The Man in the Midnight-Blue Six-Ply Italian-Milled Wool Suit(theatlantic.com)
theatlantic.com
The Man in the Midnight-Blue Six-Ply Italian-Milled Wool Suit
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2025/03/gary-shteyngart-bespoke-suit-mens-fashion-self-love/681441/
90 comments
I have a different body but a similar relationship to it as the author. My wife is very stylish and often wears striking jewellery. She gets a lot of compliments and doesn't have to work hard to be at ease socially, whereas for the most part I'd be happy to pass through the world unseen. We've had some modest financial success of late, and I'm resolved to being kinder to myself but also taking myself a little more seriously. I think it's easy to write off fashion as something laboured and fake and innately suspect, especially when you're an introvert and a bit of a nerd living the life of the mind. But I've come to accept that my body has value, a voice of its own, and is part of me that I can't and don't want to be rid of. I'm not really ready for tailored clothing (and I flatter myself it'd be wasteful when I lose all the weight) but I've started dressing better, sports jackets instead of hoodies, shirts instead of t-shirts. For the first time in my life I own more than two pairs of shoes. I am sure I would still look shambolic to anyone with an eye for the details (I can pull off dishevelled academic better than Ivy Style) but I feel so much more confident and relaxed. I no longer feel like I've written off half of myself, and I like the whole a lot more because of that. It was wonderful to read Gary's journey in a similar direction.
I stopped wearing shirts except for semi-formal dinner occasions once or twice a year. I don't want fancy dress pants, I don't want pants with belts at all. I want something soft, slightly elastic around the waist that I can lounge around in, that doesn't feel like it's restrictive of movement.
I dress for comfort, but I do like variety and some colors, not just gym clothes.
This is a horrible problem because the modern approach to clothes production is retarded.
Formal isn't comfortable. Everyday fast fashion isn't comfortable and it's either pointlessly frilly over designed garbage that tries too hard to make a statement or it's generic in the extreme for faceless drones made only for utility values. The third category is a more interesting cut but unsatisfactory quality
I dress for comfort, but I do like variety and some colors, not just gym clothes.
This is a horrible problem because the modern approach to clothes production is retarded.
Formal isn't comfortable. Everyday fast fashion isn't comfortable and it's either pointlessly frilly over designed garbage that tries too hard to make a statement or it's generic in the extreme for faceless drones made only for utility values. The third category is a more interesting cut but unsatisfactory quality
Well made formal clothes are the most comfortable you'll wear. There is some mental discomfort for a while depending on your mindset because, at least for me, I was stuck thinking fancier clothes required fancier demeanor and attitude? Not sure I'm bailing the feeling here but it does go away eventually. I ultimately did drop the everyday formal wear though because well made stuff was expensive and Im pretty active and found myself with a lot of rips and stains on expensive clothing items.
There are some exceptions; IMO "dress" pants are more comfortable than jeans. Details vary within each category, of course.
Nothing's more comfortable than a pair of broken-in jeans that fit you perfectly.
Modern dress pants are often too tight, but with well fitting dress pants it's like you are not wearing any pants at all. For example classic design features like pleats provide extra comfort when sitting down. I don't think I ever seen jeans with such features.
And the lining! Temperature permitting, of course, but having a satin lining to your soft wool pants? It's not far off from pajamas. Of course it's often with some other clothes that are a little unpajamalike, like a stiff collar and a jacket, but a pair of half-lined pants are extremely comfortable.
I touched a clump of Australian wool, and noted how superior my South American sheep was to its antipodean cousin.
https://www.isobaa.com/en-au/blogs/tales-from-the-eweniverse...
Indeed.
And a not insignificant fraction of it comes from one region, Hamilton in Victoria:
“ Sheep grazing and agriculture are the primary industries in the surrounding shire, the area producing as much as 15% of Australia's total wool clip.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamilton,_Victoria
Where you’ll find very well cared for sheep wearing protective coats over their fleece.
And a not insignificant fraction of it comes from one region, Hamilton in Victoria:
“ Sheep grazing and agriculture are the primary industries in the surrounding shire, the area producing as much as 15% of Australia's total wool clip.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamilton,_Victoria
Where you’ll find very well cared for sheep wearing protective coats over their fleece.
