I quit caffeine(keygen.sh)
keygen.sh
I quit caffeine
https://keygen.sh/blog/i-quit/
305 comments
I have a similar habit getting similar flak, but with another added reason. As a remote worker, going to a place every day (often leading to small interactions with others) helps replace replace some elements of working from an office (commute, small chats with other frequenters, the getting presentable ritual you mentioned, etc).
I'll append a gripe to this and say that employers should allow "work-from-home budgets" to be put towards credit at local coffee shops.
Pre-COVID this was my exact approach. I felt like there was a certain sense of randomness and adventure that was inspiring towards whatever I was working on.
I've heard nicotine addiction described the same way by more than one person.
It's not about the cigarettes, it's about the smoke break, which gets you away from your desk, outdoors, and socializing with strangers.
It's not about the cigarettes, it's about the smoke break, which gets you away from your desk, outdoors, and socializing with strangers.
Adding one more data point for your anecdote. These are the exact reasons I started smoking, and the same excuses I use to continue (along with the newfound addiction of course). It weighs heavily into my cost/benefit analysis for smoking despite all known and experienced bad things about it.
I never liked the socializing part, it was more some kind of FOMO with the smokers. The other ones stand. But the way it should be is that everyone gets a break, and that you can do smoking during the break or something else. Something like smoking a cigarette was something to hold in my hands and something to do when nervous. I know a better way to get some exercise: do a warming up, put on a podcast or music, and go run (cardio). You do two in one, and you don't have to go to a coffee shop (I find the idea of a coffee shop ridiculous, like a pub, because these goods are perfectly affordable and reachable at home but then again I'm not into the socializing aspect).
Wait you have to presentable to get coffee from a coffee shop? I've made a terrible mistake
It is solely up to you. At least you want to jump into some clothes and not go there in your PJs but that depends on you as well.
I used to drink a lot of the crappy stuff as well but as soon as you know the taste of real coffee (be it an excellent 3-minute 1:15 V60 single origin or a double shot espresso fresh from the machine from a local specialty roasting place) it just doesn't go down anymore.
While it wasn't really much of a caffeine thing for me, I did simply like the taste and the fact that it's warm, but once you see it for the watery slurry from a marginal blend of "we found some beans on a boat" factory that it is, your taste in coffee gets upgraded and as a result you end up drinking less because the good stuff is not always within reach.
Most people I meet at high quality espresso places have had a similar journey, generally from the crappy supermarket pre-ground stuff, to paper coffee pads to metal coffee pods to actual coffee at which point even the memory of an amazing Costa Rica natural at 93°C from a week ago is better than whatever an automatic machine can give you.
For me, the caffeine doesn't do the whole 'boost' thing, doesn't impede sleep either. Coffee does make me dry out faster and that's something other people tend to forget, mistaking a headache for coffee-related instead of dehydration. But I can often taste the difference in decaf processed coffee and I general it does a disservice to the bean.
On top of everything else, you don't really need a lot of coffee, and if large volumes of warm liquid is a joy in itself, we have things like infusions (ginger, mint, fruits, but also Rooibos) that doesn't really "do" anything but definitely make for a tasty hydrating drink.
Right now I just manually grind my coffee at home (weighing it of course and making sure the grind size is correct - coffee snobbery makes it more work to get a cup you like), and pour a V60 or make an aeropress.
Whenever I do want an espresso I'll go outside and visit my favourite espresso bar that can pull shots I'll never be able to make myself (unless I become a full-time barista I suppose).
While it wasn't really much of a caffeine thing for me, I did simply like the taste and the fact that it's warm, but once you see it for the watery slurry from a marginal blend of "we found some beans on a boat" factory that it is, your taste in coffee gets upgraded and as a result you end up drinking less because the good stuff is not always within reach.
Most people I meet at high quality espresso places have had a similar journey, generally from the crappy supermarket pre-ground stuff, to paper coffee pads to metal coffee pods to actual coffee at which point even the memory of an amazing Costa Rica natural at 93°C from a week ago is better than whatever an automatic machine can give you.
For me, the caffeine doesn't do the whole 'boost' thing, doesn't impede sleep either. Coffee does make me dry out faster and that's something other people tend to forget, mistaking a headache for coffee-related instead of dehydration. But I can often taste the difference in decaf processed coffee and I general it does a disservice to the bean.
On top of everything else, you don't really need a lot of coffee, and if large volumes of warm liquid is a joy in itself, we have things like infusions (ginger, mint, fruits, but also Rooibos) that doesn't really "do" anything but definitely make for a tasty hydrating drink.
Right now I just manually grind my coffee at home (weighing it of course and making sure the grind size is correct - coffee snobbery makes it more work to get a cup you like), and pour a V60 or make an aeropress.
Whenever I do want an espresso I'll go outside and visit my favourite espresso bar that can pull shots I'll never be able to make myself (unless I become a full-time barista I suppose).
Coffee snobs are leagues ahead in terms of snobbery of any other snobbery I know. And I am from a wine heavy culture, so born and raised in snobbery.
And your comment highlights everything that can be irritating about coffee enthusiasts. Every paragraph is quote-worthy. Almost climactic.
I don't know what has triggered such an elite-like culture in coffee but it never ceases to amaze/amuse.
And your comment highlights everything that can be irritating about coffee enthusiasts. Every paragraph is quote-worthy. Almost climactic.
I don't know what has triggered such an elite-like culture in coffee but it never ceases to amaze/amuse.
It's pure boredom.
Compare it to BBQ culture. In simpler times, one would have a cheap metal grill and throw some raw meat on it. By the time it almost turns black, you'd eat it.
Now people have a design baking skirt, a machine that can grill 50 things at once, temperature management, a slow cook schedule lasting days, hipster recipes for the sauce, and this doesn't even begin to describe what is now a "science".
Back to coffee, the standard stuff is fine. Most machines at work now grind beans at the spot and mixes it under high pressure. It's much better compared to the work coffee from decades ago where you could see the bottom of the cup.
The only meaningful difference with high-end coffee is that those have a softer, smoother taste. Less bitter. That's it. Yet you'd only notice if you pay attention, drink your coffee strong, with no milk, and very little or no sugar.
To mess with me, my g/f regularly switches beans in our machine at home, and won't tell me that she did. Unknowingly, I was exposed to many types of beans. I did not notice any change whatsoever.
Why not? Because I don't pay attention to coffee when I drink it. I don't analyze it, I just drink it.
One time she did directly ask: how's the coffee? I asked why...did you change it? Yes. As I had already drank it and didn't notice a difference, I made up a reply: does seem to taste a little bit better.
"Well, they're the cheap ones".
Ok then. Feeling like an idiot, I then started to pay attention and actually analyze the taste, which is something a normal person doesn't do. I can now tell the beans apart consistently, without prior knowledge. But only by actively focusing on it.
The only detectable change is softness. The problem is, now you're aware of it, and internally associate it as superior. And this is how new coffee snobs are born.
Compare it to BBQ culture. In simpler times, one would have a cheap metal grill and throw some raw meat on it. By the time it almost turns black, you'd eat it.
Now people have a design baking skirt, a machine that can grill 50 things at once, temperature management, a slow cook schedule lasting days, hipster recipes for the sauce, and this doesn't even begin to describe what is now a "science".
Back to coffee, the standard stuff is fine. Most machines at work now grind beans at the spot and mixes it under high pressure. It's much better compared to the work coffee from decades ago where you could see the bottom of the cup.
The only meaningful difference with high-end coffee is that those have a softer, smoother taste. Less bitter. That's it. Yet you'd only notice if you pay attention, drink your coffee strong, with no milk, and very little or no sugar.
To mess with me, my g/f regularly switches beans in our machine at home, and won't tell me that she did. Unknowingly, I was exposed to many types of beans. I did not notice any change whatsoever.
Why not? Because I don't pay attention to coffee when I drink it. I don't analyze it, I just drink it.
One time she did directly ask: how's the coffee? I asked why...did you change it? Yes. As I had already drank it and didn't notice a difference, I made up a reply: does seem to taste a little bit better.
"Well, they're the cheap ones".
Ok then. Feeling like an idiot, I then started to pay attention and actually analyze the taste, which is something a normal person doesn't do. I can now tell the beans apart consistently, without prior knowledge. But only by actively focusing on it.
The only detectable change is softness. The problem is, now you're aware of it, and internally associate it as superior. And this is how new coffee snobs are born.
>The only meaningful difference with high-end coffee is that those have a softer, smoother taste. Less bitter. That's it.
respectfully disagree, and i'm not even a coffee snob -- just a life long addict who doesn't analyze, just drinks.
Wine tastes like shit to me, but i'd never be so sure that my interpretation of it was correct that i'd try to explain why wine snobs exist. I understand there all wines have nuances that I may miss as someone who is inexperienced with wine and without a preference towards it.
Coffee , more so than most other plant products, has a wide variety of tastes. How could it not? It's a plant grown in varied areas with varied problems, varied soils, and then roasted or treated in varied manners.
We disagree, I understand I won't convince here, but I can confess my own experience : coffee is a spectrum of flavors , and not everyone has the tongue (or time) to notice -- but to dismiss it as 'pure boredom' is something I absolutely disagree with.
You don't need a 12kUSD espresso rig to notice that there are more than two taste profiles in the world of coffee.
respectfully disagree, and i'm not even a coffee snob -- just a life long addict who doesn't analyze, just drinks.
Wine tastes like shit to me, but i'd never be so sure that my interpretation of it was correct that i'd try to explain why wine snobs exist. I understand there all wines have nuances that I may miss as someone who is inexperienced with wine and without a preference towards it.
Coffee , more so than most other plant products, has a wide variety of tastes. How could it not? It's a plant grown in varied areas with varied problems, varied soils, and then roasted or treated in varied manners.
We disagree, I understand I won't convince here, but I can confess my own experience : coffee is a spectrum of flavors , and not everyone has the tongue (or time) to notice -- but to dismiss it as 'pure boredom' is something I absolutely disagree with.
You don't need a 12kUSD espresso rig to notice that there are more than two taste profiles in the world of coffee.
No. there's only two coffee tastes: hard and soft.
Relax, I was intentionally simplifying. I am fine with people deeply exploring every nuance of every coffee, the only real challenge and pushback I have is that much of it is learned.
People think coffee at work (or any other "regular" coffee) is bad because somebody else said it. Not because they discovered this on their own. Likewise, discovering "better" coffee is not having superior taste buds, this too is largely acquired knowledge and taste.
I'd take this even further to say that the entire categories of coffee, wine, and beer are learned. If you'd take anybody from an uncontacted tribe and let them drink any of it, they'll think you're trying to poison them. It's not natural to our taste buds, and instinctively rejected. You actively need to be told and learned that all this stuff is actually very good, you just don't understand it yet.
If it's learned, it's malleable.
Relax, I was intentionally simplifying. I am fine with people deeply exploring every nuance of every coffee, the only real challenge and pushback I have is that much of it is learned.
People think coffee at work (or any other "regular" coffee) is bad because somebody else said it. Not because they discovered this on their own. Likewise, discovering "better" coffee is not having superior taste buds, this too is largely acquired knowledge and taste.
I'd take this even further to say that the entire categories of coffee, wine, and beer are learned. If you'd take anybody from an uncontacted tribe and let them drink any of it, they'll think you're trying to poison them. It's not natural to our taste buds, and instinctively rejected. You actively need to be told and learned that all this stuff is actually very good, you just don't understand it yet.
If it's learned, it's malleable.
I don't agree with this; I don't consider myself of a coffee snob, but I do generally buy what I think are 'high end' coffees, because I buy fair trade coffee and that's basically what you get.
There is so much variety between types of coffees, and even preparation methods (we mainly use french press and aeropress, but the grind size, brew time, water temperature, and of course the amount of grind, all make enough of a difference that the same beans can give different flavours)
And yes of course I like the flavour of coffee, but mainly drink it for the ritual and the increased alertness in the mornings. There's something so satisfying about a good cup though; again, I don't get science-y about it and measure things accurately, just throw the water in the kettle, and mix it with a few scoops of coffee in the french press sometime after it boils.
But sometimes a cup is just perfection, tones of chocolate, smoke, warmth, boldness. And sometimes the cup is just meh. Then when I'm at a hotel, it's almost painful trying to choke down whatever passes for coffee in their lobbies.
There is so much variety between types of coffees, and even preparation methods (we mainly use french press and aeropress, but the grind size, brew time, water temperature, and of course the amount of grind, all make enough of a difference that the same beans can give different flavours)
And yes of course I like the flavour of coffee, but mainly drink it for the ritual and the increased alertness in the mornings. There's something so satisfying about a good cup though; again, I don't get science-y about it and measure things accurately, just throw the water in the kettle, and mix it with a few scoops of coffee in the french press sometime after it boils.
But sometimes a cup is just perfection, tones of chocolate, smoke, warmth, boldness. And sometimes the cup is just meh. Then when I'm at a hotel, it's almost painful trying to choke down whatever passes for coffee in their lobbies.
I'd say it's not as much better or worse just because it was learned to be better or worse; it's more like comparing things you know with each other.
Say you taste something with a very generic taste that you can't really describe other than 'brown with a bit of a toasty taste', then if taste something else that makes you have a much more descriptive or complicated taste and you also like that new taste, you now have something to compare against.
This has nothing to do with coffee per se or 'better vs worse', just with what you taste and if you want to explore it.
The same goes for details within a taste. A raw potato tastes different from a cooked potato, and the texture of that same cooked potato but mashed makes you experience it differently as well. If you fry that same potato, now it's different again. It doesn't really change the potato itself into something else (like changing it into a carrot or something silly like that), but it does change what you experience when eating it.
Say you taste something with a very generic taste that you can't really describe other than 'brown with a bit of a toasty taste', then if taste something else that makes you have a much more descriptive or complicated taste and you also like that new taste, you now have something to compare against.
This has nothing to do with coffee per se or 'better vs worse', just with what you taste and if you want to explore it.
The same goes for details within a taste. A raw potato tastes different from a cooked potato, and the texture of that same cooked potato but mashed makes you experience it differently as well. If you fry that same potato, now it's different again. It doesn't really change the potato itself into something else (like changing it into a carrot or something silly like that), but it does change what you experience when eating it.
> By the time it almost turns black, you'd eat it
No thanks. Not 20 years ago and not now.
> the standard stuff is fine.
For some people maybe. There is no universal truth. Most people 'make due' and don't really form an opinion about anything. (yet engage in discussion anyway)
> I don't pay attention to coffee when I drink it.
So you have no stake in this. Why did you bother to write about it anyway?
No thanks. Not 20 years ago and not now.
> the standard stuff is fine.
For some people maybe. There is no universal truth. Most people 'make due' and don't really form an opinion about anything. (yet engage in discussion anyway)
> I don't pay attention to coffee when I drink it.
So you have no stake in this. Why did you bother to write about it anyway?
Are you the type of person that takes a clearly juicy/humorous/exaggerated post and dissects and fact-checks every single part of it? To take it all literally?
It was a light stab at coffee snobs.
It was a light stab at coffee snobs.
I find it weird that there are two kinds of snobbery for goods. (Harmless snobbery - de gustibus non disputandum est).
Coffee, wine and whisky lovers adore the rarest and most refined, and insist the everyday stuff is vile. But lovers of crime novels, science fiction and anime adore the widest range, and insist that the most obscure trash contains treasure. I've never met a wine lover who would rave about obscure objectively-bad wines, or a sci-fi fan who will only read the most perfect works. I don't know quite what the difference is - consumability? Physical flavour?
I'm all for letting people enjoy what they enjoy. Personally I wouldn't want my palate to become so refined it became a hassle.
