodon identity portability issue.
The model of "identity backed by domain ownership" is a nice one, and deals with the Mastodon identity portability issue.
It also tramples on the idea that Resources on the internet have Unique Identifiers that don't change: https://www.w3.org/Provider/Style/URI#:~:text=A%20cool%20URI...
I’m on mastodon but the people I want to follow mostly aren’t :-(
Having looked at a lot of these platforms, only Hive (formerly Steem) operates in a properly decentralized manner.
Have a look at Nostr: https://nostr.com/protocol
Nostr is definitely at effort at decentralization. In practice it doesn't have a way to incentive running a node (relay) so became quite centralized.
Aside from that, it's quite a privacy nightmare (leaks ip everywhere) and became a vehicle to shill Lightning Network tokens.
Lightning uses incentives to keep nodes online, so it wouldn't be too difficult to leverage those incentives for Nostr with Zaps (earning a couple of sats per message for running a node and losing them if it goes offline for instance). However this would require a decentralized consensus system to assess node reputations.
I see no NIP for node incentives, perhaps this should be discussed further.
I see no NIP for node incentives, perhaps this should be discussed further.
The first push was to mastodon and it was a disaster that probably saved X and might have contributed to trump winning all because of decentralized’s inherent bad UX.
[deleted]
Something else is at work. We’re teaching the public on how to move platforms. The general public has a serious problem with tech inertia.
We in tech have not even made a 1-click port everything to somewhere else please button (need to build the somewhere else too).
There’s a lot of work to be done.
We in tech have not even made a 1-click port everything to somewhere else please button (need to build the somewhere else too).
There’s a lot of work to be done.
[deleted]
Twitter/X has shown to be no more than a self-promotion and PR platform as soon as it became popular. Just disposable snippets (pretty much the definition of a 'twit') to drive views. The same will apply to Bluesky. It does not matter whether it is centralized or not, VC money or not, as long as it serves that purpose. In fact a centralized system probably serves this purpose better as it is easier for the users and for content reach.
The fundamental difference is that X is focussed on its "For You" feed while Bluesky focusses on "Following". They are similar tools, but the different approach means one is far closer to "self-promotion and PR" than the other, and I don't think it's inevitable that Bluesky will descend to X's depths.
What's the point of posting on those platforms? Self-promotion and PR. The difference you highlight is very superficial and ultimately it is the same thing.
The difference is your audience. Are you talking to people you know or are you talking to 'the world'. If I'm talking to a bunch of my friends in the pub, I don't consider that "self-promotion". If I'm stood on the street corner saying exactly the same kind of things, it would be. In fact, that means I think that posting a comment on Hacker News is more self-promotion than posting a comment on Bluesky. Which I do.
If you want to talk to people you know you have apps like Whatsapp. Bluesky is to talk to the world one way or another and so is the same as Twitter ultimately even if for the time being you may be able to filter what you see more.
I mean, just now I went to Bluesky's web homepage and what I saw is "discover" pointing me to "influencers"...
I mean, just now I went to Bluesky's web homepage and what I saw is "discover" pointing me to "influencers"...
until it changes that
The fundamental difference is in the public: extreme-left for bluesky, trumpist for truth social and twitter for whoever isn't making a platform choice part of its identity.
I haven't seen anything remotely "extreme-left" on bluesky. I have seen swathes of racist, objectionable, far-right nonsense on X, though.
The extreme left are on small mastodon servers and hate BlueSky and the large mastodon servers almost as much as X at this stage. Given Elon's control of the platform, manipulation of the algorithm and petty bans, it's been a while since X/Twitter has been a neutral choice. What's left of it is certainly at least as right wing as Bluesky is left.
half the comments so far talk about bluesky being similar to x ie private companies.
However AFAIK the use of the "AT protocol" seems to me to be a major difference https://bsky.social/about/faq.
I am really curious to know how I am wrong in that.
