A difficult experience with Autopilot in the mountains of Canada(driverlessratings.com)
driverlessratings.com
A difficult experience with Autopilot in the mountains of Canada
https://driverlessratings.com/news/trouble-with-autopilot-in-canada
47 comments
Note, this was not some winding two-lane so typical of BC interior (Though this is getting better). This is a good road that was recently upgraded for the 2010 Olympics.
One again though, people are forgetting that "Autopilot" is just a marketing name for adavanced lane assist and adaptive cruise control (albeit of a relatively sophisticated variety). Expecting it to be able to cope with anything outside routine road conditions is a fools errand.
And they will never believe you. Elon musk said he'll run a coast to coast self driving car this year and also unveil Tesla network, the self driving Uber competitor.
> people are forgetting that "Autopilot" is just a marketing name for adavanced lane assist and adaptive cruise control
That, though, is due to intentionally deceitful branding.
That, though, is due to intentionally deceitful branding.
Tesla autopilot is not that different from its namesake in airplanes. Autopilot does not fly the plane from JFK to LAX, it only maintains speed, altitude and heading. If anything unusual happens, autopilot disengages and drops controls back to the pilot.
So Tesla is not deceiving anyone.
So Tesla is not deceiving anyone.
> Tesla autopilot is not that different from its namesake in airplanes.
Which is not at all how popular culture shows it, and thus not what people assume when they hear "autopilot".
> Autopilot does not fly the plane from JFK to LAX, it only maintains speed, altitude and heading.
There are autopilots which can do everything but taxiing and takeoff[0].
> So Tesla is not deceiving anyone.
Tesla is not deceiving actual pilots of airplanes large enough to have an autopilot old enough to only support stable flight maintenance. I'm sure that's great for all 10 of them.
Meanwhile, in the actual world there have been examples too numerous to count of people who pretty much expect the car to drive itself. Which I expect is exactly what the people who picked the term wanted: make it seem magic for the sales, but be technically correct enough that it covers your ass (and you can blame the driver) when it invariably fucks up.
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autoland
Which is not at all how popular culture shows it, and thus not what people assume when they hear "autopilot".
> Autopilot does not fly the plane from JFK to LAX, it only maintains speed, altitude and heading.
There are autopilots which can do everything but taxiing and takeoff[0].
> So Tesla is not deceiving anyone.
Tesla is not deceiving actual pilots of airplanes large enough to have an autopilot old enough to only support stable flight maintenance. I'm sure that's great for all 10 of them.
Meanwhile, in the actual world there have been examples too numerous to count of people who pretty much expect the car to drive itself. Which I expect is exactly what the people who picked the term wanted: make it seem magic for the sales, but be technically correct enough that it covers your ass (and you can blame the driver) when it invariably fucks up.
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autoland
So Tesla is not deceiving anyone.
Pilots must be trained to the capabilities and limits of autopilot in airplains before they can use it. They wouldn't be confused to the capability of flight instruments by their branding.
The regular person not only thinks autopilot is a magic make-the-plane-go computer, they also think the Tesla Autopilot is different in class than the same featureset with a boring moniker.
Pilots must be trained to the capabilities and limits of autopilot in airplains before they can use it. They wouldn't be confused to the capability of flight instruments by their branding.
The regular person not only thinks autopilot is a magic make-the-plane-go computer, they also think the Tesla Autopilot is different in class than the same featureset with a boring moniker.
From Tesla's own website:
Enhanced Autopilot
Enhanced Autopilot adds these new capabilities to the Tesla Autopilot driving experience. Your Tesla will match speed to traffic conditions, keep within a lane, automatically change lanes without requiring driver input, transition from one freeway to another, exit the freeway when your destination is near, self-park when near a parking spot and be summoned to and from your garage.
Tesla’s Enhanced Autopilot software has begun rolling out and features will continue to be introduced as validation is completed, subject to regulatory approval.
"Hey if you read the fine print and ignore all of the popular culture associated with the term it does exactly what you're sold on".
> To me, that says cruise control++
Here's an idea: call it "cruise control++", or call it "drive assistance", or call it anything which clearly spells out that it doesn't drive on its own.
AKA more or less every other car brand does.
> To me, that says cruise control++
Here's an idea: call it "cruise control++", or call it "drive assistance", or call it anything which clearly spells out that it doesn't drive on its own.
AKA more or less every other car brand does.