Coffee, wine and whisky lovers adore the rarest and most refined, and insist the everyday stuff is vile. But lovers of crime novels, science fiction and anime adore the widest range, and insist that the most obscure trash contains treasure. I've never met a wine lover who would rave about obscure objectively-bad wines, or a sci-fi fan who will only read the most perfect works. I don't know quite what the difference is - consumability? Physical flavour?
I'm all for letting people enjoy what they enjoy. Personally I wouldn't want my palate to become so refined it became a hassle.
You're probably reading in to it too much. I wrote about 3 personal experiences, 1 generalisation and 1 thing about tea in there, and a joke about coffee snobbery making your life harder.
I'd compare wine snobbery to the coffee snobbery that is about beans that have to be eaten by a cat and pooped out to be "good". I think those are illegal in most countries anyway, but that's about the same level of nonsense as a 20+ year old bottle of alcohol.
I'd compare wine snobbery to the coffee snobbery that is about beans that have to be eaten by a cat and pooped out to be "good". I think those are illegal in most countries anyway, but that's about the same level of nonsense as a 20+ year old bottle of alcohol.
> I'd compare wine snobbery to the coffee snobbery that is about beans that have to be eaten by a cat and pooped out to be "good".
That is a profoundly unfair comparison, but ok.
That is a profoundly unfair comparison, but ok.
Somebody please make a sitcom where the main theme is wine snobs vs coffee snobs.
As tensions escalate one gets progressively more drunk while the other gets jitters so bad it threatens their grip on reality.
As tensions escalate one gets progressively more drunk while the other gets jitters so bad it threatens their grip on reality.
> as soon as you know the taste of real coffee
De gustibus non disputandum est. I am one of those who tasted "real coffee". I read books about "real coffee", I bought equipment, I tried this and that, I went to coffee shops with stellar reviews (I live in NYC). I just apparently don't like what aficionados rave about. Instead, I used to love the ordinary Peet's coffee that I could buy in my office building. They don't sell it anymore, and I switched jobs anyway. Now I'm fine with Starbucks. I simply drink the coffee for the caffeine and not the taste. I guess 90% of the people do the same.
De gustibus non disputandum est. I am one of those who tasted "real coffee". I read books about "real coffee", I bought equipment, I tried this and that, I went to coffee shops with stellar reviews (I live in NYC). I just apparently don't like what aficionados rave about. Instead, I used to love the ordinary Peet's coffee that I could buy in my office building. They don't sell it anymore, and I switched jobs anyway. Now I'm fine with Starbucks. I simply drink the coffee for the caffeine and not the taste. I guess 90% of the people do the same.
> I am one of those who tasted "real coffee".
I don't think those words mean the same thing to us. There is no "official" real coffee or what someone else can decide is the best coffee for you. That'd be like someone deciding for you that apple juice is the only real juice. It's about finding something that interests you and has properties you value.
> I simply drink the coffee for the caffeine and not the taste.
So you don't have much of a stake or (refined) opinion but you felt it necessary to tell everyone how much you don't care?
I don't think those words mean the same thing to us. There is no "official" real coffee or what someone else can decide is the best coffee for you. That'd be like someone deciding for you that apple juice is the only real juice. It's about finding something that interests you and has properties you value.
> I simply drink the coffee for the caffeine and not the taste.
So you don't have much of a stake or (refined) opinion but you felt it necessary to tell everyone how much you don't care?
> to paper coffee pads
They're plastic, actually, but the other ones you mention are worse.
> we have things like infusions (ginger, mint, fruits, but also Rooibos) that doesn't really "do" anything but definitely make for a tasty hydrating drink.
Rooibos, for certain, 'does' a lot. It lowers your blood pressure. You can use it as a downer though it might be unnecessary if you don't use caffeine otherwise.
They're plastic, actually, but the other ones you mention are worse.
> we have things like infusions (ginger, mint, fruits, but also Rooibos) that doesn't really "do" anything but definitely make for a tasty hydrating drink.
Rooibos, for certain, 'does' a lot. It lowers your blood pressure. You can use it as a downer though it might be unnecessary if you don't use caffeine otherwise.
I like to rate limit with my own coffee snobbery. Free pots of coffee at work? No thank you, I don't want any of that swill. I'm going to use my mini hand-pumped espresso maker for a single shot of espresso.
I did used to drink the coffee at work and ended up drinking a lot of it. Crappy coffee, better drink it fast cause I just need the caffeine. Or my cup is not warm anymore so better chug the rest of it, or add more hot coffee to the mug. Rinse and repeat.
I did used to drink the coffee at work and ended up drinking a lot of it. Crappy coffee, better drink it fast cause I just need the caffeine. Or my cup is not warm anymore so better chug the rest of it, or add more hot coffee to the mug. Rinse and repeat.
Except a real snob would have a better espresso machine at home. My handpresso is ok for travel but even compared to pleb machines like my Pasquini Livia 90 the quality is bad. (Yes I'm using freshly ground beans that were picked and processed by virgins under moonlight, etc)
I'm similar, except I'm not even that much of a snob any more. The only thing I really insist on is I grind the beans myself and make it in a cafetière.
When I was a student I drank coffee fairly randomly. Any time of day really, whenever I felt like it, but it was never too much. Then I started at a workplace that had a bean-to-cup espresso machine. It got a bit out of control. Coffee was not only nice but also an excuse to spark up a conversation. I was drinking something like 6-8 cups a day.
Interestingly, I don't recall having any kind of withdrawal on the weekends when I would drink much less.
At some point several years ago I decided 6-8 cups is too much, and I also read about the bad effects caffeine has on sleep. So I decided to have two cups per day: one in the morning and one at lunch time. It has become so normal now that the thought of drinking coffee at any other time seems absurd.
When I was a student I drank coffee fairly randomly. Any time of day really, whenever I felt like it, but it was never too much. Then I started at a workplace that had a bean-to-cup espresso machine. It got a bit out of control. Coffee was not only nice but also an excuse to spark up a conversation. I was drinking something like 6-8 cups a day.
Interestingly, I don't recall having any kind of withdrawal on the weekends when I would drink much less.
At some point several years ago I decided 6-8 cups is too much, and I also read about the bad effects caffeine has on sleep. So I decided to have two cups per day: one in the morning and one at lunch time. It has become so normal now that the thought of drinking coffee at any other time seems absurd.
Any excuse you can to go outside, walk around and interact during the work from home environment is a good idea.
Posting this while waiting for my coffee :)
Posting this while waiting for my coffee :)
I do something similar only because I’m a social caffeine drinker. I only go to cafes when on a walk or date, in prior times it would be during a break at the office with coworkers walking around the neighborhood. Nowadays that would be like 1 cafe latte every other week.
But the only reason I have any setup at home at all is because I occasionally wake up next to people that believe they need coffee in the morning. I dont really know how to operate the machine.
Adaptations.
But the only reason I have any setup at home at all is because I occasionally wake up next to people that believe they need coffee in the morning. I dont really know how to operate the machine.
Adaptations.
real life and society as rate limiting balancing mechanism :)
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I quit caffeine about 8 weeks ago for mental health reasons. It has been TREMENDOUS so far. I'm still hesitant on writing about it because it's such a new experiment.
When I was on caffeine I was on a lot of it. Probably around 400-600mg a day combining my pre workout with my daily coffees. It is one of my favorite drugs and I loved taking it. This was the last 15 years of my life.
I became quite irritable over the past couple years with the inability for my mind to sit still which spiraled me into manic depression. I slowly weened myself off for a few months and finally quit altogether 8 weeks ago.
I've noticed I am much calmer, my mind is quieter, and my bipolar 2 is no where to be seen. Life definitely seems "duller" which sucks. But the lack of excitement everywhere feels much healthier.
Working out is definitely harder, as is being productive at work, but I'm slowly figuring out ways to combat that. If you haven't taken a break I highly recommend it. Even to just reduce you tolerance so you can feel just how powerful a drug this stuff is.
When I was on caffeine I was on a lot of it. Probably around 400-600mg a day combining my pre workout with my daily coffees. It is one of my favorite drugs and I loved taking it. This was the last 15 years of my life.
I became quite irritable over the past couple years with the inability for my mind to sit still which spiraled me into manic depression. I slowly weened myself off for a few months and finally quit altogether 8 weeks ago.
I've noticed I am much calmer, my mind is quieter, and my bipolar 2 is no where to be seen. Life definitely seems "duller" which sucks. But the lack of excitement everywhere feels much healthier.
Working out is definitely harder, as is being productive at work, but I'm slowly figuring out ways to combat that. If you haven't taken a break I highly recommend it. Even to just reduce you tolerance so you can feel just how powerful a drug this stuff is.
When I've read about people quitting caffeine, it seems like half of people see no difference and half of them feel like their lives have improved.
I'm kind of thinking of stopping, only because it bothers me if I go on a trip or something and have to get caffeine to avoid headaches. Also, part of me wonders how caffeine is influencing me overall, if it's doing things I'm not aware of.
To be honest, the reason why I'm reluctant to try it is because I tea and coffee occupy this place that I can't quite find a replacement for, which is something interesting, low-calorie, and not a depressant. By "interesting" I might mean "artisanal" or "varietal", but I'm not even sure I mean anything that specific: I just mean, there's interesting variety, differences in products to try. Coffee and/or tea also are pretty low calorie if taken black (like I do), and unlike things like wine or beer, which are also artisanal in nature, don't act as depressants per se.
If there was something like coffee or tea, with lots of variety and skill involved, that kept me from consuming calories from other sources, and didn't have any kind of psychopharmacological effects, I could go to that. But I am not aware of anything like that.
Maybe I just need to rethink my perspective on it and what I could do to address those issues in other ways, but there are a lot of benefits to caffeinated beverages aside from the caffeine.
I'm kind of thinking of stopping, only because it bothers me if I go on a trip or something and have to get caffeine to avoid headaches. Also, part of me wonders how caffeine is influencing me overall, if it's doing things I'm not aware of.
To be honest, the reason why I'm reluctant to try it is because I tea and coffee occupy this place that I can't quite find a replacement for, which is something interesting, low-calorie, and not a depressant. By "interesting" I might mean "artisanal" or "varietal", but I'm not even sure I mean anything that specific: I just mean, there's interesting variety, differences in products to try. Coffee and/or tea also are pretty low calorie if taken black (like I do), and unlike things like wine or beer, which are also artisanal in nature, don't act as depressants per se.
If there was something like coffee or tea, with lots of variety and skill involved, that kept me from consuming calories from other sources, and didn't have any kind of psychopharmacological effects, I could go to that. But I am not aware of anything like that.
Maybe I just need to rethink my perspective on it and what I could do to address those issues in other ways, but there are a lot of benefits to caffeinated beverages aside from the caffeine.
Since the water’s hot for my partner’s coffee, when I’m practicing going without caffeine I add a little lemon juice and ascorbic acid (vitamin C) powder to a cup of hot water, per Gandhi advice from a book he wrote in his 20s (?). It’s too hot and acidic to quaff, and while I still miss coffee with whole milk, this is a workable substitute that allows me to have wonderfully engaging dreams as part of a full-night’s sleep.
I'm trying to get into japanese green teas. They are plenty artisanal for me, at least the good stuff is. Temperature and time control when brewing is close to coffee pour over brewing, maybe not quite there. Water quality matters just as much - I'm adding minerals to osmotic filtered water, just as I did with coffee. When done properly they taste wonderful, although this is subjective of course. Caffeine content is much lower than coffee, unless you go into matcha tea, which is even more artisanal and expensive (per gram). And if you love spending money, making it can be even more expensive than coffee (per gram, not per cup) - it's not really difficult to spend over $30 for a 50 gram bag. And some even say it's healthy.
tl;dr: try japanese green coffee.
tl;dr: try japanese green coffee.
I highly recommend genmaicha if you haven't had it yet. By far my favorite green tea.
I've quit drinking coffee and any caffeine-containing product for a couple of months, but I ultimately ended up with drinking one cup in the morning, a single teaspoon of instant coffee. I can sip from it for an hour, it's ok if it has become cold.
Before quitting I was drinking around 5 or 6 cups of coffee a day with around 2 teaspoons each. Any decrease in caffeine intake would give me a migraine, which lowered my desire to drink coffee, leading to migraines of 3 days in duration. A detox. And I was always on the edge, felt super restless without actually being able to eliminate this feeling.
Removing refined sugar from my diet is now priority #1, including chocolate and whatever contains it to enhance taste. Afterwards I may try fully quitting drinking coffee again, which shouldn't be that hard. It's just that it's a nice thing to be doing, like playing with a cigarette between the fingers and smoking it. You loose something if you remove this from the life, and what you gain isn't always that obvious. Well, the benefits of quitting smoking are easy to recognize, but it's harder with coffee.
Before quitting I was drinking around 5 or 6 cups of coffee a day with around 2 teaspoons each. Any decrease in caffeine intake would give me a migraine, which lowered my desire to drink coffee, leading to migraines of 3 days in duration. A detox. And I was always on the edge, felt super restless without actually being able to eliminate this feeling.
Removing refined sugar from my diet is now priority #1, including chocolate and whatever contains it to enhance taste. Afterwards I may try fully quitting drinking coffee again, which shouldn't be that hard. It's just that it's a nice thing to be doing, like playing with a cigarette between the fingers and smoking it. You loose something if you remove this from the life, and what you gain isn't always that obvious. Well, the benefits of quitting smoking are easy to recognize, but it's harder with coffee.
Exactly. Coffee is fine in moderation, 1 maybe 2 cups a day. Most people who talk about quitting are drinking 3-6 cups.
I quit and I just felt worse. I'm not a morning person and only caffeine lets me function.
My trade off was no caffeine on the weekends. It lowered my tolerance a lot since I had over 48 hours off it.
I don't have any mental health issues, so I can't speak to that trade off. But in the past, when I've had some anxiety, caffeine makes it worse.
My trade off was no caffeine on the weekends. It lowered my tolerance a lot since I had over 48 hours off it.
I don't have any mental health issues, so I can't speak to that trade off. But in the past, when I've had some anxiety, caffeine makes it worse.
I quit over a year ago. Mostly for sleep reasons. I have cheated on my "caffeine fast" quite a bit though. I agree about the duller part, but that should go away eventually. One thing that helped, I used chicory root as a coffee substitute and I found replacing the routine helped fill the void a bit.
Also, I was originally hoping I could go back to 1 or 2 cups per week, on an "as needed" basis (i.e. when I needed a productivity boost) without developing a tolerance. The first cup of coffee after a few months off was absolutely magical. But I found that even at 1-2 per week, my tolerance would quickly shoot up. Like you, I used to drink a ton of coffee so I suspect I would need to take a full year or more off with no cheating to really reset the system.
A final note, I found that decaf and chocolate both have enough caffeine in them to "muddy" the waters so to speak. To get to a good "baseline" I had to cut both of those out as well.
Also, I was originally hoping I could go back to 1 or 2 cups per week, on an "as needed" basis (i.e. when I needed a productivity boost) without developing a tolerance. The first cup of coffee after a few months off was absolutely magical. But I found that even at 1-2 per week, my tolerance would quickly shoot up. Like you, I used to drink a ton of coffee so I suspect I would need to take a full year or more off with no cheating to really reset the system.
A final note, I found that decaf and chocolate both have enough caffeine in them to "muddy" the waters so to speak. To get to a good "baseline" I had to cut both of those out as well.
Everything being duller is what I recall the last time I tried quitting. My theory is that it takes quite a while until you achieve a new baseline. I was much calmer which is a good tradeoff I think. I cut my caffeine down to one cup of coffee in the morning and think I get the best of both worlds but maybe I should try quitting again and see if that holds.