As a long time X user and now on bluesky i can tell that there is a huge difference in the content which makes it clear that the platform was pushing accounts with specific political views (or muting others)
However AFAIK the use of the "AT protocol" seems to me to be a major difference https://bsky.social/about/faq.
I am really curious to know how I am wrong in that.
As a long time X user and now on bluesky i can tell that there is a huge difference in the content which makes it clear that the platform was pushing accounts with specific political views (or muting others)
shallow knowledge on my side, but it seems that the AT proto requires some fancy relay node that, as of now, are only hosted by big corps, so no one has a a fully independent bsky instance
This seems to be left out of the conversation when comparing Bluesky with the wider fediverse. The AT protocol relies on a bespoke setup and is complicated to implement. ActivityPub is comparatively simple, and can be implemented on pretty every thing with just a few endpoints.
There is not a bespoke setup that you need to implement atproto. In fact, there are already a variety of applications making use of it (some to a higher degree than others). There are community implementations of app views, relays, PLC directories, and PDSes already in the wild, and - although I admittedly have a biased ear on the conversation - developers tend to appreciate the _lack_ of complication when implementing things.
If ActivityPub is “simple” then that’s a recent’ish development. It used to be a mess.
I would imagine AT gets easier to use/setup given time too.
I would imagine AT gets easier to use/setup given time too.
They said comparatively simple. As in, simple compared to AT
You can do a basic[0] AP server in a single small (64k) PHP file[1].
[0] Single user, admittedly, but if we're talking about protocol simplicity, that's the nub.
[1] https://shkspr.mobi/blog/2024/02/activitypub-server-in-a-sin...
[0] Single user, admittedly, but if we're talking about protocol simplicity, that's the nub.
[1] https://shkspr.mobi/blog/2024/02/activitypub-server-in-a-sin...
you can run a resequencing relay good enough to feed an atproto appview pretty cheaply - it just needs to subscribe to a few thousand websocket endpoints to get a live tail of the whole network (incoming traffic is well under 50Mbps at peak in my experience)
running an archival mirroring relay is storage-intensive (on the order of tens of TB iirc?) but only serves as an optimization (you can backfill full atproto repositories straight from the relay instead of needing to reach out to the relevant data server)
running an archival mirroring relay is storage-intensive (on the order of tens of TB iirc?) but only serves as an optimization (you can backfill full atproto repositories straight from the relay instead of needing to reach out to the relevant data server)
You cannot run a bluesky instance on your own. The AT protocol isn't really a protocol in the same way that matrix or mastodon is. It's just an API, you know like all platforms used to have?
None of that is true
Please point me to instructions on how to make my own bluesky instance that federates with the existing bluesky, and which does not rely on bluesky's authentication.
Just creating a protocol specification does not create a standard. You need politics for that...
Can you prove to us that it is possible to interact with someone on Bluesky without being registered on Bluesky?
Threads use e ActivityPub but we know it's bullshit and that they will shut down the network as soon as possible. Bluesky is the same shit. AT protocol is just a honey pot.
Threads use e ActivityPub but we know it's bullshit and that they will shut down the network as soon as possible. Bluesky is the same shit. AT protocol is just a honey pot.
I did not use Bluesky a lot, and just set it up to try self-hosting.
From what I know :
- Right now you can self-host your PDS (Personal Data Server) that hosts your user account basically, and all of your user content (posts, images, etc...)
- The easiest way to register is to use bluesky's frontend, and specifying your PDS address, I didn't try to self-host it too but I would assume if you self-host the bluesky web app, or just do the api calls to your PDS by hand or in another application, registration would work too.
- From what I understood, when you post, it is completely stored on your PDS, and then there are kinds of "mega nodes", (I think they are called Firehoses ?) That aggregate from a bunch of PDS, (and the official bsky.social PDS) and present it to end users. I don't think you can self-host theses just yet.
So, in the end, I think you can absolutely interact on Bluesky without being registered, by installing your own PDS and only making calls to create an account on it and post on it, without having an account elsewhere. However, the "end user" part is still closed off for now, since the Blue Sky Frontend uses *official* aggregators that could theoretically refuse your posts.