Suits like carpets have to be a compromise between fineness and longevity. 21 is probably as fine as weaves strong twill suitable for a modern suit. It's a fucktonne finer than the Harris Tweed in my ten euro jacket I got in cliqnancourt.
You try raising Merino sheep in the Hebrides!
Blackfaces can live all year on the hill, if you get clothes made from their wool, so can you :)
Blackfaces can live all year on the hill, if you get clothes made from their wool, so can you :)
I’m also obligated to laugh at that 21. However New Zealand’s wool industry is a showdown of what it once was, and unfortunately that’s come at the expense of our lakes and rivers. Thanks dairy.
Not to mention the other Antipodean (New Zealand) marino which goes down to 11 microns. 18.5 microns is considered the premium suiting quality and there is not much point in going finer.
It's a real shame that bespoke tailoring has all but died out. These days you have to live in (or near) the largest cities in the world, or financial hubs if you want bespoke service that is local.
Most tailoring houses do travel around, offering trunk shows and such.
I was lucky enough that I had a close relative that worked as a tailor back in the 50s and 60s, so from the first suit I wore was actually a bespoke piece.
When I moved away, and entered the professional workforce, I soon discovered that bespoke suits started at $4k-$5k. I settled with a reputable shop that did made-to-measure for a third, and was happy with the results.
I don't really wear suits (and tailored clothing) too much these days. The world has moved much more into casual and comfy clothes, and the sartorial world is mostly reserved for the hobbyists or wealthy people in conservative (work) fields.
But, still, wearing a full set of perfectly tailored suit, shirt, and shoes feels nothing short but incredible. There should be nothing uncomfortable about it - which is the general critique for people not wanting to wear a suit.
Most tailoring houses do travel around, offering trunk shows and such.
I was lucky enough that I had a close relative that worked as a tailor back in the 50s and 60s, so from the first suit I wore was actually a bespoke piece.
When I moved away, and entered the professional workforce, I soon discovered that bespoke suits started at $4k-$5k. I settled with a reputable shop that did made-to-measure for a third, and was happy with the results.
I don't really wear suits (and tailored clothing) too much these days. The world has moved much more into casual and comfy clothes, and the sartorial world is mostly reserved for the hobbyists or wealthy people in conservative (work) fields.
But, still, wearing a full set of perfectly tailored suit, shirt, and shoes feels nothing short but incredible. There should be nothing uncomfortable about it - which is the general critique for people not wanting to wear a suit.
"These days you have to live in (or near) the largest cities in the world"
I'm not sure exactly what you mean by bespoke tailoring. I've found small shops that will do custom work. They are somewhat rare in the US, just like custom shoe makers, but they do exist outside of the largest cities.
I'm not sure exactly what you mean by bespoke tailoring. I've found small shops that will do custom work. They are somewhat rare in the US, just like custom shoe makers, but they do exist outside of the largest cities.
Also you can get a 3 piece suit custom made in SE asia for $1-500, custom shoes for $50-$100. If your goal is to have a custom wardrobe a plane ticket would save you thousands.
A lot of these guys travel - they book a hotel conference room, you go and pick your fabrics, they take your measurements, and you get your suit in the mail.
Depending on the customs duties.
No duties on what’s in your suitcase.
Not true at all.
"Also, anything you bring back that you did not have when you left the United States must be "declared." For example, you would declare alterations made in a foreign country to a suit you already owned,"
"Also, anything you bring back that you did not have when you left the United States must be "declared." For example, you would declare alterations made in a foreign country to a suit you already owned,"
Thoughts you kicked off...
I imagine myself driving across the country, and arriving at a small town to get gas and lunch. As I eat at the local diner, I become aware that everyone in the town is dressed exceptionally well, better than I am in fact, including the two homeless people outside, sitting in the street.
Turns out this small down of 400 people has such a tailor, and no Walmart, and so even the poorest are dressed quite well, with perfectly fitted suites and clothes.