Do you sleep better now, is that the explanation? I quit coffee for a few years, to fix my sleep, and it really did (now I'm back on caffeine and managing ok-ish).
I would suggest to anyone curious to try. And if you quit coffee make it two weeks or so to really see the difference.
I would suggest to anyone curious to try. And if you quit coffee make it two weeks or so to really see the difference.
I quit drinking coffee in the evening, and that helped with sleep. But sleep is also a matter of habit. If its broken, you need to fix it by breaking the current habit of sleeping schedule.
I dream more, but I didn't ever really have a problem sleeping.
Maybe you sleep better without sleeping longer. I'm no expert, but I've read that caffeine and alcohol can affect sleep quality in that way. Either way, great that it has a good effect.
After reading you, I wish I drink coffee so I can quit and experience the same feeling you experienced.
I'll be the contrarian. I was a pot per day drinker and quit for three months and felt no different, just missed the coffee. I quit the quit and I'm back to a pot per day, feeling much better.
> felt no different
> feeling much better
Does not compute :P
> feeling much better
Does not compute :P
It depends on the person, I can go on and off caffeine with no repercussions, but my wife goes through grueling withdrawals when she does it.
A pot per day can be a lot, or a little depending on the bean and the roast, so I can't comment on that.
A pot per day can be a lot, or a little depending on the bean and the roast, so I can't comment on that.
I never have withdrawal symptoms just cravings, usually after lunch. But I strictly drink maximum 1 cup per day, 2 if I didn't sleep so well, and when I feel my tolerance going up, I take a week or two of caffeine break to reset the tolerance. Cafeeine is a tool to me.
Caffeine metabolization speed varies wildly across the population due to genetic reasons. When you compound it with multiple cups per day, you will get a quite different experience.
Same for me but with sugar. Quit for a week, felt no different, went back to my usual (not particularly high) consumption. It's a bummer too because I had read so much strong criticism of sugar on HN and about how much it affects us without us realizing it, I thought maybe I'll actually feel something better which would be exciting! Nope, just bored because I had to cut out most of the interesting (to me) food in my life.
I'll throw in my two cents as someone who quit sugar in the past six months: I wasn't really free of the addiction until more than two weeks had gone by. Since then I lost 20 lbs without exercising and I just have these periodic moments in the day when I feel a huge surge of energy. After a couple months I cut my total carb intake to < 120g / day and increased my fat intake. Then I switched to a revolutionary new diet: Three meals a day. (No snacking / grazing.) Since adding these changes I've lost another five pounds and am steadily losing 1 - 2 lbs a month without any additional exercise.
Anyway, a week just annoyed the f outta me. I'd give it two or three weeks at least. It takes that long to cut the cravings I didn't even realize I was having.
Anyway, a week just annoyed the f outta me. I'd give it two or three weeks at least. It takes that long to cut the cravings I didn't even realize I was having.
Yeah I also quit sugar for like six months and wish I had stuck with it. If anything, the best part about it was the effect on decision fatigue. "Do I grab this snack while I'm in line or not", etc. No decision to make.
I guess I didn't stick because I didn't really "feel" different, and had a moment of weakness. I agree it takes a couple weeks to really get used to it but the cravings do eventually (mostly) go away.
I guess I didn't stick because I didn't really "feel" different, and had a moment of weakness. I agree it takes a couple weeks to really get used to it but the cravings do eventually (mostly) go away.
Did you quit caffeine too? Tea, chocolate, soda etc
If so, awesome! If not, I tried a similar thing but only really noticed the difference once I quit all types.
If so, awesome! If not, I tried a similar thing but only really noticed the difference once I quit all types.
Yeah, I don't really drink soda or tea, and I didn't specifically avoid chocolate but I don't eat much of it to begin with.
I only had minor withdrawal headaches for a day or so and after that it was fine.
I only had minor withdrawal headaches for a day or so and after that it was fine.
I didn't quit caffeine, but I cut down massively by keeping it in a Zojirushi mug that keeps it hot all morning instead of drinking from a regular mug. Because it stays hot, I just sip it, and that way I only drink one mug in the morning and occasionally one in the afternoon, instead of the 3 or 4 mugs I would drink previously.
Similarly, I use a really skinny mug that keeps coffee hot longer than usual, and I make sure it stays hot by going back to the microwave and reheating it as needed. The heat keeps me from chugging it.
I also brew half-caf and mix it with half water before heating it. I know I sound like a crazy person.
I also brew half-caf and mix it with half water before heating it. I know I sound like a crazy person.
Wait, why would a really skinny mug keep coffee hot longer than usual? Wouldn't that mean more surface area to cool a given volume. Ideally, you want a spherical coffee cup (impracticalities of that aside)
Edit: Nevermind, its the cooling surface of the top of the coffee directly exposed to air. I'm just over here thinking about spherical chickens in a vacuum...
Edit: Nevermind, its the cooling surface of the top of the coffee directly exposed to air. I'm just over here thinking about spherical chickens in a vacuum...
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This is an interesting technique. When I first started working in a place that had lots of free/good food, I was worried I'd gorge. Instead what I found was that knowing I'd always have access to good/free food meant I didn't feel the need to overeat ever.
hah! when I worked at a place that had free food I would be good until about 3pm, when I'd gorge on terrible snacks because I'd used up all my willpower coding during the day
+1 for Zojirushi. I do wish they made something shaped more like a traditional mug than a travel mug. I've tried various brands of insulated mugs, and at most they let me stretch out my cup of coffee to 45 minutes. With a Zojirushi I can make a cup last hours.
I know the Zojirushi is recommended a lot, but I'm not a fan. It certainly does a great job keeping stuff hot, but the silicon(?) parts pretty quickly takes on a strong smell of stale coffee that ruins it for me, at least when trying to drink from it directly. Pouring it out into a mug helps, but kind of defeats the purpose of it.
I've tried everything to get rid of the smell but have not been successful.
I've tried everything to get rid of the smell but have not been successful.
Zojirushi keeps the drink too scalding unless you pour it out into a different vessel. Try an Ember mug. A little annoying to keep it on the charging coaster but keeps it at a drinkable temp indefinitely.
I used to think the concept of a mug warmer or a heated mug was quite silly. My wife and I received Ember mugs a few months ago, and they're a lot less silly than I thought--they just keep your cup warm to exactly the temperature you prefer. If anyone is still on the fence, I highly recommend some kind of mug warmer or heated mug. There is something quite freeing about not worrying if you're drinking your coffee/tea/etc fast enough to avoid it getting cold.
Have to say I disagree about the Ember mug. It's a little bit like the warmer setting on a diner coffee pot, the coffee will stay warm a long time but won't necessarily stay fresh. And if you drink your coffee with milk the Ember mug starts to develop a film along the sides of the cup after about 30 minutes which is kind of unappetizing. You also have to keep it charged on the stand in between uses so you can't put the mug away in the cupboard (unless you have an outlet in your cupboard).
I stopped using it and now just use a Yeti tumbler. It keeps my coffee hot for at least 2-3 hours which is long enough for me, without any of the downsides of the heated cup.
I stopped using it and now just use a Yeti tumbler. It keeps my coffee hot for at least 2-3 hours which is long enough for me, without any of the downsides of the heated cup.
How does it compare to a Yeti?
Quitting caffeine cold-turkey is very unpleasant. It can take a full two weeks of withdrawal (bad headaches, general tiredness). I’ve had more success reducing the amount (3/4 caf -> 1/2 caf) over time.
Anything more that 4 cups a day is probably unhealthy. Remember that 1 “cup” of coffee is actually 6 oz, so a normal coffee mug or latte is twice that. One coffee (2 “cups” or a latte) in the morning and one around 2pm works fine for me, but everyone’s body is different.
Anything more that 4 cups a day is probably unhealthy. Remember that 1 “cup” of coffee is actually 6 oz, so a normal coffee mug or latte is twice that. One coffee (2 “cups” or a latte) in the morning and one around 2pm works fine for me, but everyone’s body is different.
I've 'quit' tea and coffee for long periods. It only takes a small daily quantity of caffeine to eliminate the withdrawal headaches. One 'Pro Plus' pill per day is probably sufficient (50mg anhydrous caffeine), reduced to half a pill per day after a week, then nothing after two weeks. Pills don't trigger the addictive yearning as much as the full coffee experience does. There's still sleepiness to contend with, however.
Coffee has effects beyond just the caffeine, in a way that caffeine pills or even tea do not.
It's the headaches I'm talking about.
yeah, i wish i knew that this was an option.
I did it cold turkey and it sucked for a week. but now in not going back.
sure i miss the ritual and the identity, but i feel much better.
Quantity of coffee is probably better determined by the weight of dry coffee that went into the beverage than by the volume of the resulting drink. Someone adds more water, someone prefers less, but they both may be on the same amount of coffee.
Everyone's body is indeed different. I switched to decaffeinated tea and coffee exactly a week ago. There wasn't any noticeable difference, maybe my sleep feels a bit different, but that is about it.
I already suspected that I am more attracted to the flavor of tea and coffee than to their actual caffeine content, because I could drink six cups of coffee one day, zero the next day, and feel no withdrawal.
Everyone's body is indeed different. I switched to decaffeinated tea and coffee exactly a week ago. There wasn't any noticeable difference, maybe my sleep feels a bit different, but that is about it.
I already suspected that I am more attracted to the flavor of tea and coffee than to their actual caffeine content, because I could drink six cups of coffee one day, zero the next day, and feel no withdrawal.
> 1 “cup” of coffee is actually 6 oz
Wait, 8 oz is a cup of anything else - why is a cup of coffee only 6?
Wait, 8 oz is a cup of anything else - why is a cup of coffee only 6?
There are also slow and fast caffeine metabolizers, so there’s not one single safe amount.
I had this exact same problem just back in November.
Regular coffee drinker (1-2 cups), having pre-workout before the gym.
Starting having an absurd amount of anxiety and what I can best describe as a panic attack or flu-like symptom making my heart race & feelings of palpitations.
Go to the ER, they find nothing wrong. Doctors say "cut your stimulates and lower your stresses".
Seemed to be a combination of work stress & the stimulates. Ever since going cold turkey, I've been better than ever. I continue to get headaches but they are manageable with plenty of water.
Regular coffee drinker (1-2 cups), having pre-workout before the gym.
Starting having an absurd amount of anxiety and what I can best describe as a panic attack or flu-like symptom making my heart race & feelings of palpitations.
Go to the ER, they find nothing wrong. Doctors say "cut your stimulates and lower your stresses".
Seemed to be a combination of work stress & the stimulates. Ever since going cold turkey, I've been better than ever. I continue to get headaches but they are manageable with plenty of water.
I experienced something similar (minus the hospital visit.) I'd regularly gone with 4-6 cups a day for years, with no noticeable problems. I ran into a particularly stressful month, then experienced a 2-month bout with insomnia and anxiety.
Insomnia is brutal, and I did everything I could to get over it including eliminating caffeine/coffee completely for around 6-7 months.
I didn't experience any issues stopping. After the sleeping and anxiety were under control I figured I'd stick with it - I'd heard others say they experienced a few positive benefits by cutting caffeine completely. I didn't notice anything.
When I decided to grab a cup again the productivity boost was pretty amazing. I settled on 1/2 caff up to 11am, then decaf only. I drink a lot less coffee now, and if there's even a hint of an issue sleeping I'll skip it for a day or two.
Insomnia is brutal, and I did everything I could to get over it including eliminating caffeine/coffee completely for around 6-7 months.
I didn't experience any issues stopping. After the sleeping and anxiety were under control I figured I'd stick with it - I'd heard others say they experienced a few positive benefits by cutting caffeine completely. I didn't notice anything.
When I decided to grab a cup again the productivity boost was pretty amazing. I settled on 1/2 caff up to 11am, then decaf only. I drink a lot less coffee now, and if there's even a hint of an issue sleeping I'll skip it for a day or two.
That's awesome that you were able to find a moderation change. I just went cold turkey because of experience itself.
Doesn't pre-workout contain a fair amount of caffeine as well?
It does. About 1.5-2x the amount of a cup of coffee.
I had this problem a long time ago but I was drinking way too much coffee, I think 5 cups a day. Down to 2, one of them is decaf so basically down to one.
What pre workout were you taking? Some have over 10 cups of coffee worth of caffeine.
Pre Jym. I believe it’s 300mg or close to 3 cups of coffee. Been on it for years previously. Never in excess, just once before workout.
Did you get vaccinated? I had these symptoms after the vaccination, but I am not 100% if other things changed at the same time, like increased coffee consumption or unrelated external worries.
I'm so sorry to hear that. I hear that quite often from friends and family members. I did not get vaccinated/boosted around this timeframe if you were curious if that was the cause. I even had covid earlier in january 2021. I did a few COVID tests(both ER & at home) and came back negative each time. Inflammation markers in blood work also looked normal according to doctors/cardiologist.
For my situation, I think it was a combination of many things. Stress, anxiety, caffeine, intense workouts, allergy season, diet, hydration, long COVID, seasonal flu, genetics, etc. Nothing really changed for me personally either, but the world around me did. Maybe it's my body & mind's way of saying "dude slow down". So I listened.
For my situation, I think it was a combination of many things. Stress, anxiety, caffeine, intense workouts, allergy season, diet, hydration, long COVID, seasonal flu, genetics, etc. Nothing really changed for me personally either, but the world around me did. Maybe it's my body & mind's way of saying "dude slow down". So I listened.
Thanks - I hope it isn't serious but I'll try to get checked just in case.
I grew up in a house where coffee wasn't allowed, so I've actually never had it before. I have avoided nearly all caffeine my whole life out of habit (one of those cases where a rule you grow up with sticks with you even if the original justification for it didn't).
Drinking a Coke is enough to make me bounce off the walls. I've often wondered what would happen to me if I tried coffee or an energy drink, but based on how strong the effects of sugar and small caffeine doses are on me, I'm far too scared to experiment. I do think coffee smells amazing, though--walking into a Starbucks is always delightful, even if I only ever buy hot chocolate there.
Drinking a Coke is enough to make me bounce off the walls. I've often wondered what would happen to me if I tried coffee or an energy drink, but based on how strong the effects of sugar and small caffeine doses are on me, I'm far too scared to experiment. I do think coffee smells amazing, though--walking into a Starbucks is always delightful, even if I only ever buy hot chocolate there.
That bouncing off effect might be related to sugar too. If you really want to see caffeine's effects you might "microdose" a quarter of a cup of filtered coffee or a half shot of espresso, without mixing it with anything but water.
That will give you coffee effects, not caffeine effects. Coffee contains a LOT of monoamine oxidase inhibitors.
The only way to ingest pure caffeine is to take a pill.
The only way to ingest pure caffeine is to take a pill.
Honest question: Would MAOIs have any jittery/stimulant effects that mimick caffeine?
I think you should give it a shot. Unless you have some pre-existing condition (severe anxiety or something), there's basically no risk. Head to a coffee shop some morning and spend a few bucks for a small coffee. Maybe you'll find a new small joy in life. I have one cup, each morning when I get up, it's a tasty little ritual. Or maybe you won't like it after all, and then you'll know.
Don't forget the risk of getting addicted. Are there even any actual upsides apart from the (acquired) good taste?
I think the good taste is sufficient, but also I find a caffeine buzz enjoyable.
Will a Diet Coke give you the same effect as a Coke? I'm curious how much of your bouncing is due to the caffeine versus the sugar and/or some synergism.
It's worth noting that Diet Coke has about 50% more caffeine than regular.
I never knew this! Thanks for that.
I think so? I've had the same question and have been meaning to do a actual controlled experiment, but haven't ever gotten around to it. I know I react badly to sugar, and I'm fairly certain I also react badly to caffeine separately, but don't have enough data points to draw a solid conclusion yet.