Go here for more information:
https://atproto.com/
https://docs.bsky.app/docs/advanced-guides/atproto
https://docs.bsky.app/docs/advanced-guides/firehose
From what I know :
- Right now you can self-host your PDS (Personal Data Server) that hosts your user account basically, and all of your user content (posts, images, etc...)
- The easiest way to register is to use bluesky's frontend, and specifying your PDS address, I didn't try to self-host it too but I would assume if you self-host the bluesky web app, or just do the api calls to your PDS by hand or in another application, registration would work too.
- From what I understood, when you post, it is completely stored on your PDS, and then there are kinds of "mega nodes", (I think they are called Firehoses ?) That aggregate from a bunch of PDS, (and the official bsky.social PDS) and present it to end users. I don't think you can self-host theses just yet.
So, in the end, I think you can absolutely interact on Bluesky without being registered, by installing your own PDS and only making calls to create an account on it and post on it, without having an account elsewhere. However, the "end user" part is still closed off for now, since the Blue Sky Frontend uses *official* aggregators that could theoretically refuse your posts.
Go here for more information:
https://atproto.com/
https://docs.bsky.app/docs/advanced-guides/atproto
https://docs.bsky.app/docs/advanced-guides/firehose
Won't your content be deprioritized if you do that though? Or won't it be further down the road? I fail to see any reason for Bluesky to be honest once the user base is big enough and people are silo'ed into it.
My account is hosted on my own PDS that I run on my own. My public repo can be viewed here https://pdsls.dev/at/did:plc:oisofpd7lj26yvgiivf3lxsi, and you can see the requests being made directly to that PDS. The account is also viewable of course on the Bluesky app, https://bsky.app/profile/hailey.at.
AT Proto is heavily developed by BS and BS is itself the major consumer of AT Proto.
Has anyone managed to get a "functioning" tech discussion feed on bluesky?
I tried not long ago, mostly help me get acquaintanced with the ruby ecosystem and news, but even using starter packs and the like the best I got was following devs that mostly talked about non tech stuff (personal life, politics and the like).
Particularly annoying was the constant "we hate twitter" posts (I know, I'm here now, so why are we talking about them?). Also tons of anti AI clickbait.
I tried not long ago, mostly help me get acquaintanced with the ruby ecosystem and news, but even using starter packs and the like the best I got was following devs that mostly talked about non tech stuff (personal life, politics and the like).
Particularly annoying was the constant "we hate twitter" posts (I know, I'm here now, so why are we talking about them?). Also tons of anti AI clickbait.
My experience was the same but I wanted to get rust news. In my opinion social networks are failed concept because they want you to have one account for everything. They should encourage people to have multiple accounts for different audience. It is normal to talk about different things with friends, colleagues, family etc.
I follow people mostly from the JS/TS web development community and have a pretty good balance of tech takes and some lighter life updates/humor in between. I mostly the "mutuals" and "popular with friends" tabs to check things out.
Every now and then there's too much US politics, but it's hard to escape nowadays.
Every now and then there's too much US politics, but it's hard to escape nowadays.
>and have a pretty good balance of tech takes and some lighter life updates/humor in between
That's mostly what I want to avoid. Not that I'm not interested in humor, but I don't really care about the personal life of some random developer in the other side of the planet.
I was just trying to get a RSS like, relatively context dense feed to substitute reddit and other similar sites. But I'm not sure it's doable in any current social network.
That's mostly what I want to avoid. Not that I'm not interested in humor, but I don't really care about the personal life of some random developer in the other side of the planet.
I was just trying to get a RSS like, relatively context dense feed to substitute reddit and other similar sites. But I'm not sure it's doable in any current social network.
Not sure when that was, but there's significantly more dev stuff now since around November, e.g. the iOS devs I knew from Twitter showed up there now and are posting regularly (including dev stuff), while before last autumn it was hard to find any of them there.