I imagine myself driving across the country, and arriving at a small town to get gas and lunch. As I eat at the local diner, I become aware that everyone in the town is dressed exceptionally well, better than I am in fact, including the two homeless people outside, sitting in the street.
Turns out this small down of 400 people has such a tailor, and no Walmart, and so even the poorest are dressed quite well, with perfectly fitted suites and clothes.
Not quite the same but reminded me of the Sapeurs in the DRC:
https://www.deoost.com/blog/style-of-the-sapeurs?format=amp
https://www.deoost.com/blog/style-of-the-sapeurs?format=amp
What a lovely article.
For those that don't follow already, Derek Guy (https://x.com/dieworkwear) covers men's clothes in a wonderful way (and is also very funny).
For those that don't follow already, Derek Guy (https://x.com/dieworkwear) covers men's clothes in a wonderful way (and is also very funny).
I second this. Guy is to me today’s foremost communicator and decipherer of the code of men’s fashion.
He got me interested into men's clothing. Another source I follow is https://www.permanentstyle.com
Came here to say this. And he also gives a lot of insight on how men's clothing is made and why it's made that way.
He also regularly gives tips on where to shop and what to look for. I really like the fact that it's not totally focused on bespoke tailoring.
He's also on bluesky for those who do not have a Twitter account: https://bsky.app/profile/dieworkwear.bsky.social
He also regularly gives tips on where to shop and what to look for. I really like the fact that it's not totally focused on bespoke tailoring.
He's also on bluesky for those who do not have a Twitter account: https://bsky.app/profile/dieworkwear.bsky.social
[deleted]
In other words, "Suits make a corporate comeback" ?
https://paulgraham.com/submarine.html
https://paulgraham.com/submarine.html
More like, “Gary has a new novel coming out in July”
Or (and I hate how cynical I've become) "How can I justify buying an outrageously expensive custom-made suit?" Oh yeah, I'll write an article about it, ha ha.
On a less derisive note, a friend and I were riding the JR line in Tokyo when my friend pointed to the hand stitching on the suit of the salaryman (or not? ChatGPT tells me "yakuin" refers to the moire powerful decision-making company employees) standing next to us.
That was a cool thing about public transportation where even the high-flyers travel with gaijin tourists.
On a less derisive note, a friend and I were riding the JR line in Tokyo when my friend pointed to the hand stitching on the suit of the salaryman (or not? ChatGPT tells me "yakuin" refers to the moire powerful decision-making company employees) standing next to us.
That was a cool thing about public transportation where even the high-flyers travel with gaijin tourists.
I think that we are at a "generational inflection point".
I did the whole "it's cool to wear t-shirts to work" startup thing, and now that I'm a little older and the stakes are a bit higher in the office, It does feel a bit disrespectful to look "unserious".
So it's probably a perennial moment: ppl getting older. Maybe I'm boring now.
(Also, died at loss in your footer, and the MD timeline of discovery is cool -- submit it here!)
I did the whole "it's cool to wear t-shirts to work" startup thing, and now that I'm a little older and the stakes are a bit higher in the office, It does feel a bit disrespectful to look "unserious".
So it's probably a perennial moment: ppl getting older. Maybe I'm boring now.
(Also, died at loss in your footer, and the MD timeline of discovery is cool -- submit it here!)
I was all about t-shirts until I had kids. When we went out on restaurant-night (Friday) I started to see myself in how my kids would perceive me — or how they might compare their father to others.
So I started dressing a little less informally.
So I started dressing a little less informally.
This seems more suits-as-fashion than suits-as-uniform.
That article is far more personal than just a PR article. As a struggling dresser I really liked it for that.
Gotta say I wanted to keep reading. How good is Atlantic? Maybe I should sub
> Gotta say I wanted to keep reading. How good is Atlantic? Maybe I should sub
The Atlantic is fantastic and you should subscribe. You might be put off by the tone of some of their political pieces, which tends towards old-fashioned centre right. But as a leftie, I think that a lot of them are insightful even though I regularly disagree with the authors and in any case their long-form articles are excellent. The writing is good and the research is thorough.