I gave up all forms of caffeine about 35 years ago. My experiences were similar to the author, but worse. I had been drinking coffee from about age 12. The first time I quit (at age 24) I had bad headaches. I "fell off the wagon" after a week or so. A month later I quit again and then felt so bad that I missed two days of work. I lapsed again after about a month. The third and final time I quit (maybe a month later), the withdrawal symptoms were so bad that it made me never want to go through it again. I am talking about cold sweats, shakes, and vomiting.
It's easy to get caffeine, and somewhat difficult to avoid it. Caffeine is so common that it's easy to justify using it. ("Everyone else does, so it can't be that bad. Right?")
My wife is still a user, and I often make coffee for her in the morning. It still smells delicious to me, but I haven't (and wont) go back to it. She is like a zombie before she has her morning coffee, and she often has trouble getting to sleep at night. I am awake and alert in the morning, and sleep soundly.
It's easy to get caffeine, and somewhat difficult to avoid it. Caffeine is so common that it's easy to justify using it. ("Everyone else does, so it can't be that bad. Right?")
My wife is still a user, and I often make coffee for her in the morning. It still smells delicious to me, but I haven't (and wont) go back to it. She is like a zombie before she has her morning coffee, and she often has trouble getting to sleep at night. I am awake and alert in the morning, and sleep soundly.
It is well-known that people metabolize caffeine with different speed due to genetic reasons. Therefore people can experience wildly different peak blood concentration after drinking many cups per day. I suppose it influences how strong withdrawals are.
I personally used to drink a lot of coffee and rarely experienced any withdrawal effects. I also know (from comparing myself with other people) that I am a very fast caffeine metabolizer.
I personally used to drink a lot of coffee and rarely experienced any withdrawal effects. I also know (from comparing myself with other people) that I am a very fast caffeine metabolizer.
Sugar is in the same boat of "well, everyone does it, not that bad."
The metabolic and cardiovascular effects of coffee are vastly preferable over sugar‘s (or, to be more precise, fructose). I personally also don’t react well to caffeine (one weak cup can totally mess up sleep), but at least it’s easy to find out when it’s doing more harm than good.
Have been drinking it for 25 years. Had a few months without here and there. It's not much different unless your usage has been excessive, which clearly was the case here.
Different people have different metabolism of caffeine and different reactions. It's very well documented. I'm one of those who have it easier to nap after strong coffee than before it. But I do love my espresso.
If you are looking for a reason to start a new better life with some different drug read about caffeine influence on adenosine. For some people coffee can influence their sleep pretty bad and that's no good.
Moderate amounts of coffee correlate positively with better health.
Also watch for slight dehydration and if you like it white - the fact that many people have at least a tiny lactose intolerance. In Italy almost nobody drinks coffee with milk after noon.
And really, statistically, it's one of the easiest popular drugs to quit. Maybe a few headaches here and there and you're done. It's mostly about the ritual and lifestyle.
Different people have different metabolism of caffeine and different reactions. It's very well documented. I'm one of those who have it easier to nap after strong coffee than before it. But I do love my espresso.
If you are looking for a reason to start a new better life with some different drug read about caffeine influence on adenosine. For some people coffee can influence their sleep pretty bad and that's no good.
Moderate amounts of coffee correlate positively with better health.
Also watch for slight dehydration and if you like it white - the fact that many people have at least a tiny lactose intolerance. In Italy almost nobody drinks coffee with milk after noon.
And really, statistically, it's one of the easiest popular drugs to quit. Maybe a few headaches here and there and you're done. It's mostly about the ritual and lifestyle.
I agree with you in almost everything. Even with the 25 years drinking period. :)
What I don't agree is the easy to quit part. I get headaches and don't stay awake. Even worse is the depression that follows. I know I feel better without (quit two times) but quitting is really tough.
What I don't agree is the easy to quit part. I get headaches and don't stay awake. Even worse is the depression that follows. I know I feel better without (quit two times) but quitting is really tough.
Quitting cold turkey is bad. The only way I successfully did it was become very aware, used the same cup for getting it and cut down 1 cup a day every week until there were no more cups. I didn't get any headaches. When I quit cold turkey massive headaches for hours that required aspirin to function as a coder.
I never realized how strong caffeine actually is, until I cut down my 5-6 cups a day intake to just 1 in the morning.
Now very occasionally (perhaps once every couple of months) I drink another cup after lunch (but never after 4PM, or I won't be able to sleep properly that night).
The problem is that I _really_ like the flavor. I've tried decaf as well and while it's not bad, I do prefer grinding my beans just before brewing my cup.
I also hate that whenever I have quit cold-turkey I've gotten those nasty migraines. It's impressive how can a drink that we don't really think about much (Starbucks everywhere) can cause such strong effect on people.
Now very occasionally (perhaps once every couple of months) I drink another cup after lunch (but never after 4PM, or I won't be able to sleep properly that night).
The problem is that I _really_ like the flavor. I've tried decaf as well and while it's not bad, I do prefer grinding my beans just before brewing my cup.
I also hate that whenever I have quit cold-turkey I've gotten those nasty migraines. It's impressive how can a drink that we don't really think about much (Starbucks everywhere) can cause such strong effect on people.
You can get decaf beans, they are out there.
I think I've seen them before, but very rarely.
I guess I'll need to look harder. Thanks for the suggestion
I guess I'll need to look harder. Thanks for the suggestion
> I need a quick fix. I make a Nespresso. It's good enough. I'll make a french press after this cup wakes me up.
Sounds like you approach caffeine like an addict. Coffee is actually good for you though:
https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/hsph-in-the-news/coffee-be...
Sounds like you approach caffeine like an addict. Coffee is actually good for you though:
https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/hsph-in-the-news/coffee-be...
Like with every substance, the dosage and regularity of intake are the key factors that determine what it does to you. Coffee can be good for your health, but it also can be detrimental... Every habit can become an addiction, even coffee -- with less severe withdrawal symptoms than other stimulants, but still...
Coffee the plant may be good, caffeine the molecule is not. There are other things in coffee that may be helpful, but caffeine is a poison and only that, I think there is no debating that (but I'm interested if anybody has hints to the contrary).
> but caffeine is a poison and only that, I think there is no debating that
There's so much data to dispute that that it isn't even funny. Countless articles have been written.
What's usually under debate is to what extent consumption can be beneficial or detrimental.
Caffeine is only very obviously a poison when it comes to arachnids.
There's so much data to dispute that that it isn't even funny. Countless articles have been written.
What's usually under debate is to what extent consumption can be beneficial or detrimental.
Caffeine is only very obviously a poison when it comes to arachnids.
Isn't that about coffee not caffeine? I don't see how what caffeine alone does could be in any way helpful, outside of as a pure performance enhancer for very specific situations.
Exactly the opposite. There are a lot stronger psychoactives in coffee than caffeine is, and some of them are neurotoxic.
Dose makes the poison.
For me, I didn't like being physically addicted to something.
I've switched to decaf coffee, because I still like coffee and the morning ritual. But I limit myself to 2 cups, and I have herbal tea later in the day if I still want something to sip on.
The same goes for (added) sugar - it's amazing how you feel when you stop eating candy/ice cream/sweetened drinks/etc. And it's surprising how bad you feel when do you have sugar after you've been off a while - same as the author's experience with caffeine.
I've switched to decaf coffee, because I still like coffee and the morning ritual. But I limit myself to 2 cups, and I have herbal tea later in the day if I still want something to sip on.
The same goes for (added) sugar - it's amazing how you feel when you stop eating candy/ice cream/sweetened drinks/etc. And it's surprising how bad you feel when do you have sugar after you've been off a while - same as the author's experience with caffeine.
Oh man, sugar :( I stopped taking sugar for 2 years after I had a heart issue. Then somehow it came back in life, and it has been 4 years, and maybe 99 attempts (because the 100th will succeed:)) and it is just so hard to give up sugar.
But when I had stopped, I remember the taste had changed - just simply sautéed vegetables tasted much better, and in those days sugar tasted ugly. The good old days. And after hating chocolates all my life, I think it was our EPM who got addicted me to chocolates by always keeping a supply at her desk, right next to my desk. Now on my 99th attempt to give up sugar for the past 5 days, and this time determined to go much much longer.
But when I had stopped, I remember the taste had changed - just simply sautéed vegetables tasted much better, and in those days sugar tasted ugly. The good old days. And after hating chocolates all my life, I think it was our EPM who got addicted me to chocolates by always keeping a supply at her desk, right next to my desk. Now on my 99th attempt to give up sugar for the past 5 days, and this time determined to go much much longer.
Have you found good decaf anywhere? I drink only espresso and haven't found any decaf that isn't miserably bland.
If anything, I am drinking the best coffee of my life after switching to decaf, after saying no to bad supermarket and office coffee. In many big cities it is possible to find very high quality specialty decaf coffee in local roasters.
My favourite is Colombian beans decaffeinated with the "Sugar Cane Process". In my opinion this method produces the best tasting coffee that preserves the qualities of the origin beans and it might be more environmentally friendly compared to methods that require double shipping the beans to a 3rd country for decaffeination.
My favourite is Colombian beans decaffeinated with the "Sugar Cane Process". In my opinion this method produces the best tasting coffee that preserves the qualities of the origin beans and it might be more environmentally friendly compared to methods that require double shipping the beans to a 3rd country for decaffeination.
I've been buying decaf from Happy Mug. Price is reasonable, comes as beans or ground, is fresh, and I think it tastes good: https://happymugcoffee.com/
The Starbucks decaf espresso is pretty strong. It can be hard to find though.
I like Dunkin Decaf
I have quit caffeine several times. I love the taste of coffee and tea, but I become dependent on caffeine very quickly, and have to keep upping the dose just to feel normal. Eventually I don’t feel human until half way through the day and there is no amount of caffeine that will give me energy.
The withdrawal headaches are too excruciating for me to bear so I found a way to effectively wean myself off of caffeine using caffeine pills. Once you figure out how much caffeine you need to feel ok, you know your actual dose and can simply take a little less each day. For me that means a week or two of feeling a little groggy, but avoiding the headaches. I’m not a morning person, so I’ll never feel perky in the morning but I at least feel human.
One of the best investments I've ever made was a good espresso machine and grinder (Rancilio Silvia and Rocky for those who know something). Espresso coffee tastes so much better than drip (I really hate French press so that's not even a comparison).
I find espresso also much more agreeable. While I feel jittery after several cups of drip I find I would need to drink a lot more (unrealistic amounts) espresso coffee for the same effect. It also helps that its not a type of coffee where one has a big pot of it sitting around and one can get constant refills.
Interestingly I don't get withdrawal symptoms (I often don't drink coffee when travelling as I rather not drink coffee than drink bad coffee). So I might not be too strongly affected by caffeine.
I find espresso also much more agreeable. While I feel jittery after several cups of drip I find I would need to drink a lot more (unrealistic amounts) espresso coffee for the same effect. It also helps that its not a type of coffee where one has a big pot of it sitting around and one can get constant refills.
Interestingly I don't get withdrawal symptoms (I often don't drink coffee when travelling as I rather not drink coffee than drink bad coffee). So I might not be too strongly affected by caffeine.
About the withdrawal symptoms: anything that you substitute in place when you don't drink coffee? When I don't drink at morning I always have headache after a few hours, and I'd like to see any non-caffeinated (natural) substitutions that'd keep the headache away.
>When I don't drink at morning I always have headache after a few hours
for me in the past that would be a warning sign to cut back on the number of cups a day. I've settled on two espresso's a day
I have a bean to cup machine and to cut back I would miss one cup or make it weaker
for me in the past that would be a warning sign to cut back on the number of cups a day. I've settled on two espresso's a day
I have a bean to cup machine and to cut back I would miss one cup or make it weaker
I'm already on no more than two espressos, yet I have it if I don't drink it.
Typically I would drink juice or maybe a tea, but nothing would pay attention to.
I'd be less worried about the damage that the coffee is doing and more worried about the damage waking up at 6am every day is doing. (assuming that if you arent stopping for the day until 9pm you aren't going to sleep at 10pm)
I quit cold-turkey around 3 years ago. Caffeine started to affect me differently the older I got, and it wasn't until I was almost hospitalized from dehydration during a house move that I realized I was perhaps a little too dependent on it.
The following couple of weeks after quitting was hell. Migraines, shakes, generally feeling awful. I doubted my decision, but powered through, and am thankful I did.
Waking up is easier, going to sleep is easier, and personally I wasn't a fan of the adrenaline rush feeling I would get after drinking coffee. Your mileage may vary, but if you're getting older and feeling jittery then definitely give it a try.
The following couple of weeks after quitting was hell. Migraines, shakes, generally feeling awful. I doubted my decision, but powered through, and am thankful I did.
Waking up is easier, going to sleep is easier, and personally I wasn't a fan of the adrenaline rush feeling I would get after drinking coffee. Your mileage may vary, but if you're getting older and feeling jittery then definitely give it a try.
Switching to decaf coffee was one of the best health choices I've ever made. I used to regularly have a mild headache on Sunday every week, but I haven't had that once since quitting. It's also super nice to be able to skip coffee in the morning (for whatever reason) and just get on with my day.
I did have a mild headache for about 2 weeks when I did quit, but honestly, the fact that that happened was just more evidence I was doing the right thing. Still, I have yet to convince another human being to give it a try. I guess most people are just too addicted.
I did have a mild headache for about 2 weeks when I did quit, but honestly, the fact that that happened was just more evidence I was doing the right thing. Still, I have yet to convince another human being to give it a try. I guess most people are just too addicted.
I drink my first cup as regular and when I get into the office I get another one, this one decaf. Though it is not functional, I enjoy sipping from throughout the day.
Congrats on beating your drug addiction!
Even if it's "just" caffeine, it's never easy. Methylxantines are a tool, and like every other chemical it's best enjoyed in moderation.
Even if it's "just" caffeine, it's never easy. Methylxantines are a tool, and like every other chemical it's best enjoyed in moderation.
I've heard (but not verified) that ibuprofen is a vasoconstrictor like caffeine, and can be more helpful in easing withdrawal symptoms than other OTC pain meds.
That said, it's likely also tolerance-inducing (https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/stopping-the-vicious-cyc...), so don't overdo it.
That said, it's likely also tolerance-inducing (https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/stopping-the-vicious-cyc...), so don't overdo it.
Actually ibuprofen is a vasodilator unlike caffeine.
They're a very common combo used for pain and migraines though.
Cannabis can be used for instant relief, but it opens your veins, causing headaches or worsening your migraine.
Caffeine for extended headache relief. Sometimes you need an Advil and/or Aspirin depending on the pain. IANAD.
Aspirin Acetaminophen and Caffeine or AAC is very effective.
Cannabis can be used for instant relief, but it opens your veins, causing headaches or worsening your migraine.
Caffeine for extended headache relief. Sometimes you need an Advil and/or Aspirin depending on the pain. IANAD.
Aspirin Acetaminophen and Caffeine or AAC is very effective.
I can totally see ibuprofen helping against headaches as it is a very common painkiller. I just pointed out that it works differently than caffeine.
caffeine is both a vasoconstrictor and a vasodilator, over the course of a dose. dilation is the second and longer-acting effect, and acclimation to that is what causes the withdrawal headaches. other vasodilators should help if the mechanism is different, to prevent continuing dependency.
I had similar experience around the author's age, but I love my coffee too much. I decreased slowly over the years. First, not having coffee past 9, then 5, then 3, then noon. Now, I have two small cups in the morning, it does jolt me awake, and outside of the rare exception, that's all I get. Sometimes I forget my second cup. It's a missed opportunity on flavor, but I don't have withdrawal headaches.
same with me
It's always interesting for me to read posts like this by (former) caffeine addicts (soda anyone?). I'm so sensitive to the stuff that if I have a full cup of coffee in the morning, or a soda in the afternoon, I sleep poorly that night - so I have to avoid caffeine as much as possible.