That's just the state of devs these days.
You mean the social network that keeps showing my wife dick pics even though she turned off adult content? That social network? Pass.
I haven't seen a single nude, dick or otherwise on my Bluesky feed. Perhaps your wife doth protest too much? ;)
It was a few months ago, but when X was banned in my country I tried Bluesky for a while. It took a lot of effort (adding blocklists, muting words and blocking individual accounts) to cleanse the timeline of k-pop and furry content. I am not interested in either type of content and didn't follow any such accounts, but still, the "Discover" feed kept showing that stuff to me. It was the strangest onboarding experience I've ever had in social media.
The number of times I've seen straight up porn and OnlyFans content on Twitter in my feed in the recent months is 100% higher than what I've ever encountered on BS.
The only way that can happen is if she follows people who post dick pics, sou you are the one who sould be concerned here!
I think it might be what she’s searching for or subscribed to? I’ve never seen cocks or genitals on BS but I don’t go looking for them either.
...how? What feed? Is she following people who post dick pics?
Not doubting her experience, but I've never experienced this (accidentally).
Not doubting her experience, but I've never experienced this (accidentally).
Some of the algorithmic feeds on Bluesky feature a non-zero number of dudes holding their dicks (posted without NSFW tagging). "What's Hot Classic" has a serious problem with this. And no, this isn't personalized at all.
https://bsky.app/profile/bsky.app/feed/hot-classic
That feed was defaulted for my account so for the longest time I assumed the community there was largely gay men (along with a surprising percentage of weird furry stuff). And good for them, but it just wasn't my kink to see dudes holding their dicks or sexy animal illustrations in my feed.
The discover feed seems to be absent this problem. But WHC should be either given a warning to user or at a minimum start doing some "guy holding his dick" AI inference and auto-tag those posts.
https://bsky.app/profile/bsky.app/feed/hot-classic
That feed was defaulted for my account so for the longest time I assumed the community there was largely gay men (along with a surprising percentage of weird furry stuff). And good for them, but it just wasn't my kink to see dudes holding their dicks or sexy animal illustrations in my feed.
The discover feed seems to be absent this problem. But WHC should be either given a warning to user or at a minimum start doing some "guy holding his dick" AI inference and auto-tag those posts.
Any kind of third-party what's hot/trending feed seems to. I guess they get a lot of likes in certain circles...
e.g. https://bsky.app/profile/did:plc:dbipwza2663x6hfp2purbn7i/fe...
e.g. https://bsky.app/profile/did:plc:dbipwza2663x6hfp2purbn7i/fe...
That’s strange. AFAIK my wife has never had this experience with her feed. But then again she hasn’t been using it too much lately as she has been too busy going to karate competitions with her instructor, Jacques.
The reason Twitter was successful is they paid celebrities and corporations to join their network. That usage seems to have waned in favor of Instagram, but Twitter is still the #1 place for breaking news, especially in the sports world.
I think many people supporting bluesky assume the value is in attracting the plebeians. I don't see that being the case. There are already Facebook groups and reddit (among traditional forums) if you want to interact with your peers.
Is bluesky an alternative to twitter? In form, yes, in function, no.
I think many people supporting bluesky assume the value is in attracting the plebeians. I don't see that being the case. There are already Facebook groups and reddit (among traditional forums) if you want to interact with your peers.
Is bluesky an alternative to twitter? In form, yes, in function, no.
Not yet, but in the echo chamber I dwell in, a lot of orgs are joining Bluesky, and most actually left X. These are mostly journalists, scientists or people involved in politics.
At some point, it may become impossible for some of these groups - probably starting with journalists - to do their work and not be on bluesky. They will be on X and bluesky. Maybe. If it happens, then bluesky will eventually replace X. Because it will not be long before it will also be possible to leave X, probably the last to do so will also be journalists. Its more efficient that way. Then it will be just nazis and shitposters on X, and X will go the way of Digg and MySpace.