Here's what it looked like just 44 years before the olympics:
https://www.tranbc.ca/2015/09/10/bc-road-trip-time-machine-h...
https://www.tranbc.ca/2015/09/10/bc-road-trip-time-machine-h...
And here's what it looked like just 2 years before the olympics:
http://bc.ctvnews.ca/amazing-no-one-hurt-during-b-c-rock-sli...
(I was in Whistler at the time that rockslide happened.)
(I was in Whistler at the time that rockslide happened.)
Came here to say the same. I've been waiting to see some mention of the use of autonomy throughout the coastal or rocky mountains. This road can be deceptively tricky, but relatively easygoing. I'd like to see a test of it from Salmon Arm to Banff or from Hope to Penticton.
I'd also add that these roads are scary in the best conditions.
I'd also add that these roads are scary in the best conditions.
For those who are unaware, it's called the Sea-to-sky highway [1].
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Columbia_Highway_99
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Columbia_Highway_99
I just wanted to add that having taken it multiple times with an experienced driver I've still felt scared af. It's very winding.
How badly do you get motion sickness when using autopilot?
I find (like most people), that I don't get carsick when driving a car myself, but tend to get it as a passenger. With autopilot you're not really driving, but if you have your hands on the wheel, you sort of are driving.
I find (like most people), that I don't get carsick when driving a car myself, but tend to get it as a passenger. With autopilot you're not really driving, but if you have your hands on the wheel, you sort of are driving.
...motion sickness is not always what it seems, how do you not know that you have low level carbon monoxide poisoning from breathing in car fumes?
As a driver you may be that bit more alert with a road to concentrate on, as a passenger you might just be not able to fence off the symptoms - feeling sick, failing vision etc.
The reason I say this is that a Tesla has the best air-con, the auto-pilot and no emissions, so 'sickness' could be nothing to do with 'motion sickness'.
As a driver you may be that bit more alert with a road to concentrate on, as a passenger you might just be not able to fence off the symptoms - feeling sick, failing vision etc.
The reason I say this is that a Tesla has the best air-con, the auto-pilot and no emissions, so 'sickness' could be nothing to do with 'motion sickness'.
Because even if I wind the windows right down to try and get some fresh air, I still feel like shit.
Unless your exhaust feeds directly into your car or are driving inside, it's unlikely that you can get low level carbon monoxide poisoning in a modern car.
It's not merely unlikely it's completely nonsensical. You don't get motion sickness in nose-to-tail traffic jams where gas poisoning could actually be an issue. Furthermore the average passenger car produces 20 times more CO2 (by weight) than CO (the ratio is even more skewed for diesel cars).
What’s interesting is there is a local company that sells a package where you pay a fee to drive super cars on this road. That includes a Model S and they get you to enable auto pilot to experience it.
My buddy tried it and said it worked just fine - on the winding road before you get to Squamish.
I guess my anecdote is just as invalid/valid as the author’s.
My buddy tried it and said it worked just fine - on the winding road before you get to Squamish.
I guess my anecdote is just as invalid/valid as the author’s.
So it turns out that autopilot's capabilities are quite similar to drivers from Alberta :)
Autopilot, like most software during development, is not ready for real use.
I can't wait for autopilot in mainstream vehicles but I'm not sure if I'd want to discover an "edge case" (pun intended) on a narrow mountain pass with no guardrails.
This isn't that terrifying guardrail-free road, though -- I drive this in a Model S ~15-20 times in each direction every winter on my way between Seattle and Whistler.
Autopilot is fantastic for that trip between UW and turning onto CA1 where BC99 intersects it. From there up to Lions Bay and from the far side of Lions Bay[0] to Squamish I keep the car in self drive after a few too many attempted suicides by Eddie[1]. It's not that there aren't guard rails, it's just that it really winds about as it hugs the cliff face. For most of that trip Autopilot generally doesn't want to engage -- it knows better when it can't predict the lane boundary far enough into the future. Past Squamish it really depends on conditions. My trip up this Saturday morning was downright boring and autopilot handled the whole thing. On other trips at night the road has essentially been one solid white surface where even humans avoid each other by treating it as one very wide lane in each direction and maintaining lots of clearance.
[0]: Lions Bay has a 60kph speed limit; autopilot can generally handle it fine, regardless of conditions, although the wide variance in prevailing traffic speed makes this among the most dangerous parts of the trip. I often wonder how the accident and injury statistics for Lions Bay compare to the rest of Sea to Sky.