Is this what normal people feel like when I tell them that I got addicted to a video game?
Is this what normal people feel like when I tell them that I got addicted to a video game?
I am the same way. I currently drink one can of Diet Coke per day (46mg) on days where I don't take Concerta and approximately one half can if I do. Anything more will cause me to feel very anxious and a bit sick to my stomach. And I mean _anything_ more, for example today I drank probably 55% of the can and felt pretty anxious in the afternoon.
Seeing this post makes me want to try to quit again and see how it goes. It is pretty rough being ADHD with such a sensitivity to stimulants.
What is even more weird is that in college and a few years after I would drink 200mg of caffeine every single day (2x Guru [1]) and felt fine. I am not sure if to what extent this is explained by being younger and being accustomed to being anxious at the time but it is definitely both.
[1] https://www.guruenergy.com/en-us/products/guru-organic-energ...
Seeing this post makes me want to try to quit again and see how it goes. It is pretty rough being ADHD with such a sensitivity to stimulants.
What is even more weird is that in college and a few years after I would drink 200mg of caffeine every single day (2x Guru [1]) and felt fine. I am not sure if to what extent this is explained by being younger and being accustomed to being anxious at the time but it is definitely both.
[1] https://www.guruenergy.com/en-us/products/guru-organic-energ...
I noticed how much caffeine was affecting me when I started getting way too sleepy at a certain new job after lunch. It was weird, because before I didn't really feel tired after eating unless I stuffed myself, but now I was really tired and sleepy and could barely function.
Turns out that this new job offered free coffee, so I was drinking one cup of coffee before commuting, another one when I arrived, and maybe one or two more later, but before lunch. The only reason I was sleepy was coffee: I was making my body dependent on caffeine to function normally in the morning, and I wasn't giving it coffee in the evening.
Luckily I caught it early and could quit without problems, but it was interesting to see how quickly your body builds a tolerance and makes you dependent on a drug. I back up the advice of the OP and I'd suggest to everyone who drinks coffee regularly to check themselves, because they might be addicted even without having those noticeable symptoms the OP talked about.
Turns out that this new job offered free coffee, so I was drinking one cup of coffee before commuting, another one when I arrived, and maybe one or two more later, but before lunch. The only reason I was sleepy was coffee: I was making my body dependent on caffeine to function normally in the morning, and I wasn't giving it coffee in the evening.
Luckily I caught it early and could quit without problems, but it was interesting to see how quickly your body builds a tolerance and makes you dependent on a drug. I back up the advice of the OP and I'd suggest to everyone who drinks coffee regularly to check themselves, because they might be addicted even without having those noticeable symptoms the OP talked about.
I quit about the same time the author did, I stopped back in July or Aug. I never really had jitters. I'd drink 1-2 10 cup carafes in a day along with my wife, I'd drink the bulk of it.
I decided to stop for two reasons: I sleep pretty crappy, and I was doing a bunch of other diet changes so I figured why not one more...
Everyone is different, but in my case switching to decaf was pretty easy. I had headaches a couple days, otherwise I honestly couldn't tell the difference. I didn't find mornings more of a struggle. But I also didn't find I slept better (confirmed by the fitbit sleep stats).
I read a few days ago that decaf coffee still has theobromine, which can also help focus.
Unlike the author, I like my coffee with cream most times, and the decaf I've switched to tastes just fine. I even found some instant decaf which I took on a camping trip shortly after stopping caffeine, which tastes pretty good. Mount Hagen, for reference.
I decided to stop for two reasons: I sleep pretty crappy, and I was doing a bunch of other diet changes so I figured why not one more...
Everyone is different, but in my case switching to decaf was pretty easy. I had headaches a couple days, otherwise I honestly couldn't tell the difference. I didn't find mornings more of a struggle. But I also didn't find I slept better (confirmed by the fitbit sleep stats).
I read a few days ago that decaf coffee still has theobromine, which can also help focus.
Unlike the author, I like my coffee with cream most times, and the decaf I've switched to tastes just fine. I even found some instant decaf which I took on a camping trip shortly after stopping caffeine, which tastes pretty good. Mount Hagen, for reference.
Just an anecdotal note. I also switched to decaf, but I found that even decaf had enough caffeine in it to impact my sleep. I didn't really notice any sleep improvements until I had cut out all sources of caffeine. YMMV of course, but if sleep is still an issue, might be worth a try. And just as a warning, I got worse withdrawal when I stopped the decaf then when I went from caf->decaf. That was very unexpected, but also might have been a sign that I was sensitive enough to even the small amount in decaf.
Curious, thanks for pointing that out. I mostly stop decaf at 3pm just like I did with caffeinated coffee previously, so hopefully that's not impacting my sleep.
I've lately been trying that sleep optimization thing posted here over the holidays the last couple weeks and feel like that's been helping. My fitbit is reporting pretty high sleep score for the last week, today was the first <80 in a week, and it was 79 so pretty close...
I've lately been trying that sleep optimization thing posted here over the holidays the last couple weeks and feel like that's been helping. My fitbit is reporting pretty high sleep score for the last week, today was the first <80 in a week, and it was 79 so pretty close...
> When I stand up, my heart skips another beat. Weird. This is getting annoying, I think to myself.
Wow, I can relate. Had some tests done because I was having so many palpitations I couldn't sleep. Multiple per hour. They became far worse whenever I shifted positions (standing -> laying down, vice versa). I've always had some infrequent palpitations, but those scared me. Tests, as usual, didn't catch anything. Only reason my doctor even saw something is that I managed to capture some with the Apple watch.
This was even during a break so it wasn't even work-related stress.
I was drinking a whole lot of caffeine (couple of big mugs) plus maybe 1L of Earl Gray tea.
I cut caffeine - palpitations got _worse_ (initially). Then they subsided. It's been one year. I even went back to some coffee again. There seems to be a threshold.
Wow, I can relate. Had some tests done because I was having so many palpitations I couldn't sleep. Multiple per hour. They became far worse whenever I shifted positions (standing -> laying down, vice versa). I've always had some infrequent palpitations, but those scared me. Tests, as usual, didn't catch anything. Only reason my doctor even saw something is that I managed to capture some with the Apple watch.
This was even during a break so it wasn't even work-related stress.
I was drinking a whole lot of caffeine (couple of big mugs) plus maybe 1L of Earl Gray tea.
I cut caffeine - palpitations got _worse_ (initially). Then they subsided. It's been one year. I even went back to some coffee again. There seems to be a threshold.
Same. I was having PVCs, which felt like skipped beats, but it's actually a premature contraction (that you sometimes can't feel) that occurs between beats, so there's a compensatory pause, so it feels like there was a skipped beat.
I was having 20,000 a day. I was consuming a shit ton of caffeine (like 600 mg a day), and I quit cold turkey once I noticed the insane PVCs. The PVCs did reduce in the following months, but I still ended up having an ablation to get rid of them.
Maybe if I would have waited longer they would have gone away completely, I don't know.
I was having 20,000 a day. I was consuming a shit ton of caffeine (like 600 mg a day), and I quit cold turkey once I noticed the insane PVCs. The PVCs did reduce in the following months, but I still ended up having an ablation to get rid of them.
Maybe if I would have waited longer they would have gone away completely, I don't know.
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This is word-for-word, event-for-event what I just went through. I also have the same decaf intolerance, now, as well as sensitivity to any caffeine. This after years without issues.
Uncanny. I still miss coffee, and the ‘life feeling duller’ thing is real. On the other hand, quieter mind, better sleep.
Uncanny. I still miss coffee, and the ‘life feeling duller’ thing is real. On the other hand, quieter mind, better sleep.
I use coffee (just Nescafe Azera) to kickstart me in the mornings, but I stop consuming at lunchtime. This limited window acts to keep some sort of lid on the quantities I consume, as well as hopefully leaving me un-caffeinated by bedtime.
I am currently trying to limit my caffeine intake by mixing increasing amounts of decaf beans into my regular coffee beans, as I do not wish to go through seeveral weeks with low mood, headaches and feeling tired. So far it's going beyond my expectations: I have tried to go decaf so many times in my life and has always relapsed because of the withdrawal symptoms. Slowly and gradually decreasing the daily caffeine intake seems to do the trick.
I would love to try the Rasa coffee alternative that the author is talking about, but I can't seem to find a reseller within the EU.
I would love to try the Rasa coffee alternative that the author is talking about, but I can't seem to find a reseller within the EU.
Their website lists their Amazon store for international customers: https://www.amazon.com/rasa
Maybe it's available for you there?
Maybe it's available for you there?
Thanks for the link. I don't think it's a solution, though: Stuff from amazon.com tend to get shipped from the outside of the EU, and as a minimum it will incur added VAT (+25%) and flat fee (around $25).
It would work if Rasa were available from, say, amazon.de, amazon.nl, etc., but, alas, it isn't — I already checked before I wrote my original comment.
Thansk for the suggestion, though. Perhaps it will be useful for other international customers.
It would work if Rasa were available from, say, amazon.de, amazon.nl, etc., but, alas, it isn't — I already checked before I wrote my original comment.
Thansk for the suggestion, though. Perhaps it will be useful for other international customers.
When I moved to University in Canada I was introduced to "Wake Ups" caffeine pills.
I am not a coffee drinker, but I liked to stay up late, and I had to go to class, so I decided to try these out, since at that age you feel like you are invulnerable.
These symptoms seem pretty consistent with some that I felt in extreme cases. I stopped taking them after a few attempts.
The positives of Caffeine were great though. I felt "on" like never before. Sharp, quick-witted, alert. I appreciate why some find it difficult to quit. Is there anything else that has a similar effect minus the downsides?
I am not a coffee drinker, but I liked to stay up late, and I had to go to class, so I decided to try these out, since at that age you feel like you are invulnerable.
These symptoms seem pretty consistent with some that I felt in extreme cases. I stopped taking them after a few attempts.
The positives of Caffeine were great though. I felt "on" like never before. Sharp, quick-witted, alert. I appreciate why some find it difficult to quit. Is there anything else that has a similar effect minus the downsides?
Any stimulant that brings you up is also going to make you crash down. And with repeated use, the highs get lower and the crashes come when you don't take it. There are ways to manage the comedown (such as tapering), but no ways to avoid it.
I'm curious if there are a lot of people like this that really feel some extreme effect from caffeine like this.
I've read articles about people drinking too much, too little, being addicted, or having withdrawal symptoms, but I never really experienced any of that during my coffee-life so far. I also don't often meet people that do, but sometimes when I do meet someone that has a really intense relationship with caffeine it does tell me that there must be something to it.
You'd think that if this is such a potent 'drug', it would affect everyone at last at some base level, and others even more. But in my variations of 1 to 8 cups each day, sometimes none for days, sometimes only espresso, sometimes only filter coffee it's never really done anything 'different'. Granted, the larger quantities of coffee were the crappy kind which probably never really got a good extraction anyway, but even 2 or 3 proper cups of filter coffee would have a caffeine content that should create the same symptoms or dependency I would think. But it doesn't (for me). I'm not really more less sleepy depending on the coffee quantity. I can sleep minutes after drinking coffee (if tired), yet not drinking coffee doesn't make it 'hard' to stay awake.
I've read articles about people drinking too much, too little, being addicted, or having withdrawal symptoms, but I never really experienced any of that during my coffee-life so far. I also don't often meet people that do, but sometimes when I do meet someone that has a really intense relationship with caffeine it does tell me that there must be something to it.
You'd think that if this is such a potent 'drug', it would affect everyone at last at some base level, and others even more. But in my variations of 1 to 8 cups each day, sometimes none for days, sometimes only espresso, sometimes only filter coffee it's never really done anything 'different'. Granted, the larger quantities of coffee were the crappy kind which probably never really got a good extraction anyway, but even 2 or 3 proper cups of filter coffee would have a caffeine content that should create the same symptoms or dependency I would think. But it doesn't (for me). I'm not really more less sleepy depending on the coffee quantity. I can sleep minutes after drinking coffee (if tired), yet not drinking coffee doesn't make it 'hard' to stay awake.
Actually we already know that people metabolize caffeine differently. https://pharmrev.aspetjournals.org/content/70/2/384 - but caffeine is also very transparent drug. You can use it for years without realizing the negative/positive impact it has on you. How long have you even quit caffeine for? Withdrawal effects tend to show up in 2 weeks or so for me. The anxiety that it causes for me isn't very acute either. It's more like just background anxiety.
I used and abused coffee for most of my twenties without ever realizing it had such an impact. Nowadays I just drink small cups of tea.
Also would like to point out: https://www.audible.com/pd/Caffeine-Audiobook/B083MVZ91Y is a pretty fun read. Not super scientific but interesting nonetheless.
I used and abused coffee for most of my twenties without ever realizing it had such an impact. Nowadays I just drink small cups of tea.
Also would like to point out: https://www.audible.com/pd/Caffeine-Audiobook/B083MVZ91Y is a pretty fun read. Not super scientific but interesting nonetheless.
I've had pauses of a few months when there wasn't any good coffee around; sometimes there wasn't even any decent tea (green/black). There was mediocre chocolate (supermarket stuff) but I don't think I ate a whole lot of that either (as a caffeinated-coffee replacement). Mostly happened when I was doing a weird combination of travel for work and not knowing where the good coffee spots were, coming back home after being away for two weeks to then move to a house I bought that was finally ready to move in to so another few weeks of having too much stuff packed away to make any coffee (and too busy to do it anyway). And then when the move was over, on vacation for a few weeks, again with no clue where to get coffee and all there is, is Starbucks, gas stops, and restaurant coffee (which more often than not is terrible anyway).
Maybe it does have an effect but being too busy to notice masked it?
I've had shorter pauses as well, broke a few bones in a sporting accident and didn't really feel like getting or making coffee, was very into ginger infusions, sometimes tamed with a bit of honey or lemon.
On one hand this makes me very curious to just not drink coffee for a few weeks and see if it does anything, on the other hand I pretty much stopped drinking sugary drinks years ago so that just leaves water and tea for me, and tea would have to be paused as well because I have a variety of teas where some have caffeine as well. Maybe if there was a good decaf around I'd just drink that as an experiment, but I haven't found one that doesn't taste weird yet.
That said, I'm not drinking all that much coffee (1 or 2 filters or 2 espressos or maybe one of each is about average), and sometimes I just forget to make some if I'm busy doing stuff.
Maybe it does have an effect but being too busy to notice masked it?
I've had shorter pauses as well, broke a few bones in a sporting accident and didn't really feel like getting or making coffee, was very into ginger infusions, sometimes tamed with a bit of honey or lemon.
On one hand this makes me very curious to just not drink coffee for a few weeks and see if it does anything, on the other hand I pretty much stopped drinking sugary drinks years ago so that just leaves water and tea for me, and tea would have to be paused as well because I have a variety of teas where some have caffeine as well. Maybe if there was a good decaf around I'd just drink that as an experiment, but I haven't found one that doesn't taste weird yet.
That said, I'm not drinking all that much coffee (1 or 2 filters or 2 espressos or maybe one of each is about average), and sometimes I just forget to make some if I'm busy doing stuff.
You and me both. Also my father and grandfather.
However, my wife has terrible headaches around 3pm if no caffeine has been ingested. So I suspect something different in our genetic makeup.
I do find that later in the evening if I'm started to feel tired coffee makes it a little easier to shrug off the sensation. Otherwise it doesn't have a grand effect. I tend to drink it because I like the ritual (and I'm already brewing for my wife).