Alternatively, Twitter could also fragment completely and we'll never have an equivalent network again. There's no law stating we must have a single such network where are the celebs, news orgs and scientists hang out.
At some point, it may become impossible for some of these groups - probably starting with journalists - to do their work and not be on bluesky. They will be on X and bluesky. Maybe. If it happens, then bluesky will eventually replace X. Because it will not be long before it will also be possible to leave X, probably the last to do so will also be journalists. Its more efficient that way. Then it will be just nazis and shitposters on X, and X will go the way of Digg and MySpace.
Alternatively, Twitter could also fragment completely and we'll never have an equivalent network again. There's no law stating we must have a single such network where are the celebs, news orgs and scientists hang out.
> The reason Twitter was successful is they paid celebrities and corporations to join their network.
I mean, define 'successful'. Twitter was _culturally important_ for a long time before it was a must-use by celebrities, and it's never been particularly successful in terms of reach (it has a similar MAU to Pinterest, which apparently still exists) or in financial terms.
Like, for a lot of former Twitter users, Bluesky is _already_ successful; it is an adequate replacement for old-Twitter for their needs. That's all that most people are looking for, really.
I mean, define 'successful'. Twitter was _culturally important_ for a long time before it was a must-use by celebrities, and it's never been particularly successful in terms of reach (it has a similar MAU to Pinterest, which apparently still exists) or in financial terms.
Like, for a lot of former Twitter users, Bluesky is _already_ successful; it is an adequate replacement for old-Twitter for their needs. That's all that most people are looking for, really.
Bluesky - the Social Network where everybody posts screenshots of the awful things people post on other social networks!
Can I share my experience?
I registered bluesky account for the second time last Friday and I've pick no interests during first login. Last year I had Discovery feed filled with drawn porn despite of my settings. And now on a fresh account it's mainly American politics - while setting are more liberal regarding adult content. I followed nearly 60 people but only few of them are active. The global stream overall seems to be much "slower" than public federated one on mastodon. My partner complains he gets furry porn in Discovery while having a zero interest in that - he follows only 11 accounts.
I haven't bumped on screenshots from twitter so far.
I registered bluesky account for the second time last Friday and I've pick no interests during first login. Last year I had Discovery feed filled with drawn porn despite of my settings. And now on a fresh account it's mainly American politics - while setting are more liberal regarding adult content. I followed nearly 60 people but only few of them are active. The global stream overall seems to be much "slower" than public federated one on mastodon. My partner complains he gets furry porn in Discovery while having a zero interest in that - he follows only 11 accounts.
I haven't bumped on screenshots from twitter so far.
> My partner complains he gets furry porn in Discovery while having a zero interest in that - he follows only 11 accounts.
AFAIK the 'Discover' algorithm is based largely on _likes_, not who you follow. This can result in extremely weird results for people who never like posts, which I suspect is quite a large part of the user base.
AFAIK the 'Discover' algorithm is based largely on _likes_, not who you follow. This can result in extremely weird results for people who never like posts, which I suspect is quite a large part of the user base.
Then perhaps you’re following the wrong people? I’ve not had that issue.
I haven't seen a single such a screenshot, not one.
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Exactly. I saw way more Elon and Trump posts on Bluesky than I saw on Twitter.
I saw Elon posts on my following feed (whatever X now calls it) even though I wasn't following him. I even got notifications for them! I don't really know how anyone can think that's acceptable.
At least blocking him still works.
(I wish the number of users who blocked an account would show up next to the number of followers)
(I wish the number of users who blocked an account would show up next to the number of followers)
Honest question - is it from a repost from someone you follow?
Nope, straight from him
Is this MAU or total signups?
total: https://bsky.jazco.dev/stats
So not users but accounts.