The Atlantic is fantastic and you should subscribe. You might be put off by the tone of some of their political pieces, which tends towards old-fashioned centre right. But as a leftie, I think that a lot of them are insightful even though I regularly disagree with the authors and in any case their long-form articles are excellent. The writing is good and the research is thorough.
The writing held me to the end. I think their long form apolitical stuff is amazing.
People disagree about the political/editorial, I think it's classic American centrist but right wing see it as leftist, and left wing see it as establishment.
I totally would wear $20,000 of well made wool 6ply, leather and cotton. Like the author, I'd do it on somebody else's dime. My forays into Japan align strongly to the sense there are many obsessive mercantilist specialists there. The guy with a 2 meter wide stall selling exclusively high end pentode valves in the old akehabera market comes to mind.
I spent a brief time in Beijing with a co worker watching them being fitted for a high end suit. The fabric was just amazing. They keep the salvage showing out on the roll so you can see where it's woven be it Milan or Scotland. I think that experience is why this article resonates: that and getting a charity store "demob" suit recut to fit me in London in the eighties. 1946 vintage double breasted with a slubby thick stripe, £20 to buy and £120 to have fitted (it was destroyed by moths in Brisbane 20 years later)
My highlight of that Beijing trip was buying a beautiful "pleather" designer jacket for my son from the cheaper, fraudulent end of the market. Very nicely made, he wore it into the ground. If you walk away from the stall without bargaining the market trader women pinch you to teach you a lesson. Painful.
People disagree about the political/editorial, I think it's classic American centrist but right wing see it as leftist, and left wing see it as establishment.
I totally would wear $20,000 of well made wool 6ply, leather and cotton. Like the author, I'd do it on somebody else's dime. My forays into Japan align strongly to the sense there are many obsessive mercantilist specialists there. The guy with a 2 meter wide stall selling exclusively high end pentode valves in the old akehabera market comes to mind.
I spent a brief time in Beijing with a co worker watching them being fitted for a high end suit. The fabric was just amazing. They keep the salvage showing out on the roll so you can see where it's woven be it Milan or Scotland. I think that experience is why this article resonates: that and getting a charity store "demob" suit recut to fit me in London in the eighties. 1946 vintage double breasted with a slubby thick stripe, £20 to buy and £120 to have fitted (it was destroyed by moths in Brisbane 20 years later)
My highlight of that Beijing trip was buying a beautiful "pleather" designer jacket for my son from the cheaper, fraudulent end of the market. Very nicely made, he wore it into the ground. If you walk away from the stall without bargaining the market trader women pinch you to teach you a lesson. Painful.
It's Gary Shteyngart, you don't have to sub to the Atlantic to read him. I've zero interest in his late mid-life hobbies of watches and suits but the dude can write. His fiction is fun, for those who are into that sort of thing.
I've zero interest in diving into new (to me) fiction right now but his late mid-life hobbies made for short, enjoyable reading. We're all different, and as Gary might say, you do you.
If you do (like me) like magazine style writing about obsessions, then William Gibson writes well about it regarding ebay bidding on watches but perhaps you prefer reading his books more too?
https://www.watchpaper.com/2015/07/16/william-gibson-on-watc...
If you do (like me) like magazine style writing about obsessions, then William Gibson writes well about it regarding ebay bidding on watches but perhaps you prefer reading his books more too?
https://www.watchpaper.com/2015/07/16/william-gibson-on-watc...
On the subject of fashion, obsessions and magazine writing, this piece is excellent too.
https://www.gq.com/story/buzz-bissinger-shopaholic-gucci-add...
https://www.gq.com/story/buzz-bissinger-shopaholic-gucci-add...
Even those that wooden watch The Peripheral (2022) might still enjoy: https://uniquewatchguide.com/valerii-danevych-wooden-watches...
I don't think I even knew Gibson did random hobby writing, no! I've seen the occasional pic of his drip on twitter - I will definitely not be one but it's nice to know it's at least possible to be a dapper old man dressed in something other than formalwear or whatever was in style in his youth.