I do find that later in the evening if I'm started to feel tired coffee makes it a little easier to shrug off the sensation. Otherwise it doesn't have a grand effect. I tend to drink it because I like the ritual (and I'm already brewing for my wife).
This comment could be written by me a year ago. Only when I drove my caffeine consumption to zero for a whole week (no coffee, no tea, no coke..) I had this massive headache. I am now back to one or two cups of coffee per day, which I enjoy much more.
I'd like to report an experiment I did for the last 12 days; I drank no coffee or tea with caffeine (only rooibos, water and isotone sports drink), didn't notice much except if I smelled coffee I'd feel like "I would enjoy some of that".
Today just had my first cup again, tasted great and no noticeable change then either. I wasn't sure if maybe I'd taken the wrong beans and I had wanted to try a new Ethiopian bean for a different taste and no change then either (well, except maybe that after two cups over 6 hours I didn't really feel like another one).
Maybe I just got lucky (genetically) or it takes a bit more time to feel significant effects.
Today just had my first cup again, tasted great and no noticeable change then either. I wasn't sure if maybe I'd taken the wrong beans and I had wanted to try a new Ethiopian bean for a different taste and no change then either (well, except maybe that after two cups over 6 hours I didn't really feel like another one).
Maybe I just got lucky (genetically) or it takes a bit more time to feel significant effects.
As you get older you find you can't quite handle things the same as before.
I take 48 hours off of caffeine each week, and limit my daily dose on the days I make use of it. Perhaps one day I'll quit entirely. I can definitely feel it when I overdo caffeine in a single day. (Usually in the form of tea - I'm not much of a coffee drinker.)
Good luck and godspeed. If anyone else is worried about their general level of anxiety and/or caffeine intake I'm happy to answer questions.
I take 48 hours off of caffeine each week, and limit my daily dose on the days I make use of it. Perhaps one day I'll quit entirely. I can definitely feel it when I overdo caffeine in a single day. (Usually in the form of tea - I'm not much of a coffee drinker.)
Good luck and godspeed. If anyone else is worried about their general level of anxiety and/or caffeine intake I'm happy to answer questions.
I'm one of those people who stopped taking 5-6 Espressos a day (an average amount for a Portuguese person, given that we imported Cimbalino machines from Italy a few decades ago and just couldn't kick the habit nationally).
I did that for around 20 years (with occasional breaks), then progressively petered out to 2-3 cups a day and, last year, I finally removed the last Espresso (the breakfast one) from my diet.
I switched to one cup of black tea in the morning (I'm partial to Earl Grey) and one or two mugs of barley 'coffee' a day (in Winter time, typically zero in Summer) and lots of water. I will occasionally have non-black tea during the Winter time as well - mostly mint and ginger.
Now drinking a can of diet Coke (which I typically do in two doses, whenever I feel like I'm struggling through the day) gives me a good enough buzz, and I _know_ coffee will work if I need to stay up late (which I usually don't anymore).
But, in general, ditching coffee improved my well-being a _lot_. I sleep better, I don't have (the same kind of) headaches, and I don't push myself beyond what my body can take and spend 2-3 days recovering from a particularly intense day.
I do miss the flavor and enjoy a hot beverage (hence the barley), but I don't miss the stress it induced, or the crutch it was.
I did that for around 20 years (with occasional breaks), then progressively petered out to 2-3 cups a day and, last year, I finally removed the last Espresso (the breakfast one) from my diet.
I switched to one cup of black tea in the morning (I'm partial to Earl Grey) and one or two mugs of barley 'coffee' a day (in Winter time, typically zero in Summer) and lots of water. I will occasionally have non-black tea during the Winter time as well - mostly mint and ginger.
Now drinking a can of diet Coke (which I typically do in two doses, whenever I feel like I'm struggling through the day) gives me a good enough buzz, and I _know_ coffee will work if I need to stay up late (which I usually don't anymore).
But, in general, ditching coffee improved my well-being a _lot_. I sleep better, I don't have (the same kind of) headaches, and I don't push myself beyond what my body can take and spend 2-3 days recovering from a particularly intense day.
I do miss the flavor and enjoy a hot beverage (hence the barley), but I don't miss the stress it induced, or the crutch it was.
I would think diet Coke to be much worse than coffee, am I wrong?
It has much less caffeine.
More to the point, it has much less monoamine oxidase inhibitors.
Congratulations, @ezekg and keep it going! I recently went 1 year without it (though technically I did have chocolate a few times: https://encapsulate.me/writing/2021.html) and will continue off it.
A few things I found helpful in my transition off it: - Panax Ginseng tea - Macca root - Regular weight lifting exercises - Regular good night of sleep
Thanks for sharing!
A few things I found helpful in my transition off it: - Panax Ginseng tea - Macca root - Regular weight lifting exercises - Regular good night of sleep
Thanks for sharing!
I've definitely noticed a change in how my body handles caffeine now that I'm in my mid 30s. Less euphoria, more heart-pounding-through-my-chest. I still love the taste, though, and the routine of making pourovers/aeropresses/etc.
One thing that's really helped me is to always have decaf as easily accessible as regular. It helps me separate the caffeine dosage from all of the other things I love about coffee.
One thing that's really helped me is to always have decaf as easily accessible as regular. It helps me separate the caffeine dosage from all of the other things I love about coffee.
You can get bean-to-cup machine and mix 50/50 or even 70/30 decaf and normal beans - it works very well (look at quality of decaf, make sure it's water or co2-decafinated not chemically-decafinated). Also as I said above L-Theanin works very, very well with coffee to relieve unwanted symptoms.
I do one reasonably weak cup with lots of creamer first thing in the morning with breakfast. Then, on a normal day, I have mostly water. This solves two problems for me: (1) by the end of my typical day, enough caffeine has flushed back out of my system that I have no issues falling asleep, but also (b) I'm maintaining a tolerance, so if I'm out with friends I can have a glass of whatever and not totally wreck my system doing so.
I've considered ditching the coffee entirely; it's mostly the routine I enjoy, and I could probably replace it with an herbal tea. My system on an actual energy drink is just as jittery and anxious as the author describes. But for now, keeping my intake low seems okay.
The biggest surprise for me was really switching to plain water as my beverage of choice. Growing up on sugary beverages I craved them something fierce; now I actually crave water, and enjoy the taste. The only downside is that at restaurants, the servers will swing by and refill an ordered soda (or tea) endlessly, and they get this funny look if I try to explain that "no really, just one is enough."
I've considered ditching the coffee entirely; it's mostly the routine I enjoy, and I could probably replace it with an herbal tea. My system on an actual energy drink is just as jittery and anxious as the author describes. But for now, keeping my intake low seems okay.
The biggest surprise for me was really switching to plain water as my beverage of choice. Growing up on sugary beverages I craved them something fierce; now I actually crave water, and enjoy the taste. The only downside is that at restaurants, the servers will swing by and refill an ordered soda (or tea) endlessly, and they get this funny look if I try to explain that "no really, just one is enough."
Personal anecdote. I work, study, and lift heavy (for me). I sleep 7-8. This is not enough. I started drinking Monsters (energy drinks).
Was twitchy, sweated a lot, got sick easier, slept worse, and got worse results at the gym. It works great for a day, and then you crash hard, it's also addictive. Spikes blood pressure. Another poster reminded me about the headaches, which I normally NEVER have. I am under the impression that its worse than drugs (dont do drugs, so can't tell). Affects are very, very strong.
Solution is to lift lighter and sleep MORE than 8 hours. I still don't believe all the successful people (eg Schwarzenegger) who claim to sleep less than 8, especially athletes. I still drink a bunch of caffeinated black tea, but it's not even close to coffee/energy drinks.
No point to this other than "Don't drink energy drinks, they are probably worse than coke".
Last note - the military studied caffeine pills since they control ideally for dose. Maybe something to consider not to stain teeth and standardize if you HAVE to have your coffee.
Was twitchy, sweated a lot, got sick easier, slept worse, and got worse results at the gym. It works great for a day, and then you crash hard, it's also addictive. Spikes blood pressure. Another poster reminded me about the headaches, which I normally NEVER have. I am under the impression that its worse than drugs (dont do drugs, so can't tell). Affects are very, very strong.
Solution is to lift lighter and sleep MORE than 8 hours. I still don't believe all the successful people (eg Schwarzenegger) who claim to sleep less than 8, especially athletes. I still drink a bunch of caffeinated black tea, but it's not even close to coffee/energy drinks.
No point to this other than "Don't drink energy drinks, they are probably worse than coke".
Last note - the military studied caffeine pills since they control ideally for dose. Maybe something to consider not to stain teeth and standardize if you HAVE to have your coffee.
Caffeine is the hardest drug to quit.
Takes two weeks of miserable migraines.
You can lapse at any time later just indulging in one craving.
It just takes one bad morning to break it.
Takes two weeks of miserable migraines.
You can lapse at any time later just indulging in one craving.
It just takes one bad morning to break it.
> You can lapse at any time later just indulging in one craving.
This rings very true. I tried coffee one time after quitting and the withdrawal migraines came back the next day like I was back in the thick of it.
I haven't had caffeine since then.
This rings very true. I tried coffee one time after quitting and the withdrawal migraines came back the next day like I was back in the thick of it.
I haven't had caffeine since then.
Does tea or soda give you the migraines as well? Or just coffee?
They do, to an extent (though I very rarely drink coke). I tried a chai-based and cocao-based coffee alternative which had slightly more caffeine than decaf coffee, and it still gave me the same symptoms after a second cup. I guess my body just metabolizes caffeine differently than it did.
I know you were just exaggerating for effect, but obviously a lot of illicit drugs (and not so illicit depending on the person: alcohol) are a lot harder to quit for various reasons.
Not really, I've done a lot of hard drugs, except heroin/opioids/benzos, and I'd say caffeine is the hardest to quit. Literally been on a 3 day binger awake and couldn't figure out why my head hurt, thought it was food, water, oh
no whoops it was a caffeine withdrawal.
Everything else I can do on and off, some things it's been years, caffeine I've only quit once. Lapsed and haven't been able to again.
Everything else I can do on and off, some things it's been years, caffeine I've only quit once. Lapsed and haven't been able to again.
I was specifically thinking of heroin and friends which can have massive withdrawal symptoms and need plenty of external support to overcome. “all illicit” is too big an umbrella I agree. Change that to “some” instead “a lot”.
Certainly, benzos and opioids are very addictive and the feedback cycle isn't your friend so you don't fuck with em.
That's not saying much about caffeine though, being slightly less addictive than heroin is not a high bar.
Compared to any other stimulants though, caffeine is the most addictive, with the worst withdraw, in my experience.
That's not saying much about caffeine though, being slightly less addictive than heroin is not a high bar.
Compared to any other stimulants though, caffeine is the most addictive, with the worst withdraw, in my experience.
going cold turkey off benzos can literally kill you
A small amount of caffeine has been enough to keep the withdrawal headaches from occurring for me.
When I've stopped in the past, I usually take one diet soda I don't especially enjoy (like a Diet Pepsi) and drink a quarter of a can a day in the morning.
As you might surprise I've never attempted to quit caffeine permanently, just to reduce my consumption or to stop for a few months. It is indeed an easy habit to start back on.
When I've stopped in the past, I usually take one diet soda I don't especially enjoy (like a Diet Pepsi) and drink a quarter of a can a day in the morning.
As you might surprise I've never attempted to quit caffeine permanently, just to reduce my consumption or to stop for a few months. It is indeed an easy habit to start back on.
I do the same, but wait until the headache starts, rather than anticipating it, to drink something caffeinated. I've found this helps me quit faster, and a 10-minute headache isn't insufferable (a single caffeinated beverage usually ends the headache quickly for me). I've never needed more than 2-3 days to get passed that part.
But, like you, I've never tried to totally quit. I "test" myself by usually abstaining from caffeine on the weekends. If I get even a slight headache, then it's time to cut back.
But, like you, I've never tried to totally quit. I "test" myself by usually abstaining from caffeine on the weekends. If I get even a slight headache, then it's time to cut back.
That seems pretty excessive. Whenever I've gone off caffeine, it's only taken 2 days of light headaches. Am I an outlier here?
Two days for me, for energy drinks, which are worse than coffee. I think they just overclock your CNS, so you are wasted the next day, and maybe the day after. Then I am fine if I sleep enough.
I successfully reduced caffeine to zero a few times before (usually after reading posts like this). I didn't quit cold turkey though, I gradually tapered it off over couple of weeks. No withdrawal effects at all.
If you consider caffeine very addictive, use techniques developed for fight addiction to addictive drugs like benzos.
If you consider caffeine very addictive, use techniques developed for fight addiction to addictive drugs like benzos.
> Caffeine is the hardest drug to quit.
I kept giggling for a few minutes so much that I got back here to thank you for that.
I kept giggling for a few minutes so much that I got back here to thank you for that.
When I quit, I tapered down at the rate of 5oz a week and never experienced headaches.
I agree
but you can alllways find replacement like tea
That's what I did. One cup of green tea a day.
Meta comment: 7 hours in on the post, and the first 25 comments on a posting about giving up an addiction are by folks saying how the “drug” is actually great and even better if you get the right stuff. You have to get past those comments to get a few comments about how someone also had a positive experience quitting, then a post about a “contrarian” supporting the drug again.
Don’t know how to interpret this: defensiveness by addicts, “Big Coffee” trying to do damage control, etc.. I know what I would think if this was about quitting a fentanyl addiction…
The 3-4 times a month I drink coffee (and I do drink the good stuff without obsessing), I make it at home almost as a psychological diagnostic. If it makes me sleepy, then I know things are just fine body-mind wise. If it charges me up, then I’m under more stress than I’d like (as a baseline). OK if I’ve got some early morning physical work to do, not OK otherwise.
Don’t know how to interpret this: defensiveness by addicts, “Big Coffee” trying to do damage control, etc.. I know what I would think if this was about quitting a fentanyl addiction…
The 3-4 times a month I drink coffee (and I do drink the good stuff without obsessing), I make it at home almost as a psychological diagnostic. If it makes me sleepy, then I know things are just fine body-mind wise. If it charges me up, then I’m under more stress than I’d like (as a baseline). OK if I’ve got some early morning physical work to do, not OK otherwise.
Well there is L-theanine[0] which I always found was the opposite of caffeine, and when you combine it with caffeine (500mg theanine & 200mg caffeine), you get a sort of flow state without the jitters of caffeine.
L-theanine takes the edge off caffeine. You could also just try L-theanine on its own.
This person needs to experiment with other nootropics besides caffeine. I've tried various stacks over the years like Alpha Brain, Mindlab Pro and a few others. They've been instrumental in getting shit done on a tight schedule, and I don't get that jittery 'wired' feeling you get taking plain caffeine supps on their own, just a mild flowy state (thanks to the L-theanine).
[0] https://draxe.com/nutrition/l-theanine/
L-theanine takes the edge off caffeine. You could also just try L-theanine on its own.
This person needs to experiment with other nootropics besides caffeine. I've tried various stacks over the years like Alpha Brain, Mindlab Pro and a few others. They've been instrumental in getting shit done on a tight schedule, and I don't get that jittery 'wired' feeling you get taking plain caffeine supps on their own, just a mild flowy state (thanks to the L-theanine).
[0] https://draxe.com/nutrition/l-theanine/
Green tea will give you L-theanine and caffeine in a natural way.
But at an unknown dose that varies depending on where you buy the tea from, the batch they currently use, etc.
I quit coffee and tea 7 years ago. I loved the taste of black coffee but I had trouble sleeping and didn't love the idea of being addicted to anything. Weeks of headaches but I came out just fine. Sometimes I wonder if being addicted all my teenage years made my brain somewhat dependent on it, and if that has led to an off-caffeine lower IQ or something, that's a fun rabbit hole to go down.