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The success of Bluesky has been driven, in part, by the sophistication of their system for blocking. I know this is the main thing that draws me in. There are many people who, on a volunteer basis, build block lists that I can subscribe to. I've subscribed to many of these, more than 20, to block Nazis, scammers, MAGA, crypto bots, Russian trolls, fans of Elon Musk, racists, various political causes, and more. I've been planning to start my own list to block libertarians and anarchists. I hear other people complain about the bots on Bluesky, but I've seen very few bots on Bluesky, presumably because I subscribe to so many block lists. And I keep telling people: you can make all of the bots disappear, just subscribe to more block lists. And it's these block lists that have turned Bluesky into the most pleasant social media experience I've ever had.
Well, people want a sealed filter bubble. And BlueSky provides that.
If you post about an opinion against female athletes competing against trans women will that put you on the Nazi list?
Nah, here: https://blueskydirectory.com/lists/a-very-british-bigotry
This one in particular is a blessing; transphobes are a particularly _tedious_ (typically just parroting whatever Rowling or similar said this week) variety of bigot, and even before Musk Twitter was swarming with them.
This one in particular is a blessing; transphobes are a particularly _tedious_ (typically just parroting whatever Rowling or similar said this week) variety of bigot, and even before Musk Twitter was swarming with them.
What's the real business model behind it? Sell "custom" names? That's not going to get you very far.
They want to add some optional subscriptions in near future (a la Discord), and more long term they want to have some way of creators earning money from their followers and Bluesky getting a commission from that.
I wish there wasn't a need for a business-model to begin with for social media. Honestly, being business-driven is what turns them all to shit, as far as I'm concerned.
That being said, the lights need to be kept on somehow... some model similar to what Signal or wikipedia does might be a solution. Content-moderation is probably the big challenge though that they do not have to deal with to the same extent, so not quite sure how that could fly either...
That being said, the lights need to be kept on somehow... some model similar to what Signal or wikipedia does might be a solution. Content-moderation is probably the big challenge though that they do not have to deal with to the same extent, so not quite sure how that could fly either...
Contrary to what we could thought, Bluesky doesn't asks about which server to use on registration.
It's not federate.
It's not federate.
There are thousands of third party PDSes on the network https://github.com/mary-ext/atproto-scraping?tab=readme-ov-f...
To be honest I wrote them off when they missed the first eXodus with their waitlist. I thought it was a Google+ moment. Luckily there were multiple exoduses which gave them second chances.
Monthly active users in a vacuum docent mean anything. Facebook has 3 billion monthly active users but has zero relevance. Bluesky and Threads have no cultural foot print compared to X.
Russian bots are not "cultural foot print"
They are when major news outlets with 100+ years of history write entire articles based on their direction, or even just reference single tweets as justification for an entire opinion article.
Zero relevance to what/who? There are a lot of "older" people on Facebook who are on no other platform. Super useful for targeted advertising. X users are more likely to also use other social media like Instagram and TikTok. This is why companies can afford stop advertising on X without much issue.
Saw a bunch of people in my niche (music) on x.com say a few things about Musk and switch to Bluesky in protest.
They came back within a week after they couldn't build an audience.
They came back within a week after they couldn't build an audience.
No Ads.
100% user-centric moderation controls. Blockity block! Block lists are a godsend. This is what made Dorsey quit the board and abandon the platform. He actually believed the masses wanted a libertarian platform that forced you to listen to assholes. We don’t.
No opaque algorithms controlling your timeline.
Feeds to create topic centric timelines.
Decentralized. You can host your own data. Other hosts can offer refuge if Bluesky went rogue. Bluesky doesn’t own the data.
Many independent journalists have moved over so we’re getting significantly better news and not the false equivalence nonsense peddled by most of the major media outlets.
And kittens, birds, dogs, deer, raccoons, and other heartwarming animal posts.
100% user-centric moderation controls. Blockity block! Block lists are a godsend. This is what made Dorsey quit the board and abandon the platform. He actually believed the masses wanted a libertarian platform that forced you to listen to assholes. We don’t.
No opaque algorithms controlling your timeline.
Feeds to create topic centric timelines.
Decentralized. You can host your own data. Other hosts can offer refuge if Bluesky went rogue. Bluesky doesn’t own the data.