I desperately want to deny "dress for success" ever mattterd to me but I'd very much be lying. I've worn suits to fit in, I've worn jackets to project an image, I've dressed down to make a political point. Now, just wear clothes which are comfortable and appropriate to circumstances which admits circumstances can change.
Formal wear has consumed itself. We need sumptuary laws back.
Formal wear has consumed itself. We need sumptuary laws back.
> Formal wear has consumed itself. We need sumptuary laws back.
I mean, if anything, it’s mostly dead; formal wear is _far_ less of a thing than it was a few decades ago.
I mean, if anything, it’s mostly dead; formal wear is _far_ less of a thing than it was a few decades ago.
God, how I miss the centrists.
Isn't this time to write the center cannot hold things fall apart
Ummm..."the occasional MSNBC appearance"
It's interesting because the left hates the Atlantic because of its neoliberal, capitalist-class owners that spawned things like 20 years of cheerleading for wars in the middle east and hiring David Frum "axis of evil" types to be their senior editor.
And the right hates them because of its puritanical coast-obsessed effeminacy that reads like a gossip paper with a few more fiver-dollar words.
But still they've lasted 150 years now so must be doing something right.
And the right hates them because of its puritanical coast-obsessed effeminacy that reads like a gossip paper with a few more fiver-dollar words.
But still they've lasted 150 years now so must be doing something right.
Roughly parallel to reasons for hating/revering Apple..
Not surprising, now that Powell Jobs is that very "capitalist-class owner"
Not surprising, now that Powell Jobs is that very "capitalist-class owner"
>Through [The] Emerson [Collective], Powell Jobs owns The Atlantic and a stake in Axios.
A tidbit that might help to connect the dots between the political & the apolitical. Or not.
A tidbit that might help to connect the dots between the political & the apolitical. Or not.
This was a wonderful read and matched some of my own experiences with becoming more familiar with mens fashion allowing me to create an outward reflection of myself that helped me to build up a respect for my own body and a more general sense of aesthetic I had previously lacked.
While I don't have so fine a suit as the author, a few years back I had the pleasure of having a bespoke suit made and a set of shirts to accompany it. In many ways it was a life-altering experience for the better.
While I don't have so fine a suit as the author, a few years back I had the pleasure of having a bespoke suit made and a set of shirts to accompany it. In many ways it was a life-altering experience for the better.
If you've not read Absurdistan or Lake Success or any of Shteyngart's other novels, then you really should. He's one of our best living authors.
Still trying to finds words for this, but living in the San Francisco Bay Area and dealing with a lot of tech developers it is shocking how many people have great tattoos, great clothes, great jewelry, great accessories, and yet all it takes is a glance to see that they themselves have bodies atrophied by a lifetime of chair sitting and inactivity. Go for a walk and wear a ripped up tee and you might look better?
As Rick Owens put it:
Working out is modern couture. No outfit is going to make you look or feel as good as having a fit body. Buy less clothing and go to the gym instead.
Working out is modern couture. No outfit is going to make you look or feel as good as having a fit body. Buy less clothing and go to the gym instead.
As a fellow short man, I will have to second his feeling at ease in Asian clothing stores.
Far more casual than the suit he describes, which obviously being made bespoke can be made anywhere (if I had the money, it’d have to be cifonelli in Paris) their repro sportswear is excellent and actually cut short enough not to drown the body.
Far more casual than the suit he describes, which obviously being made bespoke can be made anywhere (if I had the money, it’d have to be cifonelli in Paris) their repro sportswear is excellent and actually cut short enough not to drown the body.
I have to admit I'm jealous of such a stylish suite.
Want to feel at ease? Just get an OTR suit, maybe have it tailored if it doe5snt fit decently, and get a flask to go in it.
In my experience there is hardly a garment less comfortable than a suit.
Ha!, that’s interesting – my experience is exactly the opposite.
I will note my surprise when I learned that this was my preference!
I did have to find the right material to fit between me and the environment. I live in a cool climate but am always running a little too hot for indoors. For me the most comfortable clothing is a suit of medium-fine and somewhat “porous” wool. Very lightweight for the warmth it gives outside. Breathes well inside and I can take off the jacket to cool down. Lightweight shirt to be able to bleed off heat.