7 years on it still tempts me, but not like seeing somebody enjoy a cigarette does. I work rotations and have 15 hour days frequently, I don't go for a coffee when tired and just deal with it. Stressful and engaging work is enough to keep me perky.
Good luck to anyone who tries quitting. Try timing it at a time when you can afford to be less productive/sharp if you can. If not, just deal with it.
7 years on it still tempts me, but not like seeing somebody enjoy a cigarette does. I work rotations and have 15 hour days frequently, I don't go for a coffee when tired and just deal with it. Stressful and engaging work is enough to keep me perky.
Good luck to anyone who tries quitting. Try timing it at a time when you can afford to be less productive/sharp if you can. If not, just deal with it.
"My heart skips a beat. It's been happening more frequently, so I look it up and they're apparently called "palpitations." I ignore it. It's 9am. I'm anxious. Nothing out of the norm, though.[...] But even having more than one cup of decaf brings on the shakes and skipped beats. The caffeine microdosing adds up, I guess."
If you feel permanently anxious in the morning to the point that it's perceived as normal it might not be the caffeine that's the issue, and a few cups of decaf have so little caffeine it should not give you any physical symptoms. (a few cups of decaf contain about as much caffeine as a few pieces of chocolate). Might be worth checking out if there's some other reason for it.
If you feel permanently anxious in the morning to the point that it's perceived as normal it might not be the caffeine that's the issue, and a few cups of decaf have so little caffeine it should not give you any physical symptoms. (a few cups of decaf contain about as much caffeine as a few pieces of chocolate). Might be worth checking out if there's some other reason for it.
This stood out to me, too. There are other things that can cause similar heart palpitations, like stress, cannabis (in some), and actual cardiovascular problems.
I don’t know why but I never ever miss caffeine and I can drink coffee any time, even before bed, without any kind of effect.
I hate the taste of most coffee, but great coffee, which is well and lightly roasted and grinded the right way with a good machine gives an amazing taste. Of that coffee, expresso, I can drink any kind of amount, any time of the day without any kind of repercussion or addiction. Sometimes I stop drinking coffee for months and I can go back to coffee for the taste only. When I stop I just drink water instead.
So what kind of coffee are we talking about here ? Because I never ever felt any kind of addiction and I’m genuinely wondering how that is possible to be addicted
So what kind of coffee are we talking about here ? Because I never ever felt any kind of addiction and I’m genuinely wondering how that is possible to be addicted
Happens to me as well. Stress and caffeine = heart on a roller coaster. At that point I'll usually back down to 1 cup in the morning. But, alas, I eventually work my way back up to, ahem, never mind how many cups and start the cycle over.
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I don't want to quit coffee. I like it in my life. Especially the behavioural aspect of having a 'coffee making ritual' when I need a break at work. That and the fact I really enjoy coffee shops.
But I did feel the need to quite _caffeine_.
I found a wonderful shop which sells a nice range of decaffeinated coffee beans (any other brand I tried tasted like crap), and now I just do a half-half grind in the morning, and stick to a full decaf grind any other time I want to have a nice coffee break.
As for coffee shops, I go, but it's a treat rather than a daily need. Therefore I think the extra caffeine from that is ok.
But I did feel the need to quite _caffeine_.
I found a wonderful shop which sells a nice range of decaffeinated coffee beans (any other brand I tried tasted like crap), and now I just do a half-half grind in the morning, and stick to a full decaf grind any other time I want to have a nice coffee break.
As for coffee shops, I go, but it's a treat rather than a daily need. Therefore I think the extra caffeine from that is ok.
It's interesting that caffeine is showing up in all sorts of things now.
you can buy panadol (headache tablets) with caffeine added now... protein bars with guarana (caffeine) etc etc.
about 20 years back I had what the doctors called a vasovagal fit. I was working long hours, drinking a LOT of caffeine loaded drinks (soda and coffee etc) and eating poorly.
It took weeks to recover and ever since then I've been watching my dependency on it. every now and again i go full cold turkey and cut any intake for a month or two then slowly get back into it.
I only drink Tea now as well, which helps. its a slower more cumbersome process to make it.
you can buy panadol (headache tablets) with caffeine added now... protein bars with guarana (caffeine) etc etc.
about 20 years back I had what the doctors called a vasovagal fit. I was working long hours, drinking a LOT of caffeine loaded drinks (soda and coffee etc) and eating poorly.
It took weeks to recover and ever since then I've been watching my dependency on it. every now and again i go full cold turkey and cut any intake for a month or two then slowly get back into it.
I only drink Tea now as well, which helps. its a slower more cumbersome process to make it.
I tried quiting caffeine and excess sugar (Obscene amounts of sugary drinks is my vice, not coffee) and it was even worse!
I've been completely dysfunctional for weeks, and first week I basically slept through, i.e sleep for 15 hours, wake up for an hour or so and head back to sleep.
I couldn't get off sugar completely (or get it to healthy numbers), because my brain just wouldn't function without a hit, but I reduced my intake considerably since then (5x).
I stopped ordering Coke in crates for one :shrug:, still hopeful to find solution to this while my insulin levels are normal and it's not too late.
I've been completely dysfunctional for weeks, and first week I basically slept through, i.e sleep for 15 hours, wake up for an hour or so and head back to sleep.
I couldn't get off sugar completely (or get it to healthy numbers), because my brain just wouldn't function without a hit, but I reduced my intake considerably since then (5x).
I stopped ordering Coke in crates for one :shrug:, still hopeful to find solution to this while my insulin levels are normal and it's not too late.
I haven't quite quit caffeine, but I have quit drinking hot coffee. It was necessary. In the end I was bringing two cups of coffee into meeting rooms for meetings lasting 30 minutes. It was bad.
Instead I binge on sugar free caffeinated fizzy drinks. I consume a lot less caffeine. I tried many times to quit but I just can't. Writing this I admit that I do have a problem, that I shamefully should do something about - but I am weak, and powerless - might be linked to my slight depression because of my current job situation. But then again, there is always an excuse.
Instead I binge on sugar free caffeinated fizzy drinks. I consume a lot less caffeine. I tried many times to quit but I just can't. Writing this I admit that I do have a problem, that I shamefully should do something about - but I am weak, and powerless - might be linked to my slight depression because of my current job situation. But then again, there is always an excuse.
I was never encouraged into drinking coffee in the first place. Could never figure out why people liked the taste of it. I mean, Caffeine - yes, I drank a lot of Cola when I was young, but coffee is definitely an acquired taste.
Anyway, when I was about... 20 years old, I think, I decided to quite Caffeine. I went "cold-turkey", and it was actually really hard not buying my fix of Cola at the supermarket! I stuck with it though, and switched to (somewhat watered-down) cherry juice. The taste was strong enough to distract me from thinking about Cola :-)
Anyway, when I was about... 20 years old, I think, I decided to quite Caffeine. I went "cold-turkey", and it was actually really hard not buying my fix of Cola at the supermarket! I stuck with it though, and switched to (somewhat watered-down) cherry juice. The taste was strong enough to distract me from thinking about Cola :-)
Caffeine is delivered quite differently based on the brewing method. I find that 4 or more shots of espresso a day will lead to an eye twitch, while one or two cups of Philz deliver the caffeine far more smoothly.
French press seems to be somewhere in between, the extraction is different than pour over. Philz's extraction time is even shorter than a regular pour over. They use a lot more beans than Blue Bottle but the water flows through the grounds much quicker.
If you can't go cold turkey, try avoiding espresso and French press and the jittery feeling might subside.
French press seems to be somewhere in between, the extraction is different than pour over. Philz's extraction time is even shorter than a regular pour over. They use a lot more beans than Blue Bottle but the water flows through the grounds much quicker.
If you can't go cold turkey, try avoiding espresso and French press and the jittery feeling might subside.
This has very little to do with extraction and everything to do with temperature and time (pyrolysis) and the subsequent formation of various monoamine oxidase enzyme inhibiting heterocyclic aromatic amines from protein amino acids.
Amphetamine is so much better. And I know that people claim it's addictive but I haven't used it in a month and don't really feel an urge. I usually just use it when I want immense task focus but I get pretty good focus manually myself now that I remember the amphetamined feeling.
I got into caffeine about six months ago and after the first week I got a headache when I woke up so I quit it because that's not okay.
I recently restarted with a drink of coffee about thrice a week (irregularly) and have found that I get no withdrawal when I stop on this cycle.
I got into caffeine about six months ago and after the first week I got a headache when I woke up so I quit it because that's not okay.
I recently restarted with a drink of coffee about thrice a week (irregularly) and have found that I get no withdrawal when I stop on this cycle.
I stopped drinking coffee 20 years ago. Mainly because I suffered a lot from IBS (Irritable Bowel Syndrome). After I stopped drinking coffee that quickly improved. And an added benefit was that I finally understood what sleeping and waking up properly really meant. What a difference! Later I worked hard to learn how to deal with stress. That further improved my IBS. My health has improved enormously. And still, after all these years, small amounts of caffeine, think chocolate, black of non-herbal tea, cola, etc., have an immediate effect.
I haven't quit, but I have cut down by about half - replaced my regular strong instant coffee with 'mild', which was a very noticeable drop off.
After getting over the hump, I noticed I would fall asleep much, much more easily. It was great. However recently I've started doing 18:6 intermittent fasting, from 9:30-14:30. I've noticed it keeps me up a lot longer. Weird side effect I did not envision.
Anyway, would be keen to replace my mild with decaf at some point. I'm not a big fan of tea. Or starting the day with a water.
After getting over the hump, I noticed I would fall asleep much, much more easily. It was great. However recently I've started doing 18:6 intermittent fasting, from 9:30-14:30. I've noticed it keeps me up a lot longer. Weird side effect I did not envision.
Anyway, would be keen to replace my mild with decaf at some point. I'm not a big fan of tea. Or starting the day with a water.
I've quit caffeine more than once.
Probably the worst time went like this: in addition to the headaches, my entire body was overcome by a muscular weakness, and this lasted almost two weeks.
About three days into it, I went for a simple little four mile run. I was in good running shape at the time. Because of how I was starting to feel, I took it easy. Yet, the next day, every muscle hurt in my body. Arms, legs, abdominals, back. It was as if a completely unfit, untrained, unaccustomed body had been made to race the distance.
The soreness took days to dissipate.
Probably the worst time went like this: in addition to the headaches, my entire body was overcome by a muscular weakness, and this lasted almost two weeks.
About three days into it, I went for a simple little four mile run. I was in good running shape at the time. Because of how I was starting to feel, I took it easy. Yet, the next day, every muscle hurt in my body. Arms, legs, abdominals, back. It was as if a completely unfit, untrained, unaccustomed body had been made to race the distance.
The soreness took days to dissipate.
Stories like this make me reconsider making that second cup later on in the day. It's just that it's so hard to let yourself be tired when the solution is so easily accessible.
I find that making a french press or V60 encourages me to make a lot more coffee just because I can, so I've since switched to the aeropress. People often state they wish it made more coffee, but it's been a nice way for me to limit caffeine consumption without feeling like I'm really restricting myself.
I find that making a french press or V60 encourages me to make a lot more coffee just because I can, so I've since switched to the aeropress. People often state they wish it made more coffee, but it's been a nice way for me to limit caffeine consumption without feeling like I'm really restricting myself.
I’ve tried quitting caffeine in the past, but the problem I run into is that I’m actually not a coffee drinker, but a Diet Coke drinker. I don’t enjoy the taste of plain water. So at a restaurant/drive thru/etc, my options are diet soda (with 0 calories) or something caffeine-free with hundreds of calories. When you’re trying to budget calories, that hurts a lot.
At least I’ve been able to reduce my overall consumption of caffeine a bit, but I haven’t been able to cut it out completely.
At least I’ve been able to reduce my overall consumption of caffeine a bit, but I haven’t been able to cut it out completely.
Zero-sugar, zero-caffeine sodas seem to be slowly rising in popularity recently. I'm hopeful that we'll start to see them more often as options in restaurants, because like you said, it's frustrating when I go to a restaurant and must choose between drinking massive amounts of sugar, or drinking caffeine. Usually, even though I'd like to order soda, I end up ordering water because I struggle to justify either stimulant to myself internally.
I would love for more places to serve things like Bubly/La Croix/etc or Fresca, both of which I enjoy at home but rarely out and about.
I did something similar years ago but for different reasons: I suffered from Migraine headaches since age 17, am intolerant to the most effective medications for alleviating the pain and found that caffeine was one of the few things that could reduce the pain I experienced.
At age 17, I had a trip to the ER thinking I was dying -- worst headache of my life up to that point. It subsided during my stay and several tests later, any major problems were ruled out. I was not a regular caffeine drinker at that time, and caffeine has never caused Migraine headaches[0] for me. Over a few years of early mornings/jobs, I started drinking coffee regularly to be sharp/awake and experienced many of the same problems as the author. The biggest problem, though, was that I had become tolerant to the most effective medication (for me) to eliminate my headaches.
I would not advise quitting cold turkey. It sucks. The headaches are intense, but not Migraine[0]. After doing that for a few days, I took a different approach -- to replace my coffee consumption with decaffeinated coffee. At the time (I'm not sure if this is still true), decaffeinated did not mean caffeine free. It had just enough to ween me off of caffeine, while keeping my routine the same for a month. The dull headaches were manageable with a single Ibuprofen when they were the worst, but often required nothing at all. At the end of a month, the beans sat unused.
I treated caffeine as a medication from that point forward. I kept a container of beans in the freezer and would brew up a cup of coffee any time Migraine reared its ugly head. It took about a cup and my symptoms would be reduced -- sometimes remaining there until the headache passed. I've since found a prescription which prevents Migraine entirely, for me and have resumed coffee drinking, but limit it to a single cup a day and not daily -- just when I'm feeling "dull", mentally. But I have to be careful -- the jitters are very strong after the second cup and end up turning that sharpness into anxiety at times.
[0] I think people misstate a "bad headache" as a Migraine headache. I get different kinds of headaches, Migraine is very distinct to me, including auras and other symptoms that otherwise awful headaches do not. They also barely respond to common OTC medications, so I don't bother with them when I know it's a migraine.
At age 17, I had a trip to the ER thinking I was dying -- worst headache of my life up to that point. It subsided during my stay and several tests later, any major problems were ruled out. I was not a regular caffeine drinker at that time, and caffeine has never caused Migraine headaches[0] for me. Over a few years of early mornings/jobs, I started drinking coffee regularly to be sharp/awake and experienced many of the same problems as the author. The biggest problem, though, was that I had become tolerant to the most effective medication (for me) to eliminate my headaches.
I would not advise quitting cold turkey. It sucks. The headaches are intense, but not Migraine[0]. After doing that for a few days, I took a different approach -- to replace my coffee consumption with decaffeinated coffee. At the time (I'm not sure if this is still true), decaffeinated did not mean caffeine free. It had just enough to ween me off of caffeine, while keeping my routine the same for a month. The dull headaches were manageable with a single Ibuprofen when they were the worst, but often required nothing at all. At the end of a month, the beans sat unused.
I treated caffeine as a medication from that point forward. I kept a container of beans in the freezer and would brew up a cup of coffee any time Migraine reared its ugly head. It took about a cup and my symptoms would be reduced -- sometimes remaining there until the headache passed. I've since found a prescription which prevents Migraine entirely, for me and have resumed coffee drinking, but limit it to a single cup a day and not daily -- just when I'm feeling "dull", mentally. But I have to be careful -- the jitters are very strong after the second cup and end up turning that sharpness into anxiety at times.