Many independent journalists have moved over so we’re getting significantly better news and not the false equivalence nonsense peddled by most of the major media outlets.
And kittens, birds, dogs, deer, raccoons, and other heartwarming animal posts.
The other key feature there has been proactive platform moderation -- truly bad actors have been banned early & you can block a whole list of bad-faith accounts at once.
AT proto seems like it would be perfect for a wikipedia-style fact check organization.
AT proto seems like it would be perfect for a wikipedia-style fact check organization.
But who will believe a group that can’t take the heat?
Muting is fine, blocking is censorship.
You'll know it is decentralized when someone can run an instance and remove the blocking and censorship. (Never, I predict)
You already could have a client that treats a block as a mute. Easier to just open an incognito tab though.
> In theory, a bad actor could create their own rogue client or interface which ignores some of the blocking behaviors, since the content is posted to a public network. But showing content or notifications to the person who created the block won’t be possible, as that behavior is controlled by their own PDS and client.
https://docs.bsky.app/blog/block-implementation
> In theory, a bad actor could create their own rogue client or interface which ignores some of the blocking behaviors, since the content is posted to a public network. But showing content or notifications to the person who created the block won’t be possible, as that behavior is controlled by their own PDS and client.
https://docs.bsky.app/blog/block-implementation
From that document -
>creation of reply posts, quote posts, embeds, and mentions are blocked;
This is the unmitigable censorship that can't be removed without decentralization.
>creation of reply posts, quote posts, embeds, and mentions are blocked;
This is the unmitigable censorship that can't be removed without decentralization.
I’d argue this one feature is the core reason Bluesky has 30 million users.
There is no doubt censorship is popular. It's not for me though.
The users are doing the blocking, not Bluesky.
We’re just slamming the door in the face of Nazis and fascists.
It’s my individual right to avoid assholes.
Not censorship.
We’re just slamming the door in the face of Nazis and fascists.
It’s my individual right to avoid assholes.
Not censorship.
That's what your mute is for. 100% support that.
Bluesky preventing users from replying to your posts on your say-so. Yup, there's a word for that.
Bluesky preventing users from replying to your posts on your say-so. Yup, there's a word for that.
Yeah, it’s called harassment.
recently I have deleted my account. format is not for me, too much fuss in my honest opinion
Yet another shitshow-in-waiting. I know Mastodon isn’t as polished but leaving one frying pan to get into another is a lost opportunity. I failed to convince somebody to move to Mastodon recently.
In my experience there's a huge barrier to entry for Mastodon. I've tried finding a server that worthwhile signing up to on 3 past occasions, every time I found one that seemed like a good fit they weren't accepting signups.
Bluesky I got in before it was opened up by adding my email to the waitlist. Simple. And now it's even easier because there is no waitlist.
Bluesky I got in before it was opened up by adding my email to the waitlist. Simple. And now it's even easier because there is no waitlist.
Did you use this: https://joinmastodon.org/servers ?
I used it and found a decent one, managed by someone relatively local and active. Most of my followed accounts are on other servers but I haven't seen that as a big issue.
I used it and found a decent one, managed by someone relatively local and active. Most of my followed accounts are on other servers but I haven't seen that as a big issue.
I agree that there's a barrier, but it's not huge. Mastodon really could use some people versed in marketing and onboarding. People use email without realizing that it's decentralized, I tried to draw parallels between that and Mastodon to my friend, but I failed.
I'm honestly not much of a social network user, but I signed up with universeodon and it seems to work fine as a mastodon server. Most of the people I follow are on different servers anyway, so I didn't worry so much about finding a server that was a "good fit" for me.
I can't explain it fully but mastodon seems more confusing than bluesky, maybe too much emphasis on "you can have any server" which then creates more questions than it's necessary. It has also more features and terms.. while bluesky seems more efficient at getting you living in good old twitter like world which is people (at least I) missed ?