I do not at all enjoy wearing cotton or synthetic suits.
The fit is important of course. I’m blessed with haphazardly fitting well into off-the-shelf suits… if I can mix and match the pants one size up or down to the jacket. –It’s kind of random which way it goes.
Then I take a size smaller motorcycle gloves than the similarly-sized runway model would — and a size bigger dirt bike helmet. The reader will note that I’m not at all perfectly shaped :)
I will note my surprise when I learned that this was my preference!
I did have to find the right material to fit between me and the environment. I live in a cool climate but am always running a little too hot for indoors. For me the most comfortable clothing is a suit of medium-fine and somewhat “porous” wool. Very lightweight for the warmth it gives outside. Breathes well inside and I can take off the jacket to cool down. Lightweight shirt to be able to bleed off heat.
I do not at all enjoy wearing cotton or synthetic suits.
The fit is important of course. I’m blessed with haphazardly fitting well into off-the-shelf suits… if I can mix and match the pants one size up or down to the jacket. –It’s kind of random which way it goes.
Then I take a size smaller motorcycle gloves than the similarly-sized runway model would — and a size bigger dirt bike helmet. The reader will note that I’m not at all perfectly shaped :)
What about your shirt, you don't go with cotton?
I think I’d feel better in something other than cotton but I haven’t come across anything. Just lucked out once when I needed a suit and grab the seemingly lightweight shirts off the rack; Have yet to get serious, you know?
Kmart suit Yes. But in general whole point of suit was comfort, just look at pictures of factory workers from 150 years ago, every single working man in a suit. Also google Van Damme suit kick
A $20,000 suit? A suit hand tailored to (in his case) his tiny bottom, including matching braces?
I wouldn't be able to relax for fear of damaging or soiling the suit. Cats, dogs, children, food, bushes and trees, mud, not spot-clean metro cars - everything is an enemy.
Having just stalked his Instagram page to see what other watches he owns - I don't think he needs to worry.
Buy second hand! It's much easier to wear a $1000 coat to a bar knowing you only paid $125 for it!
This is how I feel about my fursuit. The thing should just about be kept in a humidity controlled display cabinet.
Imo wool trousers are more comfortable than jeans. It's like wearing pyjamas.
A good fit and quality fabric make a lot of difference. Granted, sweatpants and a hoodie are still more comfortable.
A suit that (sic) suits your morphology and isn't made on the cheap is very comfortable.
get it tailored and report back :)
I have bought a number of tailored suits, albeit never bespoke.
Fitted worse than off-the-rack. I figured you need to keep adjusting the measurement at your tailor until you find the perfect fit, which is too much effort for me.
Or find an outstanding professional, which is just too expensive.
Fitted worse than off-the-rack. I figured you need to keep adjusting the measurement at your tailor until you find the perfect fit, which is too much effort for me.
Or find an outstanding professional, which is just too expensive.
[deleted]
[flagged]
Could you please stop posting unsubstantive comments and flamebait? You've unfortunately been doing it repeatedly. It's not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for.
If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful.
If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful.
[deleted]
cubefox(2)
The title is a spin on “the wonderful ice cream suit” by Ray Bradbury, which similarly had transformative effects on its wearers.
https://www.saturdayeveningpost.com/wp-content/uploads/satev...
https://www.saturdayeveningpost.com/wp-content/uploads/satev...
Is it? The [person] in [x garment] is a pretty common title.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Man_in_the_Brown_Suit (1924)
or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Man_in_the_White_Suit or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Man_in_the_Gray_Flannel_Su... (from the 50s) or even https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Woman_in_White_(novel)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Man_in_the_Brown_Suit (1924)
or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Man_in_the_White_Suit or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Man_in_the_Gray_Flannel_Su... (from the 50s) or even https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Woman_in_White_(novel)
I took it as a reference to The Man in the Gray Flannel Suit.
I recommend The Man in the Thick Lead Suit by Daniel Lang (1954). About the US atomic program, written before people got all uptight about radiation.