[1]: My Tesla is named Edison's Lament. Yes, you name your car. Yes, I enjoy this feature.
Autopilot is fantastic for that trip between UW and turning onto CA1 where BC99 intersects it. From there up to Lions Bay and from the far side of Lions Bay[0] to Squamish I keep the car in self drive after a few too many attempted suicides by Eddie[1]. It's not that there aren't guard rails, it's just that it really winds about as it hugs the cliff face. For most of that trip Autopilot generally doesn't want to engage -- it knows better when it can't predict the lane boundary far enough into the future. Past Squamish it really depends on conditions. My trip up this Saturday morning was downright boring and autopilot handled the whole thing. On other trips at night the road has essentially been one solid white surface where even humans avoid each other by treating it as one very wide lane in each direction and maintaining lots of clearance.
[0]: Lions Bay has a 60kph speed limit; autopilot can generally handle it fine, regardless of conditions, although the wide variance in prevailing traffic speed makes this among the most dangerous parts of the trip. I often wonder how the accident and injury statistics for Lions Bay compare to the rest of Sea to Sky.
[1]: My Tesla is named Edison's Lament. Yes, you name your car. Yes, I enjoy this feature.
Nor do most people want to deal with "edge case" bugs in any software. Fortunately there has always been an endless supply of people who love trying out new cutting-edge technology who are willing to take this risk... even when it means driverless cars on potentially dangerous roads.
And all to often people get shanghaied into being guinea pigs by some "push to prod" dev...
> I can't wait for autopilot in mainstream vehicles
This is here already. E.g. pretty much every VW can be ordered with it.
This is here already. E.g. pretty much every VW can be ordered with it.
I drive a Passat GTE with lane assist and adaptive cruise control, but if you let go of the wheel for more than a few seconds it starts nagging you to take control of the vehicle again.
Yeah, probably the same thing as in Skoda vehicles - it's a dumb lane assist tool, it's just a single camera that is watching the line markings on the road. This is only good for highways where it helps you to steer the wheel and you can relax a little more (hands on the wheel). This is far from any autopilot. It would drive you off the road in case of a wrongly painted line :-).
Teslas will happily drive you if the road in that case as well.
I am not sure I would want to discover an edge case anywhere.
Who's "Nicholas Cronin", the guy behind this web site?
I'm Nick. Nice to connect. Just a guy interested in the transition from manual vehicles to autonomous ones.
The idea behind this site is great. Will you have a reference section to discover car models and their SAE autonomy level? Manufacturers make this hard to compare today with their marketing terms, and I see this becoming a key differentiator for tech-savvy buyers.
Thanks for the feedback! We will be breaking it down by OEM and model to add to the usefulness. I think we will leave the classifying of the SAE autonomy level to the OEM though. But by sharing real world experiences, buyers will have something else to make a decision on other than the marketing terms like you mentioned. Thanks again for taking a look!
Sounds like a special remote video collab for YouTuber Bjørn in Norway to don racecar protective gear and try to break an X using Autopilot.
In the Tesla's defence, I am from the prairie provinces and find the Vancouver -> Whistler road a little too much to handle....:)
Lol. That is the famous "sea to sky" highway. You should have seen it before the 2010 olympic upgrades. It is a runway compared to what it once was. It isnt really a mountain highway but a coastal route. It follows a train track most of the way. You all know it. Something like half of north america's car commercials are filmed in vancouver, and many of those use the s2s.
I used to ride it several times a week on my vfr. The real rollercoaster starts north of whistler: the dirty dusty duffy lake road.
I used to ride it several times a week on my vfr. The real rollercoaster starts north of whistler: the dirty dusty duffy lake road.
> I used to ride it several times a week on my vfr. The real rollercoaster starts north of whistler: the dirty dusty duffy lake road.
Small world! I've ridden that very same road on my VFR several times: http://www.jbarham.com/photo/lillooet (although last time I did that was probably 2004)
Small world! I've ridden that very same road on my VFR several times: http://www.jbarham.com/photo/lillooet (although last time I did that was probably 2004)
I love it in the dark at 2am with bears running across the road, love those single lane bridges also. Wonder how automation deals with single lane bridges.
On the duffy, but there are no one-lane bridges on the s2s.
Either filmed there or between Malibu and Oxnard in SoCal.