In France there has been a clear (and coordinated) exodus of people from the left from X to Bluesky. They also actively try to ban anyone from the right who post there.
It makes for a bland circle jerk to be honest but they kind of succeeded at making also X worse as there's less balance to those racist tweets etc.
It makes for a bland circle jerk to be honest but they kind of succeeded at making also X worse as there's less balance to those racist tweets etc.
Bluesky is less attractive right now to Canadians who are participating in the boycott of US products. So Mastodon seems a better fit. There is even a collector page for Canadian Mastodon servers:
* https://mastodonserver.ca/
* https://mastodonserver.ca/
In a few months Bluesky will have more users than Canada has people.
If you want to boycott the US, I would say it's better to use Bluesky and make it a strong and viable competitor to X.
So instead of paying Bluesky nothing to commiserate with millions of Americans who hate Trump and the tariffs too, you intend to isolate?
Isolation is indeed the vibe on mastodon. And they get upset when they realize that all their posts are publically boradcast over an open websocket api.
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> Bluesky is less attractive right now to Canadians who are participating in the boycott of US products.
How many people are boycotting these US products which specifically includes not using iPhones, Macs, Android and Windows devices?
Out of that, how many are going to bother to choose to sign up to a Mastodon instance that is only hosted in Canada and use it for more than a year? My guess is a very small number of people.
Realistically they don't care and the boycott won't last and the majority are still more likely to sign up to either Threads or BlueSky than to even consider Mastodon.
How many people are boycotting these US products which specifically includes not using iPhones, Macs, Android and Windows devices?
Out of that, how many are going to bother to choose to sign up to a Mastodon instance that is only hosted in Canada and use it for more than a year? My guess is a very small number of people.
Realistically they don't care and the boycott won't last and the majority are still more likely to sign up to either Threads or BlueSky than to even consider Mastodon.
Boycotts can take on different levels. I'd personally say that if you already own an iPhone, Android phone, Mac or PC, you've already given them your money, but you can absolutely refuse to give more the next time around and buy something from another manufacturer that's not US based. But it doesn't make sense to just throw out your perfectly fine $1000+ device just to "stick it to the man."
Your comment appears to say "if you're not guaranteed a perfect, immediate, and lasting victory, then just don't bother."
This just reads as divisive, dismissive, or destructive.
Please note I'm not saying that you are those things, just that your comment reads like that.
This just reads as divisive, dismissive, or destructive.
Please note I'm not saying that you are those things, just that your comment reads like that.
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X's MAU has reached about 570 million. I just hope it doesn't collapse under its own weight before getting there. Do they have any secret strategies to sustain it?
Can we make a meaningful comparison between the two, given that they're both private companies that could just be saying whatever they want people to hear? I mean, I have no doubt that Twitter is an order of magnitude greater in popularity, but there are so many factors at play here, especially given the number of bots and duplicate accounts in existence.
It's X, not Twitter. The good old Twitter has flown away into the blue sky.
Bots and duplicate accounts are certainly an issue, but that's also a concern for the platform operators who want to maximize advertising effectiveness. Fake numbers will never translate into real results.
Bots and duplicate accounts are certainly an issue, but that's also a concern for the platform operators who want to maximize advertising effectiveness. Fake numbers will never translate into real results.
Is Bluesky considered better than X?
Would it, for example, purport to keep us and our feelings safe by censoring those questioning an unproven and ultimately claim made by pharmaceutical corporations and politicians they donate money to, about the efficacy of their products?
Would it, for example, purport to keep us and our feelings safe by censoring those questioning an unproven and ultimately claim made by pharmaceutical corporations and politicians they donate money to, about the efficacy of their products?
The XBlock Screenshot Labeler moderation service has mostly kept the reposted screenshots to a minimum. When reporting a post you can choose which service to inform, so a screenshot would get reported to XBlock rather than the bsky.app mod team. https://bsky.app/profile/xblock.aendra.dev
I assume that more moderation services will get plugged in as the site grows. It's an interesting model/protocol/service.