[0] I think people misstate a "bad headache" as a Migraine headache. I get different kinds of headaches, Migraine is very distinct to me, including auras and other symptoms that otherwise awful headaches do not. They also barely respond to common OTC medications, so I don't bother with them when I know it's a migraine.
> But even having more than one cup of decaf brings on the shakes and skipped beats. The caffeine microdosing adds up, I guess.
You may have a problem other than a caffeine addiction. Cutting out caffeine may be the easiest/cheapest way to address it, but it is not normal or healthy for a few mg of caffeine to give you jitters or affect your heartbeat.
I'd talk to a cardiologist to make sure you're not just hiding the symptoms of a life-threatening problem.
You may have a problem other than a caffeine addiction. Cutting out caffeine may be the easiest/cheapest way to address it, but it is not normal or healthy for a few mg of caffeine to give you jitters or affect your heartbeat.
I'd talk to a cardiologist to make sure you're not just hiding the symptoms of a life-threatening problem.
I realized caffeine was making my migraines worse. I always thought it was helping my headaches and migraines better, and it was, for around 1 to 1,5h. Then, it made me miserable, and I never realised, until I took long-enough PTO, and decided to try and cold-turkey quit.
I love coffee and I'd love to go back to drinking it, but I don't think I can. If you get frequent headaches/migraines, try cutting back on caffeine. You might be surprised.
I love coffee and I'd love to go back to drinking it, but I don't think I can. If you get frequent headaches/migraines, try cutting back on caffeine. You might be surprised.
Vietnamese iced coffee (cafe sua da) is my favorite.
I use a $4 single-cup coffee brewer (from a local Chinese vendor) and "Cafe du Monde" coffee (orange can) which has chicory. Add the brew to a few teaspoons of "La Lechera" sweetened condensed milk under a cup of ice.
https://steamykitchen.com/492-vietnamese-iced-coffee.html
I use a $4 single-cup coffee brewer (from a local Chinese vendor) and "Cafe du Monde" coffee (orange can) which has chicory. Add the brew to a few teaspoons of "La Lechera" sweetened condensed milk under a cup of ice.
https://steamykitchen.com/492-vietnamese-iced-coffee.html
I think that there can be a significant difference between every batch of coffee.
Both the origin and conditions of the specific land where coffee grows matters in my opinion. People often imagine this as a factor that only changes flavor.
I suspect the soil and the ecosystem (e.g. nearby plants, rivers) can trigger such negative effects even for an individual who's not sensitive to caffeine and consuming in moderation.
Almost exactly the same story here. 6-8+ cups a day, cold turkey with no replacements. Two weeks of misery and headaches and a beautiful new beginning. I drink one decaf or mate a day from time to time now. And I drool like a bloody St. Bernard when I pass by a coffee stand where they serve the real stuff. So I am still a coffee junkie, my body is no longer addicted but my mind is. But it was definitely worth it to quit.
I used to take a large number of black coffee throughout the day. Otherwise just feel tired even though I am fully rested.
Recently started experimenting with nootropics as a replacement for coffee. Started L-theanine + caffeine capsules. Surprisingly, feel attentive throughout the day and better sleep at night too. Workout is better as well. Don’t know how long these effects will last. But for now, I have quit coffee for good.
Recently started experimenting with nootropics as a replacement for coffee. Started L-theanine + caffeine capsules. Surprisingly, feel attentive throughout the day and better sleep at night too. Workout is better as well. Don’t know how long these effects will last. But for now, I have quit coffee for good.
I quit successfully several different times. The key to avoiding all the withdrawal symptoms is drinking a lot of water IMO.
I’ve just reduced intake at this point though.
I’ve just reduced intake at this point though.
> I quit successfully several different times.
This phrase... I'm struggling to interpret it in a way that doesn't mean exactly the opposite of what you were trying to say.
It's a good one to use in a joke.
This phrase... I'm struggling to interpret it in a way that doesn't mean exactly the opposite of what you were trying to say.
It's a good one to use in a joke.
Kinda the point. :)
I quit for a period of several months many times though. Got past the withdrawal and was generally fine without it. It’s easy to let it creep back in and hard to avoid it all the time.
Now I just drink half-caffeine coffee in the morning and cut out soft drinks.
I quit for a period of several months many times though. Got past the withdrawal and was generally fine without it. It’s easy to let it creep back in and hard to avoid it all the time.
Now I just drink half-caffeine coffee in the morning and cut out soft drinks.
I quit it 6 mo ago. My random muscles stopped trembling after 3 moths, and they did it for 10 years.
Now when I drink one, the day passes and one starts trembling again.
Now when I drink one, the day passes and one starts trembling again.
I quit my 3+ cups/day habit and my health (in particular my sleep) improved dramatically. I drank close to zero caffeine for a couple years before reintroducing one cup of joe in the early mornings. I definitely experienced drawbacks to overdoing it, but a single cup of coffee doesn't seem to cause problems, and helps me get going faster in the morning, especially during the dark winter months.
I was never really into coffee, but I think it's probably good if you keep it around a cup per day. A small enough amount that you can skip a day without a problem, or have an extra cup when you need it and it will be effective without jittering.
If you are able to sleep well consistently (less than 10% bad sleeps) then zero coffee is fine. You just don't need it. But not everyone is so fortunate.
If you are able to sleep well consistently (less than 10% bad sleeps) then zero coffee is fine. You just don't need it. But not everyone is so fortunate.
Recently I got the stomach flu. It was a great opportunity to quit coffee since I pretty much just slept around all day anyway.
Now I just drink a cup of black tea a day. I feel a lot "nicer", but definitely less productive, as expected.
I'm trying to just keep my coffee drinking to Sundays when I work on my projects, and am less likely to get irritated with someone because they don't talk super fast :P
Now I just drink a cup of black tea a day. I feel a lot "nicer", but definitely less productive, as expected.
I'm trying to just keep my coffee drinking to Sundays when I work on my projects, and am less likely to get irritated with someone because they don't talk super fast :P
I love the taste of coffee. Unfortunately I can't drink it as I get a near euphoric high followed by unpleasant hyperactivity and weird anxiety. Seriously. It's so unpleasantly strong for me. Tea I can drink but I don't touch it during work hours.my problem is having too much energy so I drink a lot of red bush tea during work hours. It's very calming.
You are sensitive to the monoamine oxidase inhibitors in coffee. I assume you don’t get the same effects if you consume only pure caffeine?
Am I? I haven't heard of that before. You are right that when drinking tea I don't get the same unpleasant effect. Thanks I'll look this up!
Not even decaf? Yes, the flavour isn’t the same and it still has some caffeine, but I still enjoy the flavour.
Don't laugh but I also find decaf quite strong. I don't know if it's because decaf fools my system somehow or there is another chemical ingredient in decaf that makes me feel weird. But I don't drink decaf either (I do like the taste).
I used to be a purist and disdained decaffeinated.
The I was forced to switch. I can honestly say I do not notice the difference. Decaf tastes just as good.
The I was forced to switch. I can honestly say I do not notice the difference. Decaf tastes just as good.
Standard Starbux cup has like half kilo of sugar. I suspect for most people, it's actually sugar, not coffeine, that wakes them up.
Another anecdote here. Going on decaf was one of the best choices I could do. I've gotten back on caffeine and the palpitations are back for me also.
It makes me wonder: do people in the older generations have the same symptoms but just don't say anything?... Kind of concerning.
Edit: This thread inspired me to get on hot water asap again. Thanks everyone :) Just poured myself some.
It makes me wonder: do people in the older generations have the same symptoms but just don't say anything?... Kind of concerning.
Edit: This thread inspired me to get on hot water asap again. Thanks everyone :) Just poured myself some.
Four years ago I decided for New Years to get myself addicted to caffeine and alcohol. I couldn't get the alcohol to work, but the caffeine has been wonderful. I am quite happy with the effects; it's great stuff. No more afternoon drowsiness, easier to get up in the early AM, etc. For me, it's sweet tea, rather than coffee, though.
I never understood why people go cold-turkey to get off of the coffee addiction. Simply drink less coffee and gradually lower your intake. You can avoid the absolute misery of the withdrawal symptoms this way.
Drink half your intake for a few days. Then halve that amount again. Soon enough you'll have weaned yourself off caffeine without the disruption.
Drink half your intake for a few days. Then halve that amount again. Soon enough you'll have weaned yourself off caffeine without the disruption.
I precisely constrained my usual intake to a known gram amount. Currently I have a clever made with 25g coffee beans. Overdoing it never helps my focus, so I rarely do, exception being if I get a large while traveling, but having a precise does at home really helps keep things from getting out of hand.
A question to the guys who had severe withdrawal symptoms: did you drink it with or without sugar?
I personally don't put sugar into coffee or tea and have quit cold-turkey a few times without any issues, so I wonder if the headache and stuff might be somewhat related to sugar withdrawal, not just caffeine. Ideas?
I personally don't put sugar into coffee or tea and have quit cold-turkey a few times without any issues, so I wonder if the headache and stuff might be somewhat related to sugar withdrawal, not just caffeine. Ideas?
I get withrawal headaches when I cold-turkey quit tea and I drink that with no sugar
I throw a towel over it. Over the years, I learned that a towel keeps the coffee hot for longer.
Aka "Tea Cosy".
Aka "Tea Cosy".
For me, giving up the second cup in the afternoon makes all the difference. With just one cup in the morning, I enjoy quality sleep, reduced jittery and no ache in the blood vessels. A second cup literally destroys my next day, and I would wake up tired, wanting even more coffee.
It seem that people that quit caffeine and having good effects are the ones drinking 6 cups a day. I’ve quit drinking coffee before but I’m drinking 1-2 cups, and all I got was a 2 day headache maybe less urge to drink it. But the difference have not been very profound
I like that he kept a ritual going with the press: using non-caffeinated herbals. I'm thinking about quitting caffeine too. Caffeine plus neuropathy makes very shaky hands, and I don't need ANY extra free-floating anxiety.
Everyone has their own love/hate relationship with caffeine. To each their own.
I switched to decaf and found out it helps me by not having to stop my daily routine. But my days start later and I go to bed earlier. It's true the world runs on caffeine.
The world's GDP would collapse if caffeine went away.
The world's GDP would collapse if caffeine went away.
The only thing I've noticed is caffeine helps my alertness. I'm fine as long as I don't have any after 6pm. I'd say my quality of life is fine, and I have 3 or 4 cups of chai/coffee a day.
You are doing this wrong. Caffeine pill 100mg (one cup of coffee)
Then take L-Theamine and Magnesium.
L-Theamine is the calming agent in tea. Helps with anxiety and jitters. Magnesium help with that too.
Would not take straight caffeine again.
L-Theamine is the calming agent in tea. Helps with anxiety and jitters. Magnesium help with that too.
Would not take straight caffeine again.
I also quit, for me what helped was simply drinking plain hot water instead.
+1 for hot water. Massively underrated. Like so much so I wonder why no one talks about it.
I used to have panic attacks a few times a week. Ever since I quit coffee, it's maybe few times per year. I wasn't a heavy coffee drinker either, just 1 per day on most days, sometimes 2.
One 2-cup moka (not huge) mid-morning and another after lunch is already a little too much for me sometimes. I cannot fathom taking in this amount of coffee, I would be an utter wreck.
I think I can only quit coffee with suicide.
It is impossible.
During my days as a student I managed to be 9 days coffee free.
But I relapsed.
I get all kinds of symptoms.
Coffee is the hardest drug to get clean from.
I get all kinds of symptoms.
Coffee is the hardest drug to get clean from.
Get on a lot of magnesium + thiamine (this is important, they go together). Whether you quit coffee or not, but these two will help you with the withdrawal symptoms (and they are BOTH depleted by regular caffeine intake).
magnesium oxide ok? (cheapest one)
Magnesium Chloride is the cheapest, magnesium oxide has the strongest laxative effect. Take between 5-10 grams per day spread out throughout the day. That will yield around 625-1250 mg elemental magnesium, 1.5 to 3x the RDA, but you likely need to it up from a deficiency. There is no way to overdose (gut rejects it automatically).
I have been told that oxide is not very bioavailable at all, Magnesium Citrate or Glycinate are better.
I asked it before, but can anyone explain why a single cup of (normal strength, not starbucks) coffee easily gives me the jitters, while drinking a 2L bottle of cola does nothing?
Same experience. I didn’t quit completely, but I do limit myself to one cup of coffee in the morning. The rest of my fluid intake is water. I don’t have trouble sleeping anymore.
I quit caffeine for a few years, but I went back to it during the pandemic. It was kind of a substitute for commuting as a trigger that it’s time for work.
I quit caffeine when meet an addicted man and watched how the addiction looks like: he consumed 12-15 cups daily.
Have never looked back and recommend you to do the same.
Have never looked back and recommend you to do the same.
What is the substitute for caffeine you used? Can you share a link to the product to see what it is about? (I'm hoping I can also access it as a French)
Thanks!
Thanks!
I tried many time to stop coffee and tea and for one year now I am sober. I am very happy with my decision. I feel much better and much less anxiety
My own approach is to try to drink 2-3 cups per day at most, but also drink decaf later in the day. I just enjoy the taste of coffee while working.
I just have one large cup of coffee in the morning for the taste and that's about it. I feel bad for this person.
Yeah, I had heart palpitations, it made me to reduce my coffee intake to just three per day and one red bull a week.
The most interesting part for me was “fresh roasted shipped to my door”. Anyone recommend any services?
Author here. I used https://www.drinktrade.com. Lots of variety.
Just get L-Theanin and pair it with coffee – palpitations and panic like feeling will go away.
It is true that it helps, but only for so long. I built up a tolerance for L-Theanin within a couple weeks and it no longer helped.
I chose to quit caffeine entirely and not try to suppress what my body was telling me.
I chose to quit caffeine entirely and not try to suppress what my body was telling me.
You quit coffee, not caffeine per se.
How do coffee drinkers keep track of how much caffeine they drink?
How do coffee drinkers keep track of how much caffeine they drink?
I actually did quit caffeine, but I didn't entirely quit coffee. The alternative I drink (Rasa) has zero caffeine. So I do drink zero caffeine now, outside of a cup of decaf coffee maybe once or twice a week which is negligible. I also don't drink soda.
My point is that coffee is not just caffeine; you quit caffeinated coffee.
To the coffee-addicted here, just curious… Are any of you overweight?
Good.. congrats!
Now fix Janurari into Januari (Sorry my OCD kicked in, cannot unsee)
Now fix Janurari into Januari (Sorry my OCD kicked in, cannot unsee)
So what exactly is the benefit of not drinking coffee? I usually drink 1-2 cups daily (espresso), and don't see it as a big deal. Sometimes I skip it for a day, and I don't feel much differently.
congrats, you're doing it right. For some people it becomes a necessity, and for others it disrupts sleep (even if they won't admit it to themselves or others).
I just buy caffeine pills. Easier! :)
Caffeine is in so many things. Even more interesting is that it's a stimulant that is unique. Every other stimulant is controlled if not illegal. Amphetamines or cocaine for example. The problem is that it has a long history and government would not be successful in controlling it. Even though they clearly would if they could.
How many corporations literally provide coffee to their workers. Even to the point of paying you to drink it on a break? This drug is clearly beneficial to these corps. The increase in focus and productivity is obvious. This boost to cognitive function is what created the age of enlightenment.
How many corporations literally provide coffee to their workers. Even to the point of paying you to drink it on a break? This drug is clearly beneficial to these corps. The increase in focus and productivity is obvious. This boost to cognitive function is what created the age of enlightenment.
I found it kind of weird to find this on a company blog (even though they are the founder)
Caffeine plays with everyone differently, but it's a technique that's worked for me. I'll probably never get a full setup at home as long as I live in